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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Rachel Meade, Social Worker, being suspended for 'transphobic' Facebook postss

420 replies

MidCenturyClegs · 13/01/2022 14:58

A social worker, Rachel Meade, is in the process of challenging Social Work England - their professional regulatory body - as she believes she may have discriminated against her due to gender critical beliefs.

This is because during the GRA consultation, she shared posts on her private FB page, from FPFW, WPUK & Standing for Women, among others. These were being secretly screenshot by an ex colleague who then sent these to Social Work England, claiming that the posts were from groups who were discriminatory in nature, transphobic and who wanted to remove trans rights.

SWE decided that this was the case and sanctioned her, leading her employer to investigate her for gross misconduct. They placed a public Fitness to practice warning sanction on her record for a year. She has been suspended by her employer as a result of Social Work England's decision and will be facing a disciplinary process which she has been told may end in her dismissal.

She is taking both Social Work England and her employer to a tribunal; this is a really important case as if she wins, it will clarify in law that not only are employers bound to protect gender critical beliefs under EA2010, but Regulatory bodies are bound by it too.

This will mean that all regulatory bodies will have to recognise that the gender critical beliefs of their registrants/members are protected in law. This will cover social work, healthcare & law as well as any other areas covered by regulatory bodies so will have far reaching effects.

I have heard that she may be setting up a crowdfunder but obviously this is not the place to advertise that, but if people wish to donate should be easy to find.
Just saw that the Times have covered this too.

twitter.com/EmilieCCole/status/1481638709724270593?s=20

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Lovelyricepudding · 14/01/2022 22:57

It was also noted that this person had tried to engage/discuss but RM blocked her.

I wonder what the tone of the posts were that lead Rachel to block them?

Lovelyricepudding · 14/01/2022 23:01

I think it's important to be sceptical when discussing possible safeguarding risks don't you? You can't just take someone's word for it.

So you would agree with Rachel that you cannot take the word of a man that they are not seeking to exploit transwomen status for neferious reasons?

MrBIobby · 14/01/2022 23:02

I wonder what the tone of the posts were that lead Rachel to block them?

Yes I wonder too... 🤔

PostGradStudentSW · 14/01/2022 23:06

@barleybadminton

*She'd locked her FB account to friends so it wasn't widely accessible to the public

So she now claims yet strangely there is no mention of that in the Case Examiner's report, and we know she appears to lie, even to regulators. So I'm afraid I'd take all her claims with a pinch of salt from now on - as will the courts I expect.

I think your conclusions are a stretch here.

We don't know that she lied. She may have reflected (good practice) and come to a different perspective or she may have based her original view on a premise she later found was incorrect.

There is also a lot "missing" from the report.

70 allegations but very few are detailed and to be fair very limited inclusions on her defence (2 paragraphs).

The relevance of her FB being private is an interesting aspect of this case and I do think that warrants "sunlight".

Simultaneously I appreciate your point that if a fellow SW has information that they believe means another is in breach of the COP then they have a duty to report it.

Again what's unclear here is if that person was a practicing SW.

RM refers to them as a former colleague and the report as a member of the public.

So ambiguous if that person was a practicing SW.

What's very worrying is the concept that SW's can't talk about controversial topics amongst themselves for fear of being reported by each other.

Debate and discourse are vital in challenging our perceptions and evolving our understanding and practice.

That's not going to happen if we are all in fear of "wrong think" and can have very serious consequences if the requirement to be "on message" becomes a higher priority than safeguarding - as has been a factor concluded from from some serious case reviews.

MargaritaPie · 15/01/2022 02:34

IMO it makes zero difference if the person who reported her was on her Facebook friends list and her profile was set to friends-only.

It's her responsibility who she has on her Facebook and whether she has a FB account at all.

Needmoresleep · 15/01/2022 08:10

Ahhh yes let’s silence women….

Don’t share your views, even with your friends.

Maggie, you never fail.

Ploppy1322 · 15/01/2022 09:07

MidCenturyClegs

Barely "Reades facebook page was not private according to the findings of Social Work England. Any of the families she worked with could have found these posts quite easily."

Can you prove that? It's my mis-understanding that these were on her private facebook page and it was a 'friend' that took screenshots of everything she shared. Please prove otherwise?

Facebook pages are not private. There is no evidence anywhere I can see that the posts could not have been seen by the general public and Social Work England's findings were based on the fact that had these posts been seen by both trans people and other members of the public they would be seens as derogatory and discriminatory.

So we punish people for what MIGHT have happened now, so if you nearly (but don't) hit another car when driving you should be prosecuted because you could have caused an accident? Is there any evidence at all that any of her clients or any trans people actually saw them and were adversely affected?

RepentMotherfucker · 15/01/2022 09:12

@MargaritaPie

IMO it makes zero difference if the person who reported her was on her Facebook friends list and her profile was set to friends-only.

It's her responsibility who she has on her Facebook and whether she has a FB account at all.

Stasi.

At one point I think something like 1 in 3 East Germand was reporting in friends family and neighbours for the Stasi.

That is generally thought to have been a bad thing but I can see who here would have been at the front of the recruiting queue Hmm

Needmoresleep · 15/01/2022 09:28

So we punish people for what MIGHT have happened

I am assuming that some posters here would also argue that a SW should not have a real life conversation with a friend because that could be overheard.

The entitlement is astonishing. Why do Maggiepie and Barley repeatedly appear to believe they have the right to disrupt and control women’s conversation. Perhaps they could tell us.

BettyFilous · 15/01/2022 09:47

You know what’s really interesting about Rachel’s Crowdjustice appeal? Around 50% of the contributor-commenters are men and you can tell from their comments they get it. The wider population are waking up to this and they are as affronted by it as feminists. Same in the Times comments, the below the line commenters in the NY Times article posted in another thread, the Lia Thomas articles. There are donations from Australia to Rachel’s appeal. The push back against the TRAs’ massive overreach and grab for women’s rights has started. 🙂

Morning Barley, Margarita and co! 👋 Thanks for all your fundraising efforts and the important job you do in bringing more women on side.

MrBIobby · 15/01/2022 09:52

That is generally thought to have been a bad thing but I can see who here would have been at the front of the recruiting queue

Yes it's quite a shock to realise so many of these personality types still walk amongst us. Chilling really. History didn't teach them anything.

MidCenturyClegs · 15/01/2022 10:17

@BettyFilous

You know what’s really interesting about Rachel’s Crowdjustice appeal? Around 50% of the contributor-commenters are men and you can tell from their comments they get it. The wider population are waking up to this and they are as affronted by it as feminists. Same in the Times comments, the below the line commenters in the NY Times article posted in another thread, the Lia Thomas articles. There are donations from Australia to Rachel’s appeal. The push back against the TRAs’ massive overreach and grab for women’s rights has started. 🙂

Morning Barley, Margarita and co! 👋 Thanks for all your fundraising efforts and the important job you do in bringing more women on side.

"Morning Barley, Margarita and co! 👋 Thanks for all your fundraising efforts and the important job you do in bringing more women on side."

Loving it, Betty! Yes, you certainly can tell who are the members of the Stasi versus the women posting here. And possibly even determine the sex of the former. "Get back in your box and don't have any opinion your filthy women" etc.

Just dropping this here:

www.washingtonpost.com/news/retropolis/wp/2017/11/10/night-of-terror-the-suffragists-who-were-beaten-and-tortured-for-seeking-the-vote/*
*

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MrBIobby · 15/01/2022 10:33

That link seems to be broken. Has it been removed 🙀

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MidCenturyClegs · 15/01/2022 10:38

In a heated debate on Twitter the other day someone called me 't3rfragette'. They didn't actually realise that some feminists might take that as a compliment. Lol. When I pointed it out the TRA quickly deleted it. But it made my day!

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MrBIobby · 15/01/2022 10:40

@MidCenturyClegs

In a heated debate on Twitter the other day someone called me 't3rfragette'. They didn't actually realise that some feminists might take that as a compliment. Lol. When I pointed it out the TRA quickly deleted it. But it made my day!
I like that. Time to claim that word.
BernardBlackMissesLangCleg · 15/01/2022 10:43

fascinating article @MidCenturyClegs

I can just imagine the @MargaritaPie 's and @barleybadminton 's of the time, talking down those women

'well, there's no smoke without fire, why are they in prison?'
'their actions are unpatriotic, they should wait until the war is over'
'is it really reasonable for women to demand the vote now?'

MrBIobby · 15/01/2022 10:59

Thanks midcenturyclegs. That is a fascinating article.

MidCenturyClegs · 15/01/2022 10:59

@BernardBlackMissesLangCleg

fascinating article *@MidCenturyClegs*

I can just imagine the @MargaritaPie 's and @barleybadminton 's of the time, talking down those women

'well, there's no smoke without fire, why are they in prison?'
'their actions are unpatriotic, they should wait until the war is over'
'is it really reasonable for women to demand the vote now?'

Indeed. This also struck as particularly relevant given HoL debate this week (sorry to derail slightly but I suppose this conversation is after all about modern-day witch hunts)
Rachel Meade, Social Worker, being suspended for 'transphobic' Facebook postss
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MidCenturyClegs · 15/01/2022 11:27

This is for you, Rachel, if you're there.

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PlayYouLikeAShark · 15/01/2022 12:25

She agreed with their findings and said, "I feel that I may have been swayed by the mistaken view of other prominent feminists who felt that promoting transgender rights would impede on women’s rights. This was a gap in my knowledge base and this training has shown me how to work in a much more inclusive way".

This is quite something. Her training tells her it's a 'mistaken view' that trans rights impede on women's rights? The JR on the MOJ trans prisoner policy confirmed this is the case - the judge stated "... that some, and perhaps many, women prisoners may suffer fear and acute anxiety if required to share prison accommodation and facilities with a transgender women who has male genitalia, and that their fear and anxiety may be increased if that transgender woman has been convicted of sexual or violent offences against women."

If part of the outcome of the original case was that she underwent training to fill a "gap" in her knowledge, it's a huge problem if that "knowledge" training itself is biased & based on false claims or contested ideas. It helps no one if the solution is itself promoting a one sided, contested, view of what is going on in wider society.

The judge in the JR of the MOJ trans prisoner's policy also stated "the policies permit, and indeed require, the necessary balancing of competing rights. The concerns of the Claimant are of course understandable, but are not the only concerns which the Defendant had to consider." The courts have confirmed that trans rights do 'impede' women's rights. Even if the state thinks this is an acceptable compromise (leaving women in prison to "suffer fear and acute anxiety"), it's absolutely correct to state that trans rights can & do impede women's rights. The difference in view is whether or not you think women's concerns are important or not, not whether there's a conflict at all.

I suspect the original case rests upon a lot of biased assumptions & ideological based claims in respect of the alleged 'transphobia' of the SW, along with claims of 'fact' where contested ideas remain unresolved. If there have been as many errors in how the complaint was handled as I suspect there might be, then I absolutely welcome the challenge & happily 'dig' to help out. Sunlight on the whole process from start to finish, including what she actually posted, would be a good thing.

thinkingaboutLangCleg · 15/01/2022 12:37

The regulator found that Meade had “engaged in a pattern of discriminatory behaviour which persisted over an extended period” by sharing social media posts more than 70 times. She was also criticised for signing petitions and donating to organisations that were alleged to have discriminated against specific groups.

If, as I think, these were all feminist groups and petitions, they were legimately supporting women’s rights. Only transactivists and their supporters call defence of women’s rights ‘discriminatory’, so that’s not an independent viewpoint. A regulator should be independent. GC views are not illegal, as Maya’s case has established.

Whatiswrongwithmyknee · 15/01/2022 12:44

So we punish people for what MIGHT have happened now, so if you nearly (but don't) hit another car when driving you should be prosecuted because you could have caused an accident? Is there any evidence at all that any of her clients or any trans people actually saw them and were adversely affected?

Yes and even if this was deemed acceptable it's speaking absolute volumes that the fear and discomfort which other clients may equally feel if they saw posts which pledge allegiance to an ideology which thinks it's acceptable for lesbians to be retrained to accept cock and women to be raped by males who identify with their version of what being a woman is, is not considered worth of attention. It only matters if your generating a negative emotional reaction in a trans person.

Motorina · 15/01/2022 12:56

Reading the discussion, I think that there might be some confusion about the role of the case examiners. I say that because there have been a number of comments about their determination being brief and incomplete. Or that the regulator found this or that.

The case examiners are not a tribunal. Their role isn't to make a definitive decision where there's a dispute. They're basically a screening committee, almost a bit like the CPS.

Their role is to basically to decide if a hearing before a panel is necessary.

The case examiner stage was put in for those cases where everyone agreed something had gone wrong, and agreed on the best way forward. Where there was no need for a tribunal to make decisions, because everyone was in agreement.

The case examiners haven't unpicked all 70 posts because it's not their job to do so. It's their job to say, "We've looked at it all and we think there's enough here that its realistic a tribunal may find against you."

In this case, RM accepted that her posting pattern was inappropriate and agreed that a warning was the right outcome. If she hadn't it would have gone to a full panel. Where sunlight would have been shed. The reason it hasn't been is because RM agreed that the concerns the case examiners identified were valid.

Their written determination reflects that decision making process. They haven't done the full unpicking and assessment of evidence that a panel would do, that we saw with the Harrop case. That wasn't necessary, because the outcome was agreed.

A page or two back, @Datun rightly highlighted we've had cases before where the allegations have turned out to be stuff and nonsense. Most notably Marion Miller. So we all have an instinctive reaction that, when someone with GC views is accused of transphobia, the likelyhood is they've been unfairly targetted. I totally agree.

The difference is that Marion Miller vehemently denied doing or saying anything wrong. RM admitted to her regulator that her posting pattern was unacceptable and agreed to accept their warning. The two aren't really comparable.

I would have liked that RM, on her crowdjustice page, say that she accepted the warning and why she did so. There may be a reason. There must be a reason. But, right now, from the outside, it reads like she told SWE one thing, and is fundraising based on something else.

I want the flagship GC case to go forward. I want someone to be brave enough to argue that, yes, there are conflicts between the rights of women and transwomen. That we need to have difficult conversations about those conflicts. That there are potential safeguarding issues with self-ID.

This is not that case.

PlayYouLikeAShark · 15/01/2022 13:03

This is not that case

I disagree. I think there's enough about this case that just doesn't sit right & RM is as entitled as anyone to ask for support. No one is compelled to do so, but she's at risk of losing her livelihood. If that's not a good enough reason to challenge what's transpired, then I'm not sure what is.

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