Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

What we're reading

Find your new favourite book or recommend one on our Book forum.

Madame Bovary Readalong - crinolines, carriages and lovers this way, 1 October

301 replies

StColumbofNavron · 28/08/2023 18:30

Following the successful Anna Karenina readalong (almost coming to a close), Emma Bovary has come up in conversation as a comparison piece. You don't need to have read Anna Karenina though to join in.

We start on 1 October, mark your spot.

The goal is to read one chapter per day. There are three parts, 35 chapters and we'll take a day break between each part. It is fine to post as we go along but no further than the chapter for that day.

I have opted for the Aveling Marx translation (Wordsworth Classics) as that is what is on my shelf, however, more on translations below.

https://welovetranslations.com/2022/04/08/whats-the-best-translation-of-madame-bovary-part-1/
https://welovetranslations.com/2022/04/08/whats-the-best-translation-of-madame-bovary-part-2/
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2011/oct/21/translating-madame-bovary-adam-thorpe

Part 1
1 01-Oct
2 02-Oct
3 03-Oct
4 04-Oct
5 05-Oct
6 06-Oct
7 07-Oct
8 08-Oct
9 09-Oct

BREAK 10-Oct

Part 2
1 11-Oct
2 12-Oct
3 13-Oct
4 14-Oct
5 15-Oct
6 16-Oct
7 17-Oct
8 18-Oct
9 19-Oct
10 20-Oct
11 21-Oct
12 22-Oct
13 23-Oct
14 24-Oct
15 25-Oct

BREAK 26-Oct

Part 3 27-Oct
1 28-Oct
2 29-Oct
3 30-Oct
4 31-Oct
5 01-Nov
6 02-Nov
7 03-Nov
8 04-Nov
9 05-Nov
10 06-Nov
11 07-Nov

What’s the best translation of Madame Bovary? (Part 1)

I found so much information on translations of Madame Bovary that I had to split this post into two! Part 1 of this post talks about the history of the novel and the challenge of translating it. The post gives information about 11 translations publishe...

https://welovetranslations.com/2022/04/08/whats-the-best-translation-of-madame-bovary-part-1

OP posts:
Thread gallery
14
FuzzyCaoraDhubh · 04/11/2023 17:51

I'm up for anything (no no, not literally!)
Lady Chatterley's Lover was also mentioned but I think one of us wasn't keen and called it something rude.

cassandre · 04/11/2023 22:07

I've just finished chapter 8. I feel emotionally exhausted.

That is a truly dreadful death scene. And Homais carrying on with his elaborate lunch and his intellectual posing while Emma is dying... just awful.

Thank you St Columb for sharing your own story of identification with Emma!

cassandre · 04/11/2023 22:08

Part 3, Chapter 9

  • Charles throws himself on Emma’s corpse, overcome by grief. Homais goes home, invents a story about accidental poisoning to cover up the suicide, and writes it up for the newspaper.
  • When he returns to the Bovarys’ house, he finds Charles alone and frightened, Canivet having left him.
  • Homais, with the best of intentions, attempts to distract Charles by talking about the weather.
  • Father Bournisien succeeds in getting Charles to do something about the funeral. He makes extravagantly romantic plans – ones that Emma herself would have appreciated.
  • Charles rebels against God; he curses the heavens for allowing this to happen.
  • The priest and the pharmacist sit up with the corpse all night, holding a vigil for her. The whole time, they argue about religion.
  • Charles’s mother arrives in the morning. She attempts to reason with Charles about the expense of the funeral, and he actually stands up to her for the first time.
  • The townspeople come to visit and pay their respects; they’re bored, but each is unwilling to be the first to leave.
  • Félicité is hysterical with grief. She, Madame Lefrançois, and old Madame Bovary dress Emma in her wedding gown to prepare her for her coffin. Grotesquely, a stream of black liquid flows out of the dead woman’s mouth as they lift her.
  • Homais and Bournisien continue their intellectual discussion.
  • Charles comes in to say his final good bye in private. He reflects upon his memories of their past together, looks at her dead face, and is horrified.
  • The priest and pharmacist lead him away. Homais shakily cuts a few locks of Emma’s hair for Charles to keep.
  • Félicité thoughtfully leaves a bottle of brandy and a pastry out for the men – Homais and Father Bournisien need no prompting to drink the alcohol. They part ways after finishing the bottle.
  • Finally, after Emma’s body is sealed inside three coffins, her father arrives. He faints immediately.
cassandre · 04/11/2023 23:00

@Sadik, I hadn't heard of Ruth by Elizabeth Gaskell. I'd like to read it!

It would be a refreshing change to read a story of adultery by a woman writer instead of a male one.

Piggywaspushed · 04/11/2023 23:03

Funnily enough, I am currently reading Mary Barton.

FuzzyCaoraDhubh · 04/11/2023 23:12

Ruth sounds good. I would be interested* *in reading this.

BishyBarnyBee · 05/11/2023 08:00

I have just caught up after falling a long way behind, then caught up with the thread. I'm really grateful for the thread, as I think I would just have hated it without your comments.

Last time I posted, I said I was finding it hard to like any of the characters, and without the thread, I'd be thinking along the lines of "beautiful woman hankers after more in life, uses her beauty to get it, makes terrible errors of judgement and gets her come uppance". But your comments have helped me appreciate and understand it more.

I agree that the financial stuff was harder to read than the sexual stuff. The matter of fact descriptions of their liaisons do seem quite shocking for the time - was it banned in France or the UK? Or was it OK in France because of their different attitude to affairs? As someone said above, it did seem that she might have got away with a discreet affair.

StColumbofNavron, thanks for your reflection on your early relationship. I think the FOMO of the first chapters after Emma marries is utterly convincing and for me the best part of the book. I think for some people, the teenage years/twenties are a kind of dance of "I must have a partner/is this the best I can do/should I stick or twist". And MB is a commentary on the difference between an amazing wedding and a happy marriage.

Glad I've (kind of) read along with you even though I don't really like the book!

BishyBarnyBee · 05/11/2023 08:06

Just checked, there was an obscenity trial but Flaubert was acquitted.

Madame Bovary Readalong - crinolines, carriages and lovers this way, 1 October
CornishLizard · 05/11/2023 11:57

Enjoying everyone’s comments. I was also surprised at the detail of the affairs and wondered if anglophone literature was just more, well, buttoned-up at that period or if I just haven’t read widely enough.

The Elizabeth Gaskell looks really interesting and I’d be keen to read it.

Sadik · 05/11/2023 14:29

I have read Ruth, but a long time ago. I'd be up for a read along if others were.

cassandre · 05/11/2023 15:55

Part 3, Chapter 10

  • Monsieur Rouault received a letter from the pharmacist after the fact – so Homais attempted to soften the blow by not exactly telling him that his daughter was dead. As a result, Rouault rode desperately to try and see Emma before she died – and arrived far too late.
  • He and Charles cry together, and attempt to be strong for each other.
  • The whole town turns out for the funeral, including Hippolyte and his fancy leg, as well as the dastardly Monsieur Lheureux.
  • After an elaborate procession, Emma is buried by Lestiboudois. On the way back, Homais amuses himself by noting the improper behavior of his fellow townsfolk.
  • After everything’s over, Monsieur Rouault heavily says good bye to his son-in-law and the elder Madame Bovary. He immediately goes home to Les Bertaux, and even refuses to see Berthe, since she would make him even sadder.
  • That night, Charles and his mother stay up talking. They make plans for her to move in, and she rejoices inwardly – she’s finally defeated Emma.
  • Rodolphe and Léon both sleep calmly in their respective homes, but those who loved Emma, Charles, her father, and Justin, stay awake, thinking of her.
cassandre · 05/11/2023 16:05

It's interesting to read everyone's comments about the financial stuff. In a way I think that makes Emma a very modern heroine, because problems with racking up credit are still timely today, with credit card companies encouraging people to borrow more than they can afford (it's even worse in the US than in the UK I would say), and payday loans, where every time you renew the loan, the amount you owe shoots upward due to interest. Obviously managing money isn't something the convent taught Emma either!

And it's the financial ruin that drives her to suicide in the end, rather than the actual adultery. So she's not like the heroines in the romantic stories she reads; she's trapped in a realist world instead of a romantic one.

Flaubert seems to portray her with varying levels of sympathy at different times throughout the novel, but to me the real criminals of the story are the cold-hearted capitalists on the make who decide to bleed her dry, purely for their own benefit.

Emma has redeeming qualities but men like Lheureux and Guillaumin have none. Homais is a total prick as well.

cassandre · 05/11/2023 16:09

CornishLizard · 03/11/2023 19:38

I feel a bit sullied somehow - like we were set to voyeuristically watch the affairs and the overspending, and then forced to watch her get what was coming to her.

I agree! On the other hand, if you read the novel as tragedy, you could say it's typical of the tragic genre in that regard, because you see the tragic heroine moving inevitably toward her ruin. "Fate is to blame!" to quote Charles in the final chapter.

And like the heroes of classical tragedy, Emma meets her downfall partly through her own human flaws and partly as the victim of circumstances (the soulless bourgeois environment she's trapped in).

cassandre · 05/11/2023 16:14

Piggywaspushed · 01/11/2023 18:03

I think it is interesting how Flaubert acknowledges female desire and sexuality as a thing. I haven't really seen that in a book before. She doesn't seem to obligingly feel shame, self loathing or disgust and definitley likes sex.

This is a very belated reply, Piggy, but that's a fascinating point, and very true!

Flaubert was a friend of the woman novelist George Sand, who had many real-life affairs, and he had mistresses himself I think. In any case it's refreshing to read a 19th c. novel about a woman enjoying sex!

That said, there's quite a lot of the male gaze in the way the story is narrated, with Flaubert lingering over the details of Emma's body and clothing in really sensual (but maybe also objectifying?) ways.

cassandre · 05/11/2023 16:38

Fuzzy said, Now in middle age I feel sympathetic towards her even though her predicament is largely of her own making. I was wondering if there isn't a little bit of Emma in all of us. Isn't there a quotation by Flaubert identifying with her? I think it's challenging for anyone to be completely happy in their present circumstances and to not look wistfully back to the past or regret the road not taken and imagine themselves somewhere else. It's too easy to fall down the path of temptation and vice. I maintain that Emma isn't a very nice person, but she's very human.

I completely agree. I think you're referring to the famous quote, 'Madame Bovary, c'est moi', which is attributed to Flaubert. I googled it but apparently it's not certain that he ever actually said it. Still, it's a great quote, very thought-provoking!

Sorry for the excessive number of comments; I'm just processing what was a very harrowing read and getting everything off my chest!

The last thing I wanted to say (for now!) was that a book I read in my twenties which made a profound impression on me was Deceit, Desire and the Novel by the literary critic Rene Girard. (The original French title is Mensonge romantique et verite romanesque.) Madame Bovary is a key text in Girard's analysis, which introduces the idea of triangular desire. According to Girard, we think that desire is a two-way relationship (one person loving another person or thing), but actually there is almost always a third element involved. Emma is his example: she falls in love with men not because the men themselves are so great, but because she wants to be like the romantic heroines in novels. So in her case, the novels she reads are the third element in the triangle.

Triangular desire can also be called mimetic desire because it imitates the desire of someone else. I find Girard's argument really convincing, because in a way, so many things we want in life, we want because someone else has them, or admires them. This is super clear with little kids for example. If one little kid says, 'I want that toy!' then the other kid wants it too. Even though there are loads of other equally good toys! This can also apply to more significant life decisions. I decided to study French literature because I had a mad crush on my French professor when I was a teenager. 😁So it was not a pure unmediated desire on my part to study French literature; my professor was the third element in the triangle, 'mediating' my desire.

Girard doesn't suggest that triangular desire is a bad thing necessarily; he just thinks it's part of our make-up as humans.

Having now read Madame Bovary, I now have a better understanding of what inspired Girard to come up with this theory! So yeah I would agree Fuzzy that there's a bit of Emma in all of us.

StColumbofNavron · 05/11/2023 16:47

@cassandre I switched from German history (which I had planned out) to Russian for the very same reason - it has been incredible academically fulfilling regardless of my spurious reasons.
😀

I do agree, that as more of an adult this time Emma’s spiralling debt and obsessiveness was visceral, it almost just passed me by last time because I was caught up in her desire for a better marriage, exciting life in Paris etc. With Anna I felt that you could sort of will it all to work out ok in the end, but with Emma there feels like some sort of inevitability.

I would be very up for a readalong and some English literature on similar themes is a great idea. I’m very happy to go with the majority in terms of choice. I have read Tess and I fell in love with Hardy but it took me 7 years to get over and read another.

Lady Chatterley is a very different read, but perhaps Ruth works better as of similar period, whereas LC is interwar so involves an entirely different set of morals, writing, nuance etc.

Personally, I need a little break before the next one, but am in.

OP posts:
cassandre · 05/11/2023 17:52

Ha StColumb, virtual high five to those of us who chose academic disciplines for spurious reasons!

I also need a break before the next one! I'm thinking of jumping onto the Nicholas Nickleby thread a bit late though, as I suspect Dickens will be relaxing after Flaubert.

A couple of people I follow on Twitter have said before that Mme Bovary is their favourite novel; one person said she reads it every year or so. Honestly I can't relate 😂Flaubert is a brilliant writer but I have no desire to put myself through that again any time soon.

CornishLizard · 05/11/2023 21:05

It’s not going down as a favourite with me either and, unlike AK and W&P, I can’t see myself revisiting it. In Tolstoy’s hands we’d have empathised with everyone whereas Flaubert seems to treat some characters, eg Charles, with contempt.

Sadik · 05/11/2023 21:37

"Flaubert seems to portray her with varying levels of sympathy at different times throughout the novel, but to me the real criminals of the story are the cold-hearted capitalists on the make who decide to bleed her dry, purely for their own benefit."
I'm really appreciating everyone's comments - I really agree Cassandre with your point above.

I think someone on here earlier in the thread also mentioned that MB was their favourite novel, & I'd love to hear more about that. I admire it, but I've found it a very hard read. I do wonder if coming to it later in life gives a different perspective, & makes the financial aspect stand out more than the romance.

By the way, has anyone not read ahead & reached the end? (If so, I admire your resolution!)

StColumbofNavron · 05/11/2023 23:02

@Sadik im actually still on 59% and have to finish my book club book. I’ve only commented since I’ve read it before, but I think it is one that hits differently with age/experience for sure.

OP posts:
FuzzyCaoraDhubh · 05/11/2023 23:40

Excellent discussion, thanks everyone and especially cassandre for your insights. Always so interesting and illuminating, especially the notion of triangular desire.

I found it a compelling read. I agree that knowing Emma's thoughts makes it more real and accessible than in the case of Anna Karenina as Sadik pointed out. That was the most profound thing that Charles ever said in his life that 'Fate is to blame!' The novel is fatalistic. I agree that it does play out like a tragedy and it keeps the reader enthralled. You know it's going to turn out badly, but it's hard to look away.
I think I will read it again some day. Not every year however!

cassandre · 06/11/2023 21:59

Thanks Fuzzy! The discussion's been great I think!

cassandre · 06/11/2023 21:59

Part Three, Chapter 11

  • After Emma’s death, Charles and Berthe sink into greater and greater poverty. Everyone seems to want to get money out of poor Charles; Lheureux comes back for more, as does Emma’s fake piano teacher, Mademoiselle Lempereur (who already got paid once for her collaboration, anyway).
  • Charles refuses to sell any of Emma’s belongings; as a result, he fights with his mother and she leaves.
  • Félicité inherits all of Emma’s wardrobe, and seeing her in those dresses makes Charles even sadder. Soon enough, she runs off with Théodore, Monsieur Guillaumin's servant.
  • Léon, in the meanwhile, gets married and secures a post as a notary.
  • Wandering through the house one day, Charles discovers Emma and Rodolphe’s love letters. He is jealous, but still grieves intensely for Emma, regardless of her infidelity.
  • In honor of her memory, he squanders his money on things she would have liked – fancy clothes and moustache wax. To pay for these things, he signs more promissory notes and goes into greater debt.
  • Eventually, Charles has to sell everything and, after a while, all they have left is Emma’s bedroom, full of her possessions.
  • Berthe has nothing, and has nobody to care for her. Charles can’t manage to actually take care of her.
  • The Homais family breaks off their association with the Bovarys.
  • Monsieur Homais turns his attention to civic matters. He manages to get the blind beggar shipped off to an asylum.
  • This encourages him to expand his sphere of influence; the pharmacist goes on to write many more articles about local goings-on, and shifts his attention to writing a master work on his observations of Yonville. He also maintains his pharmacy, and keeps up with all the latest ridiculous developments.
  • Homais and Charles choose an extravagant design for Emma’s tombstone.
  • Charles tries to keep the memory of Emma alive, but she fades from his memory. Eventually everyone, even Father Bournisien, gives up on him.
  • Charles and his mother attempt to reconcile, but when she offers to take Berthe off his hands, they have a final decisive break.
  • Charles is consumed with jealousy for Homais, who seems to have everything he wants. That is, everything but the cross of the Legion of Honor. The pharmacist makes it his top priority to acquire this prize. He starts to suck up to the local authorities.
  • Finally, one day Charles discovers Léon’s love letters in Emma’s desk. Mad with fury, he rummages around everywhere and discovers a portrait of Rodolphe, as well.
  • Charles totally breaks off communication with the rest of the town. Everyone assumes that he’s a drunkard.
  • He occasionally visits Madame Lefrançois to talk about Emma, but she doesn’t have time for him.
  • Finally, Charles is forced to sell his horse, the last thing he has. At the market, he runs into Rodolphe. They awkwardly have a beer together. Rodolphe talks about other things to avoid any discussion of Emma.
  • In the end, Charles tells Rodolphe that he doesn’t blame the other man, claiming that only fate is responsible for Emma’s death.
  • Rodolphe thinks of Charles as a pitiful, weak, meek man.
  • The next day, Charles sits down in the garden. It’s a beautiful spring day, and he’s struck with emotion.
  • Berthe comes to fetch him for dinner – but he’s dead, the lock of Emma’s hair in his hand.
  • Berthe is sent away to live with her grandmother, who dies the same year. She’s then passed on to a poor aunt, who sends the child to work in a cotton mill.
  • Since Charles’s death, three different doctors have all moved to Yonville to take over his practice. None of them succeed, due to the machinations of Monsieur Homais.
  • Finally, the book closes as Monsieur Homais receives the cross of the Legion of Honor.
Piggywaspushed · 07/11/2023 06:57

What a bleak ending.

Tarahumara · 07/11/2023 07:17

I know. Just when you thought things couldn't get any worse...

Swipe left for the next trending thread