When you meet new people at what point do you 'out' yourself as a feminist?

[margerykemp]

I've just become part of a new 'crowd'. Maybe I'm just feeling paranoid but I feel like I'm 'hiding in the closet' as a feminist as I haven't mentioned it (yet). Part of me doesn't want to be labelled as a 'man-hating, hairy legged lesbian' but it is such a core part of my identity that I dont feel like I am being entirely honest with people by 'hiding' it.

I feel a bit daft writing this now!

But have any other MN feministas felt this dilemma?

[LRDTheFeministDragon]

Not even your name? Crikey, I have been over sharing.

I do find it interesting/bemusimg that it seems some people would feel it's 'not the done thing' to mention feminism?

[AndiMac]

I don't go around identifying myself as Canadian either. If people ask about my accent or it comes up in conversation, then that's fine. But I don't see a need to label myself based on how I feel about certain issues any more than I feel a need to label myself based on where I grew up. Both are a part of who I am, but why should I introduce myself this way, rather than letting someone find out for themselves?

[Hullygully]

LRD - It's not that it's not the done thing, it's that it shouldn't need saying. It should be obvious. Any sane person is a feminist.

[steamedtreaclesponge]

Because I'm quite involved in feminist activism - helping run a group, writing for a feminist magazine, etc - it tends to come up pretty much straight away in conversation when people ask what I do. But I imagine, even if I didn't bring it up, it would be pretty obvious once you got to know me a little better.

As someone upthread mentioned, it can be quite a good 'test' of new people and it's always interesting to see how people can react. And I love debating feminist stuff so it often leads to some really good conversations.

[blackcurrants]

Hully well that's my starting assumption, too, but gosh I am surprised an awful lot of the time. The "oh no, you can't be a feminist, you're nice" has been said to me more than once.

And I'm really not especially nice. People just think feminists are some kind of ghastly caricature, it seems.

[HandDivedScallopsrgreat]

I think it is fairly obvious from my perspective on life, so I haven't really thought about it. But there again some people can be obtuse!

[MardyBra]

I come to it with the same perspective as Hully and others. Any rational person will assume men and women are equal - just like they wouldn't discriminate on other grounds such as race, sexuality or otherwise. I wouldn't go up to someone and say "BTW, I'm a feminist and I also believe in gay rights, racial equality (or whatever) and I vote this way and..." or whatever. Hopefully my actions speak for themselves.

And if something comes up in conversation which I feel is anti-feminist, I'll just put forward a coherent argument as to why I disagree, and leave it at that.

I hope this helps.

[farrowandballs]

I always assume people are feminists and assume they will know I am - my work is dedicated to the development of feminist discourse and feminist politics inform all of my personal life choices. Besides that, I consider the women of my community to be intelligent women and always assume an intelligent woman to be a feminist. Nevertheless, the other day a newish friend came over and we were discussing something or other and she said oh god you're not going to go all feminist on me are you? I replied erm I'm not 'going to go all feminist', I AM a feminist and she was genuinely shocked. She didn't do the eye roll thing or anything but it really surprised me that it would be shock to her. Especially since I don't shave my armpits or have a sense of humour or anything

[WishIwereAtTheWiesnProst]

Not even your name? Crikey, I have been over sharing. I do find it interesting/bemusimg that it seems some people would feel it's 'not the done thing' to mention feminism?


LRDTheFeministDragon I don't walk up to people and say, hi I'm WIWATWP and I'm an animalrights activist/democrat/feminist/supporter of gay rights oh and I'm not a racist.

If someone did that I would think they were

A.) trying to show off, look at me I'm soooooo worthy

B.) not that good at any of the above or they wouldn't have to tell you.

with the exception of animal rights issues I tend to assume everyone I meet care about the rights of minorities and women's issues and is a generally good person. If they aren't I can sniff them out in all of about 5 seconds.

[AndiMac]

Oooh, WIWATWP, I do appreciate your name. You can introduce yourself to me that way. IWIWATWAuchP!

Sorry, off-topic, off-topic...

[WishIwereAtTheWiesnProst]

Gruss gott andi!

[BecauseImWorthIt]

I tend to assume that anyone else I'm with would share my views, and I'm often quite shocked when they don't.

I'm calling people on stuff more often these days. DH commented on it recently - he said "you're much more sensitive about it these days aren't you?" after I was frothing at the mouth about a ridiculous press ad. (Yet another car ad featuring, for some inexplicable reason, a scantily clad girl)

Beachcomber - that is a brilliant line that I will try and remember next time we have unwanted callers!

[LRDTheFeministDragon]

WishI - sure, and that's why I didn't think you meant what you said first time quite exactly! I doubt anyone goes around saying 'hi, I'm [name] and I'm a feminist', but obviously it does tend to come up in conversation if you act like a feminist, and that's when I'd say I was one - if asked (just like saying my name if asked). I don't think that's overly 'worthy' - I think not saying you're a feminist if you are one is just a bit sad. Why bother? It's not something to be ashamed of IMO.

[WishIwereAtTheWiesnProst]

No, of course if asked I wouldn't deny it. But the op is talking about outing herself which feels like making a deliberate point of it. It feels unnatural to do that in any circumstances. I think it's very odd she feels like its hidden I'm sure she doesn't have many different views than any of the other men and women in her new circle.

[Catitainahatita]

I find I don't need to tell anyone. My FB/Twitter stuff will out me before I've known them for long.
That said I did tend to also assume that most women if not men as well will be of a feminist persuasion. I have learnt the hard way that this is not so.
Labels (and indeed the prejudices/preconceived ideas that go with them) are indeed limiting and often frustrating. However my experiences up to this point have led me to believe that it is important not to be reticent about saying "yes. I'm a feminist" because the shocked reaction described by BIWI ("but you're so nice" or "but you're not one of those man-hating, dungaree-wearing radicals") gives you a chance to bust some of the myths out there.
On the other hand, it can make you open season for abuse.
You have to decide what's best for you.

[AlysWorld]

I'm not ashamed of it but I can honestly say it has never come up in a conversation. The expression of feminist views, of course, but the question 'are you a feminist?' or the need for me to explain my views as 'of course, I am a feminist you know' has never arisen.

It's like I have friends who are religious and might talk about church or Ramadan or something, so I know from that what religion they are. Or friends who post a load of stuff from the left wing blogosphere on facebook, so I know their politics. Or friends who I eat with who pick something vegan off a menu. But I don't tend to follow it up with so are you a christian, muslim, socialist, vegan etc.

If it's obvious from your actions, then it goes without saying. And if it's not obvious from your actions, how does it come up in conversation.

Not that it really matters

[LRDTheFeministDragon]

Oh, see I read that differently TBH.

I thought she meant she felt odd not mentioning it because she didn't think they're realized.

[LRDTheFeministDragon]

I've sometimes found that I feel a bit strange with new people because it's not yet clear if we do all have the same views - unless you are very unusual, or very careful, I think it's normal to meet people with different views from yourself. I used to think 'everyone' was a feminist. How wrong that was.

So I suspect that makes me read the OP a bit differently.

Alys - IME, it comes up when you object to sexism, they react with disbelief or anger and think you are joking or being rude, and they make some comment, usually along the lines of 'why would you say that' or 'what's your problem?'.

Or it comes up because it's tricky explaining why you object to prejudice against women without mentioning at least something to do with feminism. Though I have seen people get into amazing verbal contortions trying to do so.

[WishIwereAtTheWiesnProst]

That's the problem with posting- it leaves too much up to interpretation! not sure who is right but I do know the Op hasn't been back for 2 days so we're unlikely to know what it is she really meant either way!

[LindsayWagner]

Like Hully I always assume that feminist is e/o's default position. Since I'm pushing 44, maybe the fact that that isn't others' experience is a depressing indication of cultural shift (the wrong bleeding way).

[WishIwereAtTheWiesnProst]

Actually one little point that I have always noticed and one of the upsides to keeping yourself guarded at first is that you are much better placed to find out what people really think when they don't know how you feel about something in the first place.

After living in the UK for a while people stopped noticing or hearing that I was foreign, it meant that I got to hear what they really thought about immigrants as I never mentioned where I was form unless someone picked up the accent.

Also both my mother's and father's dad's are black. (by odd coincidence in that era both my white grandmother's got knocked up while unmarried teenagers by white men and then went on to marry black men while my parents where babies. They then each had large mix raced families. I don't as you can imagine take well to racism in any form and was much older before I found out that they were not my natural grandfathers. I am not ashamed at all but it's still not something that gets mentioned in casual conversation often. But people will occasionally make casual racist comments because all they see is an obviously white woman.

I like it because I can weed out the assholes, if I made a point of telling everyone they would probably hide that aspect of themselves.

[LRDTheFeministDragon]

That is a very true point.

I think with arseholes, I just don't have the pateince!

Actually, a few months back I didn't say anything and regretted it, so I am on an evangelical kick now.

[blackcurrants]

I think (this is a tentative response to all the people who don't want to 'label themselves') - while I don't go up to anyone and shake their hands shouting "CURRANTS! LEFTIE FEMINIST WOMEN'S LIBBER! SIGN UP TO MY MANIFESTO!" I do think there is a benefit to 'coming out' as feminist, much the same way that there is a benefit to 'coming out' as gay. Not just the huge personal benefit, but a benefit to everyone you meet- in that it normalizes it. The people I know who've said "oh you can't be a feminist! You're too nice!" have had to readjust their idea of what a feminist is, because now they know that they actually have one out-and-proud feminist in their social group. And if she is not like that stereotype, perhaps the stereotype isn't quite right?

Research shows that the most effective way for people to change their minds about an 'other' group -whether it's homosexuals, atheists, whatever, is to know them socially. To realise that actually Joan from across the road is a feminist and gosh her children get to school relatively on time and she doesn't eat aborted foetuses for breakfast... so perhaps feminism isn't quite what the rumour says... that's a valuable form of testimony.

[Catitainahatita]

You put it so much better than me Blackcurrants! That is exactly what I was trying to say.
And [grina] at the mental image of you introducing yourself like Captain Mainwaring from Dads' Army!

[Catitainahatita]

You put it so much better than me Blackcurrants! That is exactly what I was trying to say.
And [grina] at the mental image of you introducing yourself like Captain Mainwaring from Dads' Army!