NHS England uniform

[Spindelina]

There's a consultation on an England-wide NHS uniform, open until 31st May.

Noting that the supporting information talks about the need to not discriminate on the grounds of gender, and that the NHS workforce is female-dominated, but that the loudest voices I've heard talking about this have all been male...

Particularly if you work for the NHS, can I encourage you to respond to make sure that any uniform options are designed to take into account the wide variation in female body shape?

(Particularly wrt pregnancy, but also an issue for many non-pregnant women. I wouldn't want to be forced into trousers, for example - they rarely fit comfortably. But dresses are no longer included in Wales or Scotland.)

Link here: www.supplychain.nhs.uk/categories/hotel-services/national-healthcare-uniform/

Thanks for linking this. Happy Nurses Day.

I actually like the uniform they have come up with and think it is better for a variety of shapes than the stupid tunics and dresses I have to wear at present. Plus scrubs are comfy. (Don't like the colour but I guess that's my problem)

Thanks for linking this. Happy Nurses Day.

Happy nurses day! Full disclosure: I'm not a nurse, and don't wear uniform (I work with people who do though, which is why this is on my radar), though I do occasionally need to wear scrubs in theatre environments.

dita I may be wrong about this, but I think there is a greater variation in shape (not just size) amongst females than males, even without accounting for pregnancy. I think there needs to be a really wide selection of choices so every woman can find something comfy - I suspect you and I would never both be comfy in the same shaped clothing.

My worry is that if this consultation is dominated by men arguing over other stuff (who should have to wear it etc, which are important questions) then female staff are going to end up with clothing designed for a default shape which few fit.

Does this in any way relate to PPE OP?

I ask as I read Caroline Cruido Perez's newsletter snd that made me aware of the sizing issues for women working in the NHS? I will share this with those I know who work on the NHS.

I was unaware the whole of nhs in England didn't wear a regional uniform? Here in Northern Ireland we do makes it very easy to differante between professions regardless of where in n.ireland you are. And everyone is in navy trousers (unless of course you want to wear a dress)

A short colleague recently ordered her own tunic from Alexandra, because her work supplied one was too long on her.

What she didn’t realise is the she had ordered the male one. It seems the default, even in a female dominated profession, is still male and so not only did it do up the wrong way, it was also far too wide at the shoulders.

We come in all shapes & sizes and Pregnancy, breast-feeding, post-mastectomy & the menopause can all change our shape. One of my concerns around National uniform - which I think is the wrong solution to patient concerns is that it is likely to end up as one shape for all.

FWIW patients and the public seem most concerned to me with not knowing who is who, so the issue in my view is trusts that dress HCA in similar uniforms to their qualified staff. As long as the distinction is clear they will work it out. And there is never an excuse not to properly introduce yourself.

Stops grumbling.

"What sex do you identify as"?!

FFS NHS. I am female, I do not identify as one.

We have an all Wales uniform and it works well, mostly. However I ordered a maternity uniform at 13 weeks pregnant. I was told it will takes 12 weeks to arrive. I had it the week I was signed off. How can a maternity uniform take that long? In a profession that’s 80% female?

Done. Also emphasised the importance of medics also adopting a national uniform. I find the inability to identify medical staff quickly by role and grade frequently dangerous with a negative impact on patient care.

OhHoly I don't think it's directly related to PPE, but I'm concerned that women will end up uncomfortable for the same default human related reasons. I would hope (given how female the workforce is) that they at least get to default female shape but I don't think that's enough.

When I wear scrubs, which are unisex, I need XL trousers to get over my thighs. That size is not designed for my 5'5" frame. I can't do the waist ties up tight enough for my smallish waist, so I have to roll the waist to get the crotch up high enough. Even then I need to roll up the bottoms.

That's scrubs, they have always been one shape for all and I don't wear them often enough for it to be a real issue. But they are so very far from comfortable - I would hate to have to go through that every day.

(Size S fits my top half marvellously - I don't have big boob issues which many do!)

Roxy that's an insane wait. What did you do? Did you manage in your non-maternity uniform?

Thanks for highlighting this! I no longer work for the NHS, but when I did I found the biggest issue was the maternity uniform. The trousers were horrible, they basically had a huge flap at the front that bagged out in front of you and unless you were about 97 months pregnant, they were way too big. I took to wearing my own slim-fit navy trousers from H&M, however they were on a real uniform crackdown so one day the charge midwife told me I couldn't wear them. I changed into the mat trousers. She took one look at me and said "ok you can wear your own trousers". They were that sloppy and unprofessional.

I like that the document makes a lot of reference to "improved fit" (and the reference to improving the trouser selection is very welcome) but I agree- I worry that this would ultimately mean improved fit for men. At least the dresses and tunics are designed for female curves. Ultimately I don't think a one-size-fits-all approach works when it comes to uniform, so I look forward to adding my comments to this.

I've responded. In addition to the shape question, also the type and thickness of material. Some work uniform effectively is almost see through, or at least the shape/style of a bra and/or knickers is apparent.

I’ve come back out of retirement and was supposed to wear the unisex scrubs provided. I managed 2 12 hour shifts in them before ordering my own scrubs off the internet that are designed for females. I’ve just filled in the consultation questionnaire highlighting the unisex non-fitting problem.

I prefer scrubs full stop, it's unbearable otherwise, A&E nurse here.

This is a cynical expertise by NHS providers to corner the market.
If they can’t be bothered to write sex not gender on the forms they don’t are about fit. I caught my Owen lovely scrubs from FIGS during the pandemic and I am resisting putting back in my terrible A line n
Badly make uniform ever again.

God I miss wearing proper clothes at work. At least I can buy nice scrubs not crappy uniform ones.

Nothing I do at work requires me to wear scrubs. I want my clothes back!

Not a shite uniform which will no way be as nice as 1. my clothes or 2. scrubs I can order off the internet.

I really want a cape!

Thanks for this, have completed it.

I’m a mental health nurse and never wore a uniform until COVID-19 hit. Now we wear scrubs which I do like a lot. They are practical and easy to wash but I have bought my own because the trust is a bit hit and miss with supply.

They are talking about us going to polo shirts and trousers which I would hate, no pockets in the tops, the previous ones they gave were fitted for men and they are very warm.

I hated having to wear scrubs at work when I was in ITU. Same problems as above, need a massive waist size to be comfortable over my hips and arse, and then the waist is too big and they’re far too long. And again, big size for scrub top so it covers my hips then the v neck gapes if I bend down to examine a patient.

I wear my own clothes now, but the hospital I was previously at, everyone was in uniform except for consultants. I’d welcome that at my new place. I’m a physician associate on the medical team, and it would be good for the nursing staff to easily identify that in an emergency, and know I can’t prescribe.

I don’t work for the nhs, but as a woman with an odd body shape this is an issue near and dear to my heart. The few times work has handed out standardized shirts for an event I’ve needed the largest men’s size just to accommodate my bust. The rest of the garment is of course comically large to the point of being unwearable and I don’t just mean that it looks unsightly or frumpy though sometimes you get lucky and that is the only problem. With enough lead time and money items could be tailored, but that burden really shouldn’t be placed on the employees required to wear a uniform.

It is possible for people who are exceptionally skinny, or have large busts, big bellies, curvy thighs, etc to buy clothing of the rack because there are retailers that cater to a variety of shapes and sizes. So there is no reason uniforms can’t also be made with that kind of variety.

We were provided with scrubs by our department last year. Had to order size. Assumed there would be a difference between male and female sizes. Guess what - when they arrived they were all clearly made for the default male. I've filled in the consultation but don't hold out much hope of being listened to (esp having seen the mess they've made of the sex question!)

I work for NHS scotland and our uniform is unisex, which means basically no one is comfortable. Men I know often wear a t shirt underneath as the are self conscious if they have a hairy chest (v neck shows it off). As people have said above, to get the right thigh/hip size trousers, mine are constantly falling down (and the new trousers my board have dont even have a drawstring, I ran for a resus yesterday and has to run holding my trousers to stop them falling down). The tunics are unflattering as they aren't fitted at all because they're unisex, and when I bend over you can see down my top. So many people look so scruffy in them! I miss my old uniform, it wasn't much but my tunic had a collar, darts at the waist, and the trousers we made for women.

Thanks for highlighting this. I've completed it.

I work for an NHS mental health trust and each ward can choose what colour each profession wears, which means that an OT in one ward can be wearing the colour a cleaner wears in another ward. It's massively confusing for staff let alone the patients, some of whom are experiencing altered realities as it is.

I'd love scrubs in cotton with a bit of stretch. Ours are thick, tight, polyester fitted tunics or dresses and horrific in summer.