Why would Victoria Beckham's greatest achievement be her children?

[mcmooncup]

She's quoted today as saying her kids are her greatest achievement.
That's lovely n all.

But how about the fact she's brought up 4 children AND been a very successful pop star, and has now developed a multi million pound fashion label. They are massive achievements.

An example of women playing down their achievements so as not to threaten the menz?

Oh I mean VB can say whatever she likes obviously and I wouldn't raise an eyebrow or even notice, but reading the thread I see that my feeling on this is totally different to everybody elses!

There are parents who notably don't say this and want nothing to do with their child - parents of murderers and so on.

You think I'm a murderer or some other kind of psychopath?

What an odd response, seems a little harsh TBH.

MN is weird sometimes.

Oh sorry you mean you think my children are murderers or psychopaths?

That's even worse TBH

DD2 ate a garden snail a couple of years ago but that's about the worst I can think of TBH.

She's not saying that the actual fact of reproducing is her greatest achievement. The point she's making is that she believes her DC are great and in that respect they are her greatest achievement. I don't think bringing up children is easy and the fact is if every parent did a great job, the world would be a much better place.

Sorry NT. I wasn't meaning that in response to your post at all! It was unfortunate that I posted after you. Somebody else was saying no parent would admit it in public, and it made me think of Vincent Tabak's parents on the news.

I think you are looking at achievement from a different angle. I wasn't responding to your point. I think the fact that something may be natural or instinctive for some mammals makes it no less of an achievement. I can see your perspective though.

Aha that makes more sense then!

I thought you were writing them off a bit young

I just asked DH what he would say his greatest achievement was. After much umming and ahhing about what the question means and the context (I think he thought it might be a trick somehow), he did say the children first.

This really isn't a feminist issue.

I don't think it's the breeding bit, it's more raising them to be the best human beings they can be. They will have their own talents and accomplishments, but teaching your children to love and be loved, to care about others when it is of no benefit to themselves and to have a moral code?
That's something to smile about, but it's very personal. If you have aded to the population, try and do it right.
I have numerous relatives that for one reason or another have no children, so of course they would choose something else.

I know what the OP means, women are judged as mothers before anything else. However, DH has just said 'being here with the kids' as his greatest achievement. I don't know, I think it's the bland thing you are have to say these days and so A-listers will always say it and avoid the more interesting answer.

To my mind there are definitely achievements that outrank the rather ordinary achievement of raising children to adulthood, after all most parents manage to raise children that are not murders or paedophiles so it's really not that hard to produce functioning members of society. Would you really think your greatest achievement was your children if you cured cancer or reduced poverty or some other great achievement that impacted on millions of people? Obviously VB isn't in that league but there's an issue here on the glorification of parenthood that's worth discussing.

My children are the meaning of my life but they are not my achievement, they are their own.

I normally just lurk on this board.

I have a relative living in a Mum and Child Unit.

All of the families are under SS.

My relative lost residency, it has been passed to the child's failing Father.

I work with families under SS.

I have mixed intensely with teens who "want a baby".

I wish that people would see that what they are doing is creating another Human.

The way they feed, speak, treat/care for etc "creates" that person, it doesn't happen by accident.

You can turn your life around, from a less than ideal start, sometimes, not everyone can. My relative has ongoing emotional difficulties that has caused her attachment issues with her own child.

You don't know if you have done well, until your children are adults, though. Then most parents use the get out "well they are adults, they made their own choices", when really it takes a long while to shake off your childhood and you are fortunate if you manage to come out of the other side.

Yet even knowing this, another girl in her Unit is not seeing the damage she is doing to her three year old, it's like it's a game.

My relatives ex laughs about what he gets wrong, like it's also a game, not that he is inflicting bad choices, that could have life long effects, on another living person.

I like the book that has been linked to on here "what Mothers do".

It's about time that "creating" well rounded, emotionally well people was valued and taken pride in.

I'm in my 40's, the emphasis on keeping children clothed and fed, enough, in my childhood, but little else, was very wrong.

Giving our society another well rounded member, is a massive achievement, delivering anything less (through your actions), can't be made up for by paying any amount of tax, or charitable works.

Perhaps VB thinks she has turned out great children (so far, as they are still a WIP) knowing that the family has faced things that most people don't have to deal with. They may have endless money and live in luxury but that doesn't mean it doesn't come with its own challenges to keep the children grounded and well adjusted. I wouldn't mind betting she has met some real spoilt brats amongst the families she mixes with. Is she not allowed to take some pride in the fact that her children have turned out better thanks to the work she and David put in? That is far more important than any fashion empire or sporting achievement.

Good post Birdsgottafly.

I don't think it's a case of playing down their achievements, as much as realising what is important and what has made you happiest or made you feel most confident or successful. I have done a lot in my life which is pretty awesome and not things everyone could have done, but I am most proud of myself as a mother and see my daughter as my greatest achievement.

The Beckhams are from 'Round Here' (DDs have been to the same dance school as VB, DB's first football club is up the road) and they appear very grounded. Certainly when their DC were small they used to take them to the same 'treats' (balloon shop, Christmas Grotto at the local plant centre etc) that they had been to as children, and VB came the dance school to present prizes at the 50th anniversary show - and was wonderful, had loads of time for all the dancers and posed for photos and signed autographs and chatted.

Perhaps she realises that she was fortunate in one audition and everything else comes from that? She has certainly made the most of her opportunities, but it comes back (as it often does) to right place, right time.

Good luck to her, she gets a huge amount of flak.

I see overcoming my abusive upbringing as my greatest accomplishment. Getting through harrowing therapy, maintaining mindfulness, coming out the other side a happy, well rounded person.

Without having done that, I wouldn't have been much of a mother to my DS's. They are their own accomplishment. I am constantly amazed that I had anything to do with those two wonderful young men.

Birds, thank you for your post, from the mum of two adopted children, one of whom started her life in a mum and baby unit.

I consider my children to be my greatest achievement, even though I didn't create them myself. They are healthy and happy, fun to be around and thoughtful. DD has issues, but we are working hard as a family to overcome them.

Families require work and dedication, but the rewards are immeasurable... hearing that someone with fame and fortune prizes her family above all else is lovely.

"Without having done that, I wouldn't have been much of a mother to my DS's. They are their own accomplishment. I am constantly amazed that I had anything to do with those two wonderful young men."

Capt, you had everything to do with your two wonderful sons, becoming wonderful.

Shockers, you may not have conceived your children but you are/have turned them into who they are, so in effect, you have created the people that they will become.

I wish my relatives birth Mother could listen into some of her CAHMs sessions as to why she has the issues that she does, some that she will have to ongoing work against all of her life.

All parents aren't equal and there is nothing wrong with acknowledging that.

If my children are good productive members of society (currently under five or in utero) then I will feel like I kept my side of the deal when I brought anther person into the world.

I struggle to see it as an achievement - more a duty.

My children's school, sporting, career or whatever achievements are theirs to celebrate. Mine are mine.

But it is partly your achievement, because not all parenting results in good, productive members of society. If one of your children turns out to be a particularly talented musician or sportsperson or whatever, they're more likely to go further with your support than without it and not all parents would see it as a duty to take their child to early morning swimming training or whatever.

You can't compare children with a career, most parents who invest a lot of time and love into their kids consider them to be their greatest achievement. Dd is certainly mine and dps, it's not a gender issue.

Most normal parents would feel that way I should think.

I think it's a really odd thing to say. My children are wonderful. I am enormously proud of them and they are very important to me. But they are not an 'achievement'. I didn't gain them by effort, and they aren't somehow a great deed. To me it's a misuse of the word, and yes I think it comes from a time when women were expected to live vicariously.

So yes I was partially responsible for creating them, and I have loved, nurtured and supported them too and will go on doing so, but they are their own people and their triumphs are their own.

My accomplishments/achievements are different.

Perhaps my views are partly moderated by my family circumstances. My sister has two profoundly disabled children who she has also loved and nurtured - in fact she has put in massively more work into caring for them than I ever will in a lifetime. I find it a bit offensive to take the 'credit' for my children being healthy, intelligent and likely high achieving when they had the huge advantage of being born with good genes and no significant health issues.

I don't really see my children as an achievement - and I have 5!

All lovely children but most people can conceive and I suspect that their loveliness is down to nature and a bit of luck.