Starting to wish we had old fashioned me (mum) stay at home, he (dad) go out to work set up :(

[joric]

that's it really and I never thought I'd say it but both me and DH work full time- love my job- I probably do 60/40 childcare stuff he does shopping, some washing, I clean and sort out bills etc....we ate both a bit knackered and things get half done. I am starting to think my grandparents lifestyle was a better arrangement- him to work her at home doing everything to do with the home whilst he is at work and children are at school. They had a very organised lifestyle and evenings were relaxed and free. They would eat together, see family etc as all the chores had been done in the day and his work was done for
the day.
Thoughts please :)

[SybilBeddows]

my dh is very conscious of the pressure and hates it.

OTOH he feels less insecure than he did when he was less able to work late when needed, go off on research trips and to international conferences, etc. When we were both working we felt that both our careers were insecure because we couldn't put as much into it as childless colleagues.

[joric]

Moondog - just read your list and agree the logistics work because we do very similar things to you! I am craving head space I think and want to do some things myself instead of paying others to do them for me!!! No cleaner, no gardener, no on line, no childcare!

[Ormirian]

Really? God I wouldn't. When mine were small I wanted to but couldn't. And now I have a good job and haven't lost out re career progression. I can see it would be nice to get the house together and have peaceful evenings but it doesn't always happen like that even in 'traditional' households. Mum was a traditional housewife all her married life - she still resents it. Nothing is ever the way it seems.

[Ormirian]

Oh yes and I was the main or only earner for quite a long time - I wouldn't wish that stress on anyone permanently. It's not fair.

[joric]

Moondog- I agree, homemaker is a job and should be done well if that is the deal- I would feel I owe it to family.
Sybil- yes, both of us working = watered down commitment at home and work - not good!

[joric]

Ormirian - agree last post ! :)

[mnistooaddictive]

I always describe my choice to be SAHM as a neo-feminist decision.I have seen too many women run themselves into the ground managing a full time job, childcare, household issues and all the rest. In most cases where both parents work equal hours the mother is the one running around arranging emergency childcare when things go wrong and squeezing every hour to fit it all in. I fail to see how this is women getting a better deal!
I strongly support those who chose to work but for me the choice is to be a mother and not wear myself out doing it and working as well. Mother is a full time job, why would I want two?
SAHM can be tough but I don't regret my decision!

[joric]

'I fail to see how this is women getting a better deal'
Absolutely mnist!
we - Me, DH and DD are not getting the best deal with current both FT setup.

[moondog]

Yes, it's actually a very nice feeling to care for your home and family yourself not to outsource it always.

I take huge pride in doing domestic things-making nice packed lunches, sewing on name tapes, cooking, that sort of stuff.I want to do it.

[sunshineandbooks]

I think the traditional model is absolutely fine as long as the role of SAHP is chosen voluntarily and that the working partner holds the SAHP in high regard and respects the role for its true worth.

However, your grandparents lived in an era where MC jobs were typically paid enough to support a normal family with just one parent working. The same cannot be said nowadays.

[doodledaisy]

I never thought I would say this, but I really want to quit work and be a SAHM. I've just found out that the before and after school club is closing in July and the thought of trying to find alternative childcare is just depressing me. For a number of different reasons this will be the fourth time I've had to do this in just 3 years (post reception great childminder quit to look after her dying dad, post year 1 great childminder quit to take job nearer her home, now club closes). I feel awful that dd1 has had so many carers and faces getting used to another one. I just want to give up, but we can't afford it. I hanker after the 70's upbringing I had when my mum was at home for 14 years.

[joric]

Me too- that's my point really, sad as it sounds - I put the washing out at the weekend - it was a gorgeous day and I had a calm feeling that I don't often have - I suppose basic things start to take second place when I feel rushed and a bit torn between home and work- I want to cook, bake, - yes and maybe this is the wrong forum for it but I want to do it for both my DD and DH. I like it.

[joric]

Sunshine - exactly!

[joric]

Sunshine - to elaborate- I think my Gfather did value my nan and so it was good - it would intolerable any other way and I'm sure there are plenty of examples of this senario. Having said that, he was quite macho but you know, I genuinely think she enjoyed her role on the whole.

[joric]

Also, yes- even with my parent's generation a good house could typically be bought on one wage - we lived in a big house that required two FT wages and my mum found that the arrangement troubled her the way it does me.

[joric]

Ps we DON't live bight expensive house BTW!!!!

[sunshineandbooks]

Joric, I don't think it's a desire you should feel 'ashamed' of or worry about posting about on a feminist forum. A lot of feminists, me included, think the role of SAHM is something to be respected. It performs a vital social and economic function. I am a single parent with a full-time job BTW in case you are wondering how my opinion is affected by my personal circumstances.

Being a SAHM becomes a problem when it is exploited by the other partner, not respected enough, or leaves the woman feeling unfilled because she has not chosen that role but is forced into it out of necessity. No woman who wants to work should be denied that because it is considered her duty to stay at home or because she cannot afford the childcare. I passionately believe that childcare should be largely state funded for this reason.

Some feminists take the other view and believe that fully emancipated women would never choose to lead a life of what they consider domestic servitude. I don't agree with them personally. Being a SAHM is certainly demanding and it can be boring and drudge-like on occasion (the same as any paid job) but it has incomparable rewards if it's what you want to do, and how on earth can it be 'wrong' to look after your own child? Children have to be cared for in order for other adults (e.g. your DH) to work, and surely it makes sense for a willing, enthusiastic mother to perform that vitally important nurturing function instead of someone with no real vested interest other than money being paid to do it?

If it's what you want to do, and you can make it work financially, do it. You are not 'letting the side down' or any such rubbish. I am not an expert on feminism but certainly my own personal brand of it would be abhorred by the notion that you should be 'told' what is in either your or your family's best interests.

Hope it works out for you.

[doodledaisy]

Ha ha, neither do we. I've made a decision, I'm going to cut my hours to 30 a week, this thread has convinced me!

[joric]

Sunshine - thanks for your eloquent and balanced post - I've really enjoyed this thread - I think that the key is being valued in your chosen role. I feel valued at both home and work and I am very fortunate. Respect for other's efforts is ithe most important thing.
Doodle- yes a balance is what I need too!! :)

Bed now :)

[SybilBeddows]

great post Sunshine

[tiddlerslate]

Really interesting thread. I have a slightly different take on things as i run my own business so am not tied to a 9 to 5.

For childcare i have a nanny share in place with a friend who is also freelance so I have two days (school hours) to pack in as much work as I then have three days with my dc's (5 and 2). Work has really picked up lately and I had to decide whether to get more childcare. I decided in the end that I love my time with my girls so I hired my first employee (my cousin who just graduated and is struggling to find a graduate job in his field).


It has it's ups and downs but on the whole I feel I have a good bance to life. My DH would love to cut down on his hours to have more time with our dd's but his work point blank refuses.

Joric I hope you can find something that works for you and your family.

[jadziadax]

the main reason i went back to work (when dd was 1 yr) was because dh was stressed about his job security. we had enough money to live comfortably, but dh worried about being sole earner. i was reluctant to return to work, but obviously felt his feelings were valid and being sole earner is a reasonable thing to be stressed about. fortunately found something suitable and am comfortable with how it worked out for us. i'd always expected to be a sahm, dunno why, as my mum and grandmas all worked. but despite thinking i've got the best balance achievable for my family at this time i can' help but wonder if things would be better if i worked more, or less, or weekdays with childcare instead of weekends with dd with dh.

[mrsravelstein]

sybil "Overall, as a family, we are having a better life, but I am the one that is paying the biggest price for that" you've hit the nail on the head for me here, that is exactly how i feel

[Bonsoir]

"I am craving head space I think and want to do some things myself instead of paying others to do them for me!!! No cleaner, no gardener, no on line, no childcare!"

This is a huge issue, IMO. When you do all the routine housework and errands yourself, they can seem like massive and very dull chores; when you outsource them to others, it can feel as if your own life is being outsourced and you are losing control of the very core of your existence.

My own feeling, having tried many arrangements, is that I absolutely hate having other people working in my house - I like my home to be my own personal, private space to share with my family. So I subcontract as much as possible outside the physical confines of my home, apart from a regular massive spring clean from time to time.

[Bonsoir]

"I passionately believe that childcare should be largely state funded for this reason."

When this happens, mothers are forced into work by their partners as it is more financially viable for them to do so. It's another form of exploitation and removes from mothers the choice of whether to work or not.