Misogynist Fathers

[slouchingtowardswaitrose]

Can we talk about them?

I have one.

I don't even know how much I am prepared to share, but want to talk about how you deal with it when your parent perpetuates the kind of harm you are trying so hard to campaign against. It sucks.

I found your post very interesting slouching.

My mum absolutely favoured my brother for the simple fact he was a boy. She was delighted that I had 2 sons "a mother's love for her son is beyond measure" Which I found an odd thing to say to her own daughter by ho, hum.

Actually my examples are endless so I won't bore you with them. Just the little drip, drip effect has worn me down over the years.

I haven't stopped contact (she isn't a bad person) but I challenge her at every point. TBH I am banging my head against a brick wall.

Oh SWT your long post rings a lot of bells and even made me relieved anew that I don't see my dad, even after 15 or so years. He was full of scorn and always had it in for female teachers and professionals while at the same time being revoltingly self-congratulatory if I did well. I was also an honorary boy (as well as a tomboy) and for a long time desperately tried to avoid being a girl.

My dad too had something to offer - he was very well-informed and clever and I owe him my love of science and nature. My DC would enjoy that side of him maybe - but he is far too unpleasant for me to want to have any dealings with him and it wouldn't be worth it.

Yes, misogyny is very different from sexism - we are all inculcated with sexist values, though some of us do what we can to think through and challenge them; but proper woman-hating is more of a monstrous and frightening thing IME.

Sounds like you have had a lot of thinking to do over the years, slouching, to get to this point. He sounds like...not a very nice man.

But I don't know how much your kids will pick up on or care about what he thinks about women. He is their grandfather, and thus by definition behind the times. They will see him as an old man, and you can contextualise this by pointing out that many people used to hold these views, but now almost everyone realises how stupid those views are. You and their father and the ones who will influence what they think "the norm" is.

I think many men have a misogynistic streak, I think that more and more the more I hear about/observe other people's relationships. I don't feel that from my DP, luckily, though I could be blinded by love :o I don't think they all are.

So true re me and their father. Luckily, while holding on to some unconscious sexist stuff, their he does lots of housework and childcare and never acts as if doing so is in any way degrading or emasculating.

I was thinking about the honorary boy thing - I wonder if this is how a misogynistic man deals with the conflict that is 'I degrade and/or devalue women, but have a daughter I don't want degraded or devalued...hmm...AHA! I will make her into a boy!'

well, yeah!

it's not a compliment in the same way that an abusive partner's "you're not a slag like most women", is not a compliment. It's more of a threat really - conform to my prescription of your behaviour or you'll be like all those other women, you know, the ones I hate.

YES. Exactly.

I had a lot invested in not being like 'those other girls/women' - but I also had a desire for male approval. Being cooler than the other girls was my MO.

Being cooler than the other girls meant I had to not complain about misogynist stuff my male friends did. Because what is more uncool than an angry joykilling woman?

Where it went wrong was in romantic relationships, when I couldn't maintain the facade of not actually being a real woman.

I particularly disappointed one man when I failed to be cool enough for his lifestyle, thereby making him look bad, which was so embarrassing apparently he had to start beating the shit out of me on a regular basis. I was so uncool, according to his bandmates, they had to design an album cover featuring a woman who looked like me getting hit by a car.

fucking hell slouching. It sounds like you have moved on to a more healthy way of living now though. My DM who grew up with a real shit of a father married the most gentle and lovely man and raised me as a feminist, and I'm sure you are doing the same for your DCs. How old are they? Perhaps they could see your parents without you being there? I used to be roped in to visit various toxic relatives who would have given my DM an afternoon of misery had she come along, but were only interested in playing tiddlywinks with their little niece/granddaughter.