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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

The main problem I had with Stranger Things S3

64 replies

ImFineThankYouSusan · 17/09/2019 04:54

Is succinctly put in Pop Culture Detective's latest video

Hopper was one of my favourite characters in the first 2 seasons but in season 3 the red flags were flying all over the place. Thankfully my nearly 14yo saw them too while watching it. My random rants have obviously been noticed 😉

If you haven't watched any Pop Culture Detective vids before I thoroughly recommend them.

OP posts:

BeMoreMagdalen · 17/09/2019 14:30

Goosefoot, I've said a number of times that no, I haven't watched the show. I'm responding to why analysis is a useful thing to assess what we accept uncritically. It's not about being prescriptive as to what is put on screen, it's about examining what we take from that. But you go ahead and dismiss thoughtful analysis as woke if you want to. It's always helpful when the opinion of 'duh, it's not real, it's only the movies' is added into the mix.

Hopesorfears · 17/09/2019 14:33

Is the assumption that we take Hopper's character and actions uncritically ? Because I don't see that at all.

Jackiesathome · 17/09/2019 14:40

I think Hopper is a legend. He took in Eleven and looked after her like she was one of his own, due to not having kids before he was obviously over protective of her and didn't realise what he was doing.

Yes, he liked a drink but who doesn't now a days?

iklboo · 17/09/2019 14:44

He took in Eleven and looked after her like she was one of his own, due to not having kids before

He had a daughter who died

BeMoreMagdalen · 17/09/2019 14:45

Hopes, couldn't tell you. I would imagine that a successful show like Stranger Things is doing clever things which the tropes it's using, so I'm sure that case can be made. I was responding to Goosefoot dismissing these kind of analyses as 'woke' which I reject, as I think there is definitely a place for not picking apart, but not mindlessly absorbing, either. It's not really a wild thought to suggest that the things we see can have an effect on our own behaviour, however subtly, I wouldn't have said.

CaptainKirksSpikeyGhost · 17/09/2019 14:45

he liked a drink but who doesn't now a days

It's set 30 + years ago.

heronontoast · 17/09/2019 15:02

It's set in the 80's. I was an 80's teenager - the behaviour of the characters seems pretty much spot on for that period of history.

Are you too young to recall that time op?

Original poster

ImFineThankYouSusan · 17/09/2019 15:34

I grew up in the 80s, so I am not that young

Seems like only BeMoreMagdelen gets what I am putting forward. Ah well. Awesome username BTW.

OP posts:

Hopesorfears · 17/09/2019 16:15

I get it I just don't agree with it!
I think a lot of his actions can be seen through the lens of his bereavement, if I wanted to analyse it.

Helmetbymidnight · 17/09/2019 16:57

im a new stranger things fan- and im on ep 3 of series 3.

i cant stand this series' hopper - hes become a pastiche/a joke/horrible- he was so brilliant and nuanced before. i dunno what on earth happened?

i thought it was new writers/arseholes.

CaptainKirksSpikeyGhost · 17/09/2019 17:30

i dunno what on earth happened

They decided as the teen characters are ageing, they need Hopper to have the "Over protective dad" / "You can't date my daughter" trope....

So people will then remember things like Uncle Buck and Dr. Houseman from Dirty Dancing and feel nostalgic.

The difference of course is that mike did nothing wrong in the first place.

Like wise we are now in 1985, so The terminator is a thing and Hopper needs to have a lot more shooting scenes.

And of course Red Dawn is thrown in too.

Helmetbymidnight · 17/09/2019 17:32

its shit tho

LordRandallXV · 17/09/2019 20:18

He certainly acted like a spoilt little boy when (SPOILER) Joyce stood him up for a date.

But on the other hand he's probably fairly representative of a lot of 80s men.

LordRandallXV · 17/09/2019 20:19

...and let's be honest, most women do like a dominant man. 😉

Goosefoot · 17/09/2019 20:27

The difference of course is that mike did nothing wrong in the first place

I thought he was being a bit of a shit. As was 11 but her lack of social experience made it more understandable. Hopper's threats to Mike weren't very effective, but I don't know that I thought the touchy-feely speech was going to be either.

DreadPirateLuna · 17/09/2019 20:30

The difference of course is that mike did nothing wrong in the first place.

Mike and El shut the door of the room while making out, when Hopper had expressly told them they had to keep it open.

They're hormonal 14-year-olds in their first romantic relationship. El is socially naive and vulnerable. It's entirely reasonable for a parent to put limits upon the degree of alone time she gets with her new boyfriend.

And when Mike was confronted about this, he acted like a snotty brat towards Hopper.

Hopper did overreact and go OTT on Mike. But it wasn't coming out of nowhere.

DreadPirateLuna · 17/09/2019 20:32

He certainly acted like a spoilt little boy when (SPOILER) Joyce stood him up for a date.

Again he could have handled it better, but Joyce isn't innocent of wrongdoing here. She could have at least phoned the restaurant to say she couldn't come.

Goosefoot · 17/09/2019 20:40

I'm responding to why analysis is a useful thing to assess what we accept uncritically. It's not about being prescriptive as to what is put on screen, it's about examining what we take from that. But you go ahead and dismiss thoughtful analysis as woke if you want to. It's always helpful when the opinion of 'duh, it's not real, it's only the movies' is added into the mix.

And I am talking about this analysis, not analysis in general. There is a group of people who sees every story as one that should be didactic in a very unambiguous way, totally in line with whatever the current woke truth is, especially anything meant for a younger audience. It's just bad analysis.

For some reason the same also don't seem to be able to handle that some humorous film tropes aren't meant to be realistic and the audience knows that - it's what makes them funny.

This language of "red flags" for example, because of the banter with Hopper and Joyce. I guess, if they were real people, it would be a red flag, but it's also something that is completely unrealistic, people don't really interact in that way, it's a comedy routine. You could ask, why is it that the roles are played out a certain way, but to call the behaviour something that should be flagged is like saying the Three Stooges should be flagged for unsafe behaviour at work.

museumum · 17/09/2019 20:52

Mike and El were bratty and awful to hopper.
Yes hopper was ott but mike and el needed seriously reining in. El obviously has excuses for behaving like an antisocial oik. Mike didn’t.

Fraggling · 17/09/2019 22:22

Whole thing was a hard no from me.
I was ranting to dds about glorification of hard man violence and if they met a man like that in real life run. Unstable, violent, jealous.
I said she should have gone out with the teacher with the radio gear in the garage. I liked him. Joyce seemed to as well. It was almost like they nearly did that and thought nope violence guns yay obviously he's the top pull...

Grown man threatening teen boy is a nope.

The first series seemed quite like the 80s. As i remember it. The latest series feels like it has current gender tropes laid thickly all over it.

A real shame.

I think my kids got the point though i was noo nooooo radio man not this arsehole... 😀

Jackiesathome · 18/09/2019 09:08

It's set 30 + years ago

And they didnt like a drink back then?

CaptainKirksSpikeyGhost · 18/09/2019 09:17

And they didnt like a drink back then?

It was a response to the "now a days" bit of the quoted line.

Helmetbymidnight · 18/09/2019 09:39

I think my kids got the point though i was noo nooooo radio man not this arsehole.

I've been saying that too. I like the teacher!

I just...can't understand why they chose to go this way with Hopper. He was kind, interesting and complex before. He's become a nasty cartoon character. The series was very much 'strange things happen but its always rooted in reality'. There is less and less reality in the characterization now.

Jackiesathome · 18/09/2019 10:54

It was a response to the "now a days" bit of the quoted line

I think we are getting a bit technical here.

CaptainKirksSpikeyGhost · 18/09/2019 11:00

I think we are getting a bit technical here.

🤣 Sorry I'm autistic so I can come across as extremely pedantic at times.

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