Mental health and the patriarchy.

[poshsinglemum]

To what extent does the patriarchy contribute to the poor mental health of both men and women? I am thinking along the lines of men ''unable'' to express their emotions due to rigid gender stereotypes and women taking valium when staying at home to look after the kids. I know that these are stereotypes in themselves but please tell me your insights!

It has been well documented that Sylvia Plath was chronically depressed due to Ted Hughes infidelity. Is this patriarchy or simply human nature?
Virginia Woolf had a distrust of the psychiatriactric profession marking it out as a male dominated/patriarchal system even though she had major mentalhealth issues.

Do you think that woemn are seen as ''hysterical or mad'' under a patriarchal system as it seeks to repress the emotional side of life.

Also; why does patriarchy dismiss emotions when they are such an important part of everyday existence? Is it not possible to be both rational AND emotional? Does it serve to justify the staus quo and capitalist alienation from nature? Phew!

How utterly depressing.

A lot of very dismal reading on here at the moment. I knew things were bad but this is all getting traumatic.

What the hell can we do about all of this? It's so entrenched. Most people can't even see what's in front of their eyes, like a mass hallucination that everything is fine and it's really not.

You have to be willing to go to a dark place to digest the type of things SaF is writing about. Easier to ignore.

The organic thing really is wishful thinking whichever way you look at it.
At the end of the day, every single person with mental health problems can trace them back to an event of some sort. The only organic thing about it is how badly their mental health has been damaged. in other words, how robust they are. But that is entirely irrelevant, when you think about it

Sorry Sakura, should have known better

"Those who attempt to say there is an organic component are only speculating, because as there cannot be any "control" environmnent to prove this."

You can't do controlled experiments in lots of fields of research - that does not mean that the cold hard facts don't support particular stances.

And no evidence of organic components in some cases does not mean there are not any. Every single adult has probably had traumatic experiences of some sort, most are not mentally ill.

Can anyone point me towards feminist consideration of PTSD?

I've been diagnosed with it myself and sent on for CBT, which I was subsequently told on here was the wrong therapy.

From what I've read, PTSD can be prevented by debriefing following the traumatic event, but once it has become chronic, it does not respond well to therapy.

Surely this means that it should be a standard procedure after a problematic birth and/or after an infant spends time in neonatal ICU, for the mother to be debriefed afterwards?

I sincerely hope that this is automatically offered to rape and assault victims - and it emphasises the importance of sensitive handling of them, on the part of all agencies involved.

But that is my point about how irrelevant the organic argument is.

2 women suffer horrendous childhood abuse. One becomes mentally ill; the other doesn't. The only organic factor here is that one was more robust than the other. IN other words, some inherent personality trait that made her more able to withstand abuse.

So what?
No human being should suffer abuse.

But by suggesting that mental health problems have a genetic basis implies that women, minorities and the poor are more likely to be born with an innate susceptibility to mental illness. Is it really likely that white males are more likely to be born of sound mind because of Darwinian survival of the fittest factor.
I think not.
But that is what the 'organic component' argument seems to be aiming for. That some people- for no reason at all- have a tendency to become mentally ill. I simply don't believe it and all evidence points to the contrary.

There is a strong link that some people have genetic predisposition to Schizophrenia, a lot of clinical depressive illness is caused by a biological absence of certain chemicals in the brain, replace them and people get better.

There is also organic personality disorder (normally caused by physical trauma)

To say that mental illness has no organic cause is naive, to say its all organic is also naive. We all experience live events and deal with them differently, most of how we deal with them is down to learning coping mechanisms, those who have not learnt them seen postive role modelling do have more dysfunctional coping stratagies.

Mental health has always been under funded, research is not as active as it is in other areas.

Swallowedafly so there is not a link between neurotransmitters specifically norepinephrine and depression?

Its an under researched area, there is no black or white cause to depression, as you are so apparently more understanding than me, I am sure you already know the answers.
No need to be so patronising is there? just giving an opinion.

What about endocrine changes and depression or the presence of cortisol in many clinically depressed patients?

Can you really just rule out that it plays no part?

.

Cause and effect is debatable, as I said its not black or white but there is a link which IME is there.

Post partum psychosis I also believe to be due to biological systems, the research is interesting.

My experience in seeing people with mental illness.

Hi all; thanks for your amazing insights and discussions. I do think that men suffer from ill mental health aswell as women. Organic components do play a part I'm sure ie genetics but I do think that the envirnmenty makes it more likely that certain genes will be expressed.

environment sorry

knobbing,

I find it hard to take anything you write seriously after your first post with its big officious tone being factually incorrect.

But what's your point? Again, nobody is saying that the brain cannot be altered.

I am saying that you are skating on very thin ice when you say genetic factors are involved in mental health.

When the facts are that in every. single. instance. of mental health problems, there are environmental and circumstancial reasons why that person is ill.

Genetics are by the by, and that is my point.

BUt some people in the mental health system (drugs companies for a start) have a vested interest in saying that some people just have faulty brains and that's the end of that.

Er yeah, right. Faulty brains that have nothing to do with the abuse they've endured

And while we're on it, you have to ask your self why people are scrabbling around to prove why victims of environmental circumstances are actually ill because of some innate tendency.

You mention post partum psychosis. Again, why on earth would you hunt for genetic factors when women in our society receive INADEQUATE emotional and physical support post partum. Women in Japan are not allowed to do housework for the first month, for example. IN other cultures, women flock to support a mother, financially, logistically. There is no such obligation upon society iin western cultures. HEr main source of support is her spouse and if he's an arse, she's fucked. Add to that, your "genetic" factors could actually be a cycle of deprivation stemming from the new mother's ^own' mother's lack of support when she had given birth, leading to bonding problems and the like.

This maniacal patriarchal hunt for genetic/organic basis for mental illness is obtuse. Fix society, not the people who are suffering under our money-grabbing, capitalist system. It is women who are suffering the fall-out of the absolute break down in community ties and support for new mothers. Easy option? Blame women for their psychosis

Your argument is intellectually shallow, and you do not have evidence on your side. ONly speculation

Which begs the question of why on earth someone would choose to speculate that post partum psychosis is a problem with that individual person, when the society she is living in is inimical to mothers, especially vulnerable new mothers.

YOu have to ask yourself whether the people hunting for an organic/genetic basis are wholly sane themselves.

your argument that biological absence of certain chemicals in the brain suggest a genetice predisposition to schizophrenia is also Bad Science.

While it's true that the brains of women who have been sexually abused as children are structured different to those who haven't, it's a bit silly to suggest that it's a random coincidence that their brains are different, don't you think?

WHat has happened is that their brains have wired differently in order to cope with the trauma they have endured. This is probably a primal survival mechanism ensuring that the organism (their brain and body) do not commit suicide or go completely, dysfunctionally insane. It's a way of allowing the brain to function in a normal-ish way.

But it doesn't suprise me that the patriarchal medical system is bent on "proving" that these brain alterations are genetic. OR that cycles of abuse passed down from generation to generation are genetic, as opposed to circumstancial.

I mean heaven forbid we actually admit that poverty, sexual abuse, acoholism, sexism actually affect people's mental health for generations upon generation. Nah, it must be genetic.

It's not just those examples I gave. It's almost everything about modern living.

All the choices and decisions we have to make every single day. OUr ancestors only had to be make a few, we have to make hundreds, every single day. We, as humans, have not evolved for what society expects of us today. Exam stress, workplace stress, caring for children isolated and alone.

I the case of men (and this happens in Japan a lot) they often have the financial burden of their family on their shoulders and are trapped in a job they loathe with no outlet for creativity or self-expression.

I mean, really, when you begin delving into the way society has been set up it's a suprise any of us are sane at all. The entire system has to change.

wow sakura your posts are very strange.

Have you actually seen anyone with post partum psychosis?

I suggest you re read my post on schizophrenia as you have mis quoted me.

I find you take on mental illness very simplistic, serious enduring mental illness is very debilitating and I find your thoughts on it somewhat airy fairy and totally unrealistic and a bit offensive.

IME/O genetics are a big issue, look at the links between bi polar and family incidence.

Having a biological link to some mental illness does not mean the system is patriarchal. Surely??

If you read my posts properly before you start leaping on certain mis quotes of mine.

As i say what i have posted is my opinion, which last time i checked i am allowed?

I do not deny society creates a lot of unhappy people and issues, even mental illness. If you re read my posts I have said that.

Incidences of sexual abuse have no bearing on if some one is predisposed to mental illness, theres a incidence of people with sexual abuse and Personality disorder and as you would expect depression and PTSD.

I am talking mental illness as a whole.

If you look at the demograpghic profiles for women with post partum psychosis there is no common theme, it would appear random. Can be with any child (ie on the 3rd child) women from well supported families, women with no previous episodes of illness and they can recover to have no other episodes.