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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

British teens - especially girls - the unhappiest in Europe

99 replies

RedToothBrush · 29/08/2024 10:03

The charity said its findings reveal a 'deeply worrying picture around wellbeing and happiness' among teenagers, adding: 'Alarm bells are ringing.'

A quarter of British 15-year-olds report having poor life satisfaction, the highest rate amongst 27 European countries polled and almost 20 percentage points higher than in Holland.
Among UK teenage girls, almost a third report low life satisfaction, compared to one in five across Europe, the charity found.

British girls aged ten to 15 are 'significantly less happy' with their life, appearance, family and their school than the average boy, with life satisfaction scores declining in girls but stable among boys.

The Children's Society said it is 'particularly troubling' that the gap between boys and girls is widening. Between 2015 and 2022 happiness levels among 15-year-old girls in the UK have also declined more sharply than the European average.
Data from the Good Childhood Report found that 22.6 per cent of girls reported being unhappy with their appearance in 2021/22, compared to 9.2 per cent of boys.

One teenager said their peers often feel they need to 'change' themselves to be accepted, because people won't 'acknowledge you or look at you' otherwise. They said people had to 'look a certain way to be accepted'.

The report said that the dissatisfaction relates to a range of factors including food deprivation, NHS waiting lists for mental health services, bullying in schools and levels of physical activity – with the UK having the fifth highest rate of pupils reporting no physical exercise.

It also found that the 'endemic' level of school absence in some age groups has a 'dramatic' effect on attainment and resulting life satisfaction.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13790299/British-teenagers-unhappy-Europe-quarter-15-year-olds-UK.html

British teenagers found to be the most unhappy in Europe

British teenagers are the most unhappy in Europe, say researchers. And the problem among girls is getting worse at an alarming rate, the Children's Society warns in a report.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13790299/British-teenagers-unhappy-Europe-quarter-15-year-olds-UK.html

OP posts:
WarriorN · 30/08/2024 14:12

Causes are highly likely to be multi factorial

TheCadoganArms · 30/08/2024 14:16

WarriorN · 30/08/2024 11:34

I'm having some issues with internet but the report is from 2023 and entitled Parkwatch: Make Space For Girls

Have to confess, having just read the report they could have done a better job of presentation, it looks like a pre GCSE project.

MrsTerryPratchett · 30/08/2024 14:18

I don't think it's fair to say boys take up all the space. There has to be more to it than that.

I once watched a boy take one of the footballs away from the huge football area at DD's school, and start kicking it against a wall girls were sitting against, chatting. The girls moved.

Weirdly I saw almost the exact same thing in SE Asia with the foot/badminton thing, and Central Asia with a form of hacky sack. Girls getting hit in the head and face with flying objects propelled by boys.

What girls wanted at my school, and at DD's school is a large grassy area, with sun and shade, to walk around, chat, make daisy chains, run, play and so on. But the large grassy areas are inevitably covered with boys playing football. Which stops girls using them.

Needanewname42 · 30/08/2024 14:25

WarriorN · 30/08/2024 14:11

Do girls want to play outdoors?
Why do girls not want to play outdoors?

These are good questions and it won't be the parks that are the full issue re girls going there, though it was noted that the design of parks was a factor

Re skirts and uniform there was research on this and skirts are important for some girls.

Most of the girls wear shorts under theirs at my kids' school

I'm guessing that's primary kids.

The secondary girls are wearing their skirts ridiculously short, black opaque tights, maybe yes. But no way are they wearing shorts under those skirts. I swear I've seen longer sports skirts. They must be rolling them up or something.

Zet1 · 30/08/2024 14:26

Needanewname42 · 30/08/2024 14:07

I don't think it's fair to say boys take up all the space. There has to be more to it than that.

Do girls want to play outdoors?
Why do girls not want to play outdoors?

Maybe it's time to ban school skirts. You don't see college or university students with skirts that barely cover their bum. They are all in leggings and jeans.

Even in the 90s the girls stopped physical games by about P6 (Yr5) the boys would be playing football while the girls wandered slowly round the school. And in secondary the boys continued to play football while the girls loitered in the school corridors.

Yes, I think we also need to look at how society encourage girls to do "girly things" which often means not being outdoors.

username44416 · 30/08/2024 14:29

Zet1 · 30/08/2024 14:26

Yes, I think we also need to look at how society encourage girls to do "girly things" which often means not being outdoors.

There was a thread from someone asking what things to do with her young daughter. Suggestions were very sedentary such as face packs, nail painting, jewellery making, crafts.

Needanewname42 · 30/08/2024 14:32

What girls wanted at my school, and at DD's school is a large grassy area, with sun and shade, to walk around, chat, make daisy chains, run, play and so on.

That's the issue sitting around chatting making daisy chains isn't exactly being active.

Why are girls not wanting to be active? As a small over crowded, wet island you'd be laughed out the committee room if you were to suggest, "we leave a large grass area for girls to sit and pick daisy's"

MrsTerryPratchett · 30/08/2024 14:34

Needanewname42 · 30/08/2024 14:32

What girls wanted at my school, and at DD's school is a large grassy area, with sun and shade, to walk around, chat, make daisy chains, run, play and so on.

That's the issue sitting around chatting making daisy chains isn't exactly being active.

Why are girls not wanting to be active? As a small over crowded, wet island you'd be laughed out the committee room if you were to suggest, "we leave a large grass area for girls to sit and pick daisy's"

Why did you ignore, "walk', "run" and "play"? And yes, you would be laughed out, because girls aren't important. Hence the above documented unhappiness.

And activity is one aspect of mental health. Social activities and play, even daisy chains, are important for health.

Considering the state of most British men, football isn't making them healthy.

Waitingfordoggo · 30/08/2024 14:41

camelfinger · 30/08/2024 05:49

It is my perception (has always been, even before phones) that teenagers in Europe seem more like children than teenagers in the UK. I can’t put my finger on it, but if you see big groups of foreign schoolchildren in London, they are dressed more casually and still seem to be in school mode. I’m currently in western Europe on holiday and don’t recall seeing girls here in heavy makeup, lashes and the long wavy hair like is common to see in the UK.

I know what you mean and have observed this in some countries in Europe. However I’ve just come back from Norway where I expected to see very fresh-faced outdoorsy teen girls but most of the girls I spotted in town on the Saturday had full, heavy make up, lots of fake tan and identikit short black skirts- it was like a uniform. There was a music festival on that day so perhaps this was their ‘going out look’ but it surprised me nonetheless as I had the perception Brit girls were more into all that than their European counterparts. What I didn’t see was much individuality- no goths, emos or punks whereas those styles still seem to exist for some British youths. They also don’t seem to have any ‘roadmen’ there so that was a plus 😂

TheCadoganArms · 30/08/2024 14:49

MrsTerryPratchett · 30/08/2024 14:34

Why did you ignore, "walk', "run" and "play"? And yes, you would be laughed out, because girls aren't important. Hence the above documented unhappiness.

And activity is one aspect of mental health. Social activities and play, even daisy chains, are important for health.

Considering the state of most British men, football isn't making them healthy.

Considering the state of most British men, football isn't making them healthy.

Not all men exercise regularly. One would assume that the men playing regular football (or rugby, hockey etc) i.e. training say twice a week with a competitive match at weekends are probably fitter then your average man who does nothing.

MsGoodenough · 30/08/2024 14:58

Just come back from a holiday in northern Spain. All others on the beaches were Spanish. I'd say 50% of the women (across all ages groups) were topless and all kids under 4 were naked. I think growing up around this seeing all natural bodies as nothing to be ashamed of must make a big difference for girls. (I also agree social media is the biggest culprit).

WarriorN · 30/08/2024 15:03

@Needanewname42 it was here, commissioned by the gov, by let clothes be clothes which came from mumsnet

Let Clothes Be Clothes School Uniform report for DfE www.mumsnet.com/Talk/feminism/4288828-Let-Clothes-Be-Clothes-School-Uniform-report-for-DfE

However, I can't seem to get the link to open now sadly

WarriorN · 30/08/2024 15:06

It was mostly about allowing school uniform to me more gender neutral for girls, citing less ability to be active, whilst allowing girls to wear skirts if needed. Some prefer skirts and tights during periods etc

This is an article about it https://www.bigissuenorth.com/comment/2023/03/we-shouldnt-skirt-the-question-of-what-school-children-should-wear-says-antonia-charlesworth/

wonders if Antonia is related to Shelly Charlesworth

MrsTerryPratchett · 30/08/2024 15:11

WarriorN · 30/08/2024 11:37

I just read DD the study you posted and she said what I said below, girls want a grassy area with no ball games to walk, chat, sit, play and hang out.

@WarriorN you may have started something. DD wants to take it to her school to discuss it... oh dear, I'm that parent again.

EmeraldRoulette · 30/08/2024 15:36

Areas with no ball games would be brilliant. I still remember boys aggressively encroaching on areas where groups of girls were trying to hang at break time. kick the ball at us, we scatter, then we ended up in the staff car park and got told off. We just wanted peace for 15 mins.

I hope it’s okay to comment as a nonparent.

I’ve actually had chats around these issues with three teenagers in the last month. One of them is my goddaughter who obviously I know well. The others are neighbours and we have random chats in the communal garden on sunny days - at which times I can’t help noticing they seem like they really want to have a chat. I’m not sure how much real person chatting they get on a summer evening.

the overall vibe I get is internet culture, social media etc is awful for them and affects real life and they are forced to declare allegiance to certain beliefs and positions. The appearance thing certainly existed when I was a teenager but the politics is new.

I’m not surprised to see this study. I am surprised that it’s taken so long for books like Jonathan Haidt and Abigail Shrier to come out. Because Internet culture being incredibly damaging to teens is just screaming the obvious isn’t it? But maybe not - because my goddaughter’s parents weren’t concerned about it at all when she was younger.

Do other European countries pathologise normal emotions as much as we seem to in the UK and the US? Basically, I can think of 1 million reasons why teenage girls and teenagers generally may be very unhappy.

And to be honest, some of that feeds into why young adults and older adults are unhappy, in my humble opinion. But I’m not a parent so my god daughter is my only real window into this stuff.

Interesting to read PP comments about different views on physical touch in Europe. Also the poster who mentioned about buses, yeah that’s gotta be an issue. There’s not a lot going on around here that’s accessible without a car. This puts a lot of pressure on parents as well of course.

there are so many reasons but it needs adults to get back to adulting in order to be dealt with.

isn’t there a movement for smartphone free schools now?

ArabellaScott · 30/08/2024 15:38

From my DD: 'half the girls in my year play football'.

Hearteningly, from a quick chat, access to outdoors doesn't seem to be too much of an issue at our (primary) school. It has always been pretty good at egalitarian treatment of all pupils.

ArabellaScott · 30/08/2024 15:39

I will not be surprised if that changes in secondary, however.

Londonmummy66 · 30/08/2024 15:39

Part of the problem is also boys watching porn and the misogynistic nonsense from the likes of Andrew Tate and the way that impacts on their attitudes to the girls around them. The everyone's invited survey a few years ago was truly shocking.

username44416 · 30/08/2024 15:41

Londonmummy66 · 30/08/2024 15:39

Part of the problem is also boys watching porn and the misogynistic nonsense from the likes of Andrew Tate and the way that impacts on their attitudes to the girls around them. The everyone's invited survey a few years ago was truly shocking.

Edited

I'd be interested to know if boys aren't watching porn in the other countries.

Londonmummy66 · 30/08/2024 15:43

username44416 · 30/08/2024 15:41

I'd be interested to know if boys aren't watching porn in the other countries.

No idea but they might get a bit less of the likes of Andrew Tate if they aren't native English speakers. It all has a big negative impact on the girls though - being scored out of 10 out loud by the boys when they get on the bus to school etc.

WarriorN · 30/08/2024 15:43

Bravo miniMrsTP!

I've got a letter ready to go that quotes it to my son's school.

They ban shorts for everyone; I've made lots of points about the girls wearing shorts under their uniform thus doubling costs and how important it is that girls are active. They have to choose trousers like the boys, who would also prefer shorts to play games in. Possibly not going to be an issue next term as there's been so many parents complaining so I'm waiting to see...

WarriorN · 30/08/2024 15:45

From what I have seen football is on the up amongst girls. Impact of the lionesses! The lower school now have alternating days for boys and girls to play on the yard which started last autumn.

I'm a send teacher; we don't have many girls but I've also noticed the few we have are more interested in football now.

QuickMember · 30/08/2024 15:51

coxesorangepippin · 30/08/2024 01:35

Why are girls being so petty about appearances? Do you have to tick all the beauty standards list to fit in? Brows, lashes, nails, hair, clothing, figure?

^

Er, this isn't new. It was exactly like that in the 90s when I was growing up.

Yes it’s now new. Social media has worsened it but I remember horrendous bullying at school over appearance. Not only by girls. I don’t know what the answer is except I’m actually not that surprised by the results.

QuickMember · 30/08/2024 16:04

Sorry I meant to say NOT new (what an idiot!)

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