I would like to suggest adding MRA to the acronym list

[NormaStanleyFletcher]

a) do you think this is a good idea. I had never heard the term before here (sheltered life) and when I saw it on a discussion I checked the acronym list, then googled, before finally asking. I have seen other posters have the same problem/question

b) Would it just say Men's Rights Activist or would you add more (without using the word fucknuggets)

tbh - looking at the [http://www.mumsnet.com/info/acronyms current list] it probably would just be Men's Rights Activist.

So it is only male activists that oppose feminist goals LRD, ok I get that and agree. However the example you gave earlier of testicular or prostrate cancer would also fall in to MRA, but not be a problem as it does no harm to the feminist point of view. How then do you propose to identify those MRA's?

Gosh.

I forgot about this, and never recommended it to mnhq (RL stuff distracted me - my mum mostly)

'What a very odd thing to do.'

Not really, they usually are .

Well men's rights is a term for all kinds of issues, just as women's rights are.

I don't actually accept the concept of 'patriarchy'. It falls down in too many ways to be credible. I have yet to be convinced of that one.

I don't think it would be useful to just explain what the letters meant.

A "Mens Rights Activist", going just by the words as they are written, could in theory be someone who campaigned against discrimination against male childcare workers, or for equality in maternity/paternity leave, or for a number of other goals that go very well with what feminists also want. (An end to the patriarchy would be good for men as well as women)

That is clearly not what people (on here at least) mean when they say it.

What THETrills said!

When people on here say MRA they mean someone who thinks that feminism has gone too far and that the world is now biased against men. That's not implicit in the name and so spelling it out would not help.

Honestly - Just knowing what it meant would have helped me. The way the term was used I could have worked out for myself how they were regarded.

I may well start that thread in site stuff

I would call a person who campaigns against discrimination against male childcare workers or for equality in maternity/paternity leave a feminist, or an equalist. If someone says they're a 'men's rights activist', I would assume they thought men's rights (as opposed to all sorts of gender/sex discrimination) needed fighting for.

As I feel vindicated - VINDICATED i tell ya - by other people having the same problem

NSF,I have reported your thread to MNHQ
They have got back to me,didnt say what I expected them to say.
MNHQ,shall I repeat what you said?
Or will you do it MNHQ please?

tbh,I only needed a rough idea.Nearest thought I had was MRSA!

Ohhhh. What did they say?

oi

MNHQ

Get over here

I'm not talking about "if someone says they are", I'm talking about me reading a thread, looking up the acronym, and seeing the words "Mens Rights Activist" - I could easily have thought that it was a synonym for "equalist".

By the way - everyone on MN is usually very happy to explain any acronyms they use - not just what the letters stand for but also what they mean when they say it.

Not my experience of asking what MRA stood for.

The explination was accompanied with a certain amount of eye rolling and not againing

I can't explain what MRAs are without rolling my eyes, but I'm certainly not rolling them at you!

Well then your problem is clearly rude posters!

THETrills,I would have normally but there was such an argument discussion going on,on the thread,that I didnt feel right asking.

As I understand it, MRAs are activists for 'men's rights'? I don't honestly see a way for that not to be misogynistic

So you think it isn't possible to be an activist for men's rights without being misogynist? How do you work that one out?

Feminism is only concerned with women's rights (when was the last time feminists campaigned for prostate cancer or campaigned about the fact most homeless/suicides/prison population/workplace deaths are men?), so it's not surprising a group for men's rights is now emerging.

Anyway like it or not the term MRA is becoming more and more popular, so I think it should be included.

It's logical, I think. Feminism exists because we know the world is skewed in favour of men over women. That's not to say all men have it better than all women, or that men never get discriminated against as a result of their sex. But it does mean that advocating for women's rights is a fundamentally different activity from advocating for men's rights.

I don't understand what it is that MRAs want, that hasn't already been covered by feminism. It seems to be a lot to do with parenting, and TBH that does make me really uneasy, because I feel that lots of the MRAs we see on here (who, I accept, may be the oddballs) are making out that they are disadvantaged as parents more than women ever are, while disregarding the huge disadvantages women have to face as parents.

Don't get me wrong, I can certainly imagine situations in which men would/should want to work separately from women for the same important issues. Rape is the obvious case there - I can see why it'd be good to have men's rape crisis centres set up for men, because obviously there is an issue with men needing to use the existing provisions and it not being easy to reconcile with women survivors' needs.

But I have not heard of this as a particular MRA issue - I'd like to know if it is.

With regard to 'MRA' as a label in general, and why it's different from advocating for women's rights - I'd say it is a bit like the way you don't support groups advocating for 'whites' rights' or anti-gay-marriage groups insisting that they need to defend 'straight rights' to keep marriage defined as between one woman and one man.

These causes are different from their opposites because the power structure is uneven.

'mens rights activists' is used as a pejorative, pretty much all of the time round here - it probably keeps referring to F4J types and a few others who have a good deal of misogynistic thoughts and actions.
But to cast this aspertion on anyone who campaigns or wishes to promote the 'rights of men' in general seems fairly harsh and desperately unfair.

But it's a term they use themselves? At least I have seen people use it.

LRD can you explain the different power involved in men advocating for a rape crises centre? There was a campaign that ran at roughly the same time as the MN I believe you campaign to get the isuue of male rape recognised and talked about. I would be interested to know why that is an opposite.

Or for that matter why men organising for better cancer services, well men clinics, contraceptive clinics would be oppositional.

But let us take something that is clearly oppositional, men arguing for the right to anominity in rape cases. This argument can be made by people with out referring to false accusations (even though it hardly ever is) should that argument not be made on fwr boards when as happens most often on fwr the subject is brought up by a woman?

Well, maybe LRD - it's their choice (though I've never actually consciously met any of them) but it doesn't mean that others are tarred with that same misogynistic brush.
I think it's easier IF it's a 'resource' question ie men v women, but the circs. I have been involved with ( men's access to MH services, boys failing in schools, a bit of F on M domestic circs., black males being 'sussed' by police - it wasn't black women being stopped) it's often an 'attitude' question. To protest against those attitudes could make me being seen as an mra. Which I have/am being in a global sense. So having MRA used as a pejorative acronym is fairly dodgy.
But it isn't going to make a jot of difference in the RL if it is adopted so I'm not too bothered about it.

of course the other 'classic MN' concern is the issue of what used to be called 'gender re-assignment' - that blew the lid off the mens rights agenda for a while, did it not, and fairly reactionary stuff indicated it was a 'good thing' to defend men's rights individually and collectively.