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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Stonewall at it again - no legal sense

62 replies

IslandsAround · 02/05/2025 14:32

on LinkedIn Stonewall posted the following nonsense -

The FA and Scottish FA have announced they are banning transgender women from women’s football, following the Supreme Court ruling.

It's important to remember that the ruling hasn’t gone through the parliamentary process yet and organisations should wait to see how statutory guidance is changed before making policy changes.

These announcements will be deeply upsetting for trans people, especially when they’re made with no clear plan for how they’ll still be included, and treated with dignity and respect.

Sport should be a place that is safe for all and where everyone feels welcome. Through our #RainbowLaces campaign, we know just how vital inclusion is.

Their total lack of basic legal comprehension is bonkers

OP posts:
DragonRunor · 02/05/2025 17:14

LonginesPrime · 02/05/2025 16:42

Sex Matters has a handy list here.

Good grief, that’s quite a list! Maybe we do the same as the NHS investigation thread, take a few each and write to them highlighting the illegal nature of Stonewall’s advice (and the ‘pyramid selling’ nature of the Stonewall Champions awards)
Just think how all that money could be being used to make life better for people who really need it :(

ItisntOver · 02/05/2025 18:14

misscockerspaniel · 02/05/2025 17:12

Behind-closed-doors shenanigans by the likes of Stonewall in cahoots with politicians and civil servants got us into this mess. May be they have revealed their sleight of hand, for they appear to expect the judgement of the Supreme Court to be overridden, nullified, by parliamentarians. I wonder what they know or have planned. Whatever it is, we can be sure that it will be cloaked in secrecy.

GLP favours that strategy from the most recent blog post. “We have plans for the money. And integral to those plans is that we won’t tell you what they are nor be held accountable for what we spend. Trust our behind closed doors policy.”

IslandsAround · 02/05/2025 19:26

I see Sex Matters has offered to report them to the Charity Commission if they don’t with draw the advice. Well done to them!

OP posts:
Iamnotalemming · 02/05/2025 19:45

Well done Sex Matters.

I know I shouldn't be, but I am still shocked that:

A. Stonewall is wilfully misstating the law, and
B. That it is complaining about TIM not being treated with dignity and inclusion because they are being excluded from women's football. What about the dignity, fairness and safety of women?

SquirrelSoShiny · 02/05/2025 20:10

Brilliant! Well done Sex Matters! Flowers

mrshoho · 02/05/2025 22:18

Good night Stonewall. Get yourselves to bed. The game is well and truly up.

EasternStandard · 02/05/2025 22:24

IslandsAround · 02/05/2025 19:26

I see Sex Matters has offered to report them to the Charity Commission if they don’t with draw the advice. Well done to them!

Amazing.

Have they responded? I’d love to know what they say when they do

Lovelysummerdays · 02/05/2025 22:47

Well done sex matters . I think it’s really important not to let them carry on with the we don’t understand what can this possibly mean bullshit.

To be followed by let’s lobby for new legislation as it’s all so confusing bullshit as surely we didn’t mean to erase the existence of of the most marginalised group ever.

If they hadn’t rinsed the government for so many millions I’d wonder if Stonewall were funded by Russians / Chinese or the hard right looking to create dissent in society.

Datun · 02/05/2025 22:59

Well done to sex matters. I really like that, despite the ruling, they're firing on all cylinders holding these people accountable

ahagwearsapointybonnet · 03/05/2025 00:40

Some relevant history, I think:
After the EqA was passed, the EHRC drafted the initial 3 Codes of Practice, giving guidance on applying it (which have some legal weight, as I understand it, though less than the Act itself, so if they conflict, the Act is the ultimate authority): one for employers, one for services, public functions & associations, and one on equal pay.

However the documents they eventually produced in 2011 did NOT just reflect and explain what the Act says, but (esp. the employers' and service providers' Codes) included several simply incorrect/made-up sections claiming e.g. that "transsexual people" should be treated "according to the gender in which they present", allowed to use opposite-sex changing rooms, etc etc. At the time it seems the EHRC was heavily influenced by activists, and it was a Stonewall champion for many years (though not sure exactly when they joined; they also had an ex-Stonewall CEO as Chair for several years, though that was later!). This incorrect guidance was of course very influential on employers and service providers in writing their policies, & was widely quoted by TRAs to "prove" they had a right to use opposite-sex facilities, etc.

By 2022 though, after a number of court cases relating to sex and gender, and the drafting of new EHRC guidance on single-sex provision that ended up conflicting significantly with the CoPs, the EHRC accepted that they were "out of date, confusing, and out of line with the Equality Act and recent case law", as Sex Matters put it, and agreed to review and rewrite them. (The new Employers' one came out a while back, & the new draft Services one just before the FWS verdict, but will now need some more updating).

Presumably, having managed to influence the drafting of the previous Codes to the extent that they ended up not actually reflecting the law at all, the activists are now hoping they can pull off the same trick twice, and generate new guidance that gives them what they want, regardless what the EqA says. So no wonder they're telling everyone to ignore the actual law, & wait for the new guidance!
Luckily though, there is now a lot more scrutiny to ensure the new Codes, & any other new guidance, are 100% in line with the EqA and SC ruling this time. Plus we have the formidable Baroness Faulkner heading the EHRC now. So however much they scream and stamp, they're not likely to get away with that again!

fromorbit · 03/05/2025 02:12

This story now all over the media.

Stonewall have messed up again.

Either they continue to deny the law, but this time with a real threat of serious trouble.

OR

They admit they were wrong and that law right now says women get single sex spaces which wrecks their status with the TAs.

Stonewall charity status under threat unless it respects trans ruling
Women’s rights activists warn controversial campaign group of Charity Commission move over ‘unlawful’ advice
https://archive.is/MNekG#selection-2119.4-2123.112

Whatever happens the crisis continues and they lose status and money.

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