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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Was Laura Ingalls Wilder a feminist?

252 replies

WeAreJackieWeaver · 17/02/2021 21:13

Having read absolutely everything on my reading list this year, I’m re-reading the Little House on the Prairie books.
I loved these books as a child, now reading them as an adult I’m struck how fiercely Laura fought to be allowed outside her gender box. She’s fiesty, loves being physical, running and riding horses and hates the expectations placed on her by society just because she’s a girl. Girls should sit quietly and do womanly tasks like sewing.
Her sister Mary is the complete opposite and loves being feminine and embraces the expectations of her.
Both girls were highly intelligent and their education was encouraged by very progressive (for the time) parents.

During this never-ending winter lockdown the books have helped give me some perspective on the hardship of lives past but I’m loving reading about Laura’s gender non-conforming escapades.

Has anyone else read the books?

OP posts:
zanahoria · 18/02/2021 10:37

I can see how Ma would hate sewing, plenty of it to do

SydneyCarton · 18/02/2021 11:01

xanahoria I know the books talk about buying new pieces of calico and making dresses for the girls, but it’s everything else as well, isn’t it, the adults clothing, socks, underwear, baby’s nappies, menstrual rags etc. Even dish towels and sheets and pillowcases, you’d have to buy the linen and make it yourself.

JackieWeaverhasendedthemeeting · 18/02/2021 11:03

Imagining Ma on AIBUGrin...
AIBU to be horrified that DH wants to cart me and 3 DDs across the country in a glorified horse and cart?
First response: LTB, Ma

zanahoria · 18/02/2021 11:05

I love the language of the books, never heard 'calico' anywhere else. Learned later it derives from Calicut in India, just as Muslin comes from Mosul, Iraq.

Pluas · 18/02/2021 11:34

@zanahoria

I feel her discomfort when being forced into the strict gender boxes of the times

Ma often has to do 'mens work' when Pa is away, once ploughing all the land. Their only son died as a baby leaving four daughters, the eldest is blind, there seems to be a theme throughout that Pa often treats Laura like a son and teaches her things like fishing that are usually the domain of boys. I think Laura slowly realises that life is not always like that, even though she proves many times she is as capable as boy, her life will be different.

In one of the later books she meets a cousin and they ride horses across the prairie and talk about how they feel free at that moment but see many restrictions on their life. I think it is then that another cousin who married at 13 is mentioned.

Absolutely to the sons thing -- I mean, having children was partly an economic decision, balancing mouths to feed against extra bodies to labour, and one of the gambles was girls vs boys, of whom much more economically-productive farm labour could be expected.

It shows up again in in a different context in LM Montgomery's Anne of Green Gables where it's made quite explicit that the boy Marilla and Matthew intend to adopt is nothing at all like what we would consider modern adoption, but a purely economic decision -- they don't have children, they need extra hands to help with the farm work, therefore they want a strong boy, who will be treated like a sort of unwaged, live-in, permanent hired boy, but with the understanding that he will inherit the farm on their deaths.

One of the things that Anne's arrival makes clear is that, because the Cuthberts don't have lots of small children like the other families to whom Anne has been 'boarded out' from the orphanage, adopting her is both an uneconomic decision, and a completely different type of undertaking -- for one thing, she can't be put to sleep in the room off the kitchen that had intended for the boy they meant to adopt, which was definitely more rough and ready 'servant space', and as Marilla is well capable of all the housework and lighter outdoor work like the chickens, Anne is of no economic use (until much later, when Matthew has died, Marilla loses much of her sight, and ends up adopting the two young children of to a dead relative.)

On the Ingalls boys situation -- three generations of the Ingalls family either miscarried or had stillborn boys (Caroline, Laura and Rose), or had boy babies die in infancy. I seem to remember reading at some point various theories about rhesus negative blood, or guesswork connections to PCOS and diabetes (which Laura, Grace and Carrie all had, apparently).

lionheart · 18/02/2021 11:38

@MrsWooster

Also the discussion about Indians is fascinating: I reread it with trepidation, expecting some wholly unacceptable racism throughout but it’s a lot more nuanced-it’s racist, all right, but there’s a real difference in perception of Indians from Ma and Pa and an implicit rejection of Ma’s resolute racism. I can’t wait to see if it’s addressed more in Prairie Fires.
There's a lot about land claims, the ways in which newcomers were lured to particular areas, various loopholes exploited by settlers and of course, dispossession of the Native Americans.
Crikeycroc · 18/02/2021 11:39

I suppose LIW was a feminist in so far as she resisted some of her gender role. I did always feel sorry for Ma and I don’t remember Laura ever really reflecting that Pa has been unfair to dictate their many moves without consideration of his wife’s feelings on the matter. So that bit isn’t particularly feminist.

I had no idea there was a brother! Thanks for the recommendations @nettie434 and @Tooearlyforsquats.

@Austriana - I read Little House in the Big Woods when I was 8.

lionheart · 18/02/2021 11:42

nationalpost.com/opinion/laura-ingalls-wilder-and-the-ravages-of-a-metabolic-wildfire

'Grasshopper carcasses fouled wells, polluted creeks and rivers, and halted trains labouring up grades, the tracks greasy with crushed bodies. There were reports of children screaming in horror as insects alighted on them and of farmers’ wives becoming hysterical, mad with fright. A woman wearing a striped frock said insects settled on her and ate “every bit of green stripe in that dress.”'

WeAreJackieWeaver · 18/02/2021 11:47

@EBearhug

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/w3csz2x8

OP posts:
Papergirl1968 · 18/02/2021 11:55

Thanks @zanahoria - I mixed up Pa and Ma’s birthplaces. Those Wikipedia links are interesting - and the photos! They don’t look a very fun bunch but I guess it wasn’t the done thing to grin on pics in those days.

zanahoria · 18/02/2021 11:56

and here is a brown morgan

www.horsebreedspictures.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/Morgan-Horse.jpg

I used to love the way Laura talked about Almanzo's horses and all those endless buggy rides.

zanahoria · 18/02/2021 12:01

They don’t look a very fun bunch but I guess it wasn’t the done thing to grin on pics in those days.

Nineteenth century cameras had long exposure times so a grim expression was easiest to maintain. Would have been costly too, so couldn't muck about.

JellySlice · 18/02/2021 12:08

Absolutely to the sons thing -- I mean, having children was partly an economic decision, balancing mouths to feed against extra bodies to labour, and one of the gambles was girls vs boys, of whom much more economically-productive farm labour could be expected.

There wasn't a heck of a lot of choice whether or not you had children.

The differences in the labour expected from women appeared to be based on context . Eg whether you were a townie with aspirations (Nellie Olson) or trying to prove a claim, in which case women's and girls' labour was assumed. Also whether you worked on or off your farm would make a difference it what was acceptable: women were expected to do manual labour on their/their husband's property, but it was disapproved of for a woman to do manual labour for someone else. OTOH an unmarried woman could do skilled work such as teaching or dressmaking on someone else's land.

JellySlice · 18/02/2021 12:13

I often think that there are parallels between the characters of the four Ingals girls and the Little Women.

Mary - Meg
Laura - Jo
Carrie - Beth
Grace - I have no idea!

Laura might well have read Little Women, probably as an adult. I wonder whether it influenced her?

zanahoria · 18/02/2021 12:19

Another point regarding votes for women, South Dakota was not a state until 1889 so not sure if there if there was much voting going on.

EBearhug · 18/02/2021 12:26

That sounds similar, WeAreJackieWeaver, but I am pretty sure I read an article - might even have been on actual paper!

EBearhug · 18/02/2021 12:33

the photos! They don’t look a very fun bunch but I guess it wasn’t the done thing to grin on pics in those days.

Don't forget that early photography meant slow exposure times, so they had to sit still to avoid blurring. A lot of Victorian portrait photos look very stern.

Papergirl1968 · 18/02/2021 12:47

Re pics, I guess in my head they “should” look like the TV cast.

LonstantonSpiceMuseum · 18/02/2021 13:00

Omg!! Thank you for this thread. I read the books many times as a kid but haven't read prairie fires. Love Laura and seeing the world through her eyes!

libertine80 · 18/02/2021 13:07

What a great thread. I too loved these books as a child and my great great grandmother was a pioneer. In fact LIW is my namesake and I'm proud of this. I always think of my pioneer relatives when I think of LIW and what their lives would have been like. I am definitely going to get Prairie Fires to learn more about pioneer life - it sounds like a terribly hard existence.

SallyMcNally · 18/02/2021 13:15

@JellySlice

I often think that there are parallels between the characters of the four Ingals girls and the Little Women.

Mary - Meg
Laura - Jo
Carrie - Beth
Grace - I have no idea!

Laura might well have read Little Women, probably as an adult. I wonder whether it influenced her?

I actually wrote an essay in my American Literature final about relationships with the mother in both books. Big parallels between Jo and Laura I think in their gender non-conformity and their gradual understanding and acceptance of becoming a woman.

Loads of similarities between the books. Both semi autobiographical, set in almost the same time period and very interesting depictions of/relationships with fathers who were lionised but also found somewhat lacking.

zanahoria · 18/02/2021 13:21

Laura accompanies her cousin Lena to fetch the washing hired out to a homesteader’s wife living several miles from the railroad camp. When they arrive, the woman is unkempt because – as she explains to Laura and Lena – she has lots of work to do and her daughter is no longer there to help, having been married the previous day at age thirteen. On the way back to camp, the girls discuss Lizzie, who they describe as being a year younger than Lena and only a little older than Laura. Although they like babies and don’t mind housework, they decide that they aren’t ready to grow up quite yet

www.pioneergirl.com/blog/archives/12264

PolkadotsAndMoonbeams · 18/02/2021 13:24

@SydneyCarton

xanahoria I know the books talk about buying new pieces of calico and making dresses for the girls, but it’s everything else as well, isn’t it, the adults clothing, socks, underwear, baby’s nappies, menstrual rags etc. Even dish towels and sheets and pillowcases, you’d have to buy the linen and make it yourself.
There's one (Plum Creek maybe?) where they take a sheet that's wearing in the middle, tear it down the middle and then sew it back together and hem the edges so the worn middle is now the edge.
Tinymrscollings · 18/02/2021 13:29

I’m a huge fan of the Little House books, but reading them as an adult in 2021 I find them harder to swallow. This is a great book about the role of women in the books, if quite scholarly. There’s a new PBS American Masters documentary about LIWthat was screened last month (I have already hassled them about when it will be available in the UK and they don’t know). They interview a historian called Lizzie Skurnick about race and the little house and I’m really keen to see what she has to say. Incidentally, I’ve been to all the LH sites. I went on a road trip years ago. Really amazing, and as PPs have said, some of them are much closer together than you might imagine! I stood and cried at Plum Creek, which is most unlike me.

Tinymrscollings · 18/02/2021 13:31

Forgot the book. There’s also a wonderful, really funny memoir by a woman called Wendy Mclure called The Wilder Life, where she remembers what the books meant to her.

Was Laura Ingalls Wilder a feminist?
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