Hilary Mantell

[Makeitgoaway]

Will I find her too difficult?

I'm not stupid but I don't enjoy a heavy going book. I like something that makes you think but not too hard.

The trilogy sounds like something I "should" read, how difficult are they?

One thing I didn't understand: why, if Wyatt had supposedly had an affair with Anne B, was he spared and not the others? I think there's another reason why Wyatt is spared, than those given by PPs. It's that Cromwell thinks that Wyatt is on his own level of intelligence, or higher, and admires him for that. I've just reread WH and BUTB and still loved them, and that really came out for me this time, that he has very little regard for anyone, really, apart from Wolsey and Wyatt. He is very arrogant in many ways and on this reading I very much got the sense that his sheltering of Wyatt is a mistake.
Personally, I've never found any of them heavy going, but that's a question of taste I think. If you 'get' her style, they're easy. If not, I can imagine they'd be confusing and overworked.

I also had the impression that Cromwell had some regard for Wyatt that went beyond duty.

Apparently Wyatt is credited with creating the sonnet (unless I've imagined it through a vodka-induced haze). .

I've been toying with the idea of getting a Cromwell biog - I know Tracy Norman has written one and there's a new one out - any recommendations, o wise ones?

Borman

I’m reading The Mirror etc and finding it physically difficult. It needs two hands and a lap. .I’ve never used a Kindle and wonder whether you can keep referring back to the lists of characters and family trees on a Kindle?
I have to constantly check the names/titles and who is related to who.
Despite all this, it’s absolutely brilliant.

Those reading/who have read The Mirror and the Light: do you need a good knowledge of Wolf Hall and Bringing up the Bodies? I have read them, but it was a while ago and my memory is terrible.. do I need to re-read?

Also: I have recently read Beyond Black (good read, relatively light) and The giant, O'Brien (good, but a bit depressing. Especially interesting if you've been to the Hunterian museum in London)

I enjoyed both Wolf Hall and Bring Up the Bodies immensely. I love the way HM writes. The characters are so vivid and psychologically realistic, the seamless move from high drama to dry humour, and the sheer poetry of some of her descriptions. There are some lines that have stuck in my brain like lines from poetry.

However, I am struggling more with The Mirror and The Light. I think it’s because the end that we know is coming casts it’s shadow over the whole book, so it’s harder to enjoy.

I’m nearing the end. Trying to read v e r y s l o w l y. Dreading what I know is coming, can’t imagine what is beyond this long long journey with Cromwell.
Whatever is Hilary Mantel doing with herself now and whatever shall I do when I turn the last page?

IIRC (in RL not the books) Wyatt was arrested after the others and not charged at any point? I think possibly it was Cromwell's friendship with Wyatt's father that influenced this decision.

@Hovverry and @UnrulySalvia I have to say, I would probably reread, or if you do read on the kindle you can highlight names and it links to XRay (previous mentions in the book), Wikipedia and dictionary so you can look up words too. This is partly why I love my Kindle so much now, when I read a paperback I sometimes want to press on a word Plus you can read in the dark without a light on. Also, if you put it in a waterproof case you can drop it in the bath and commence rereading immediately unlike a paperback

I have the kindle app on iPad so don't know if it's different though?

Sorry @Hovverry I see you're nearly finished! I'm trying to decide what to read next.

Btw if anyone hasn't read it and has Amazon Prime, HM's The Assassination of Margaret Thatcher book of short stories is currently free to read. I didn't enjoy it as much as the WH series, but then it didn't involve Tudor history

@WeBuiltCisCityOnSexistRoles thank you, will do. It's not like I don't have the time right now...

I don't have a Kindle unfortunately.. I did find myself trying to "scroll down" a page on my book though, just from spending too much time in my phone

I can't get into the Wolf Hall series either bit have read three of her other books. 'Beyond Black' is amazing. It's very original and incredibly dark.

I love historical fiction, especially the tudors, and consider myself smart enough (teacher), but I absolutely can’t stand HM. I know she’s won all these awards, but to me, she just can’t write. If the purpose of writing is to communicate something, I think she falls very short. I found Wolf Hall impenetrable. I am, however, sort of enjoying the radio 4 reading of Mirrors as Anton Lesser is absolutely amazing. He reads in a way that makes HMs words clear and, for me, translates her work. As a poster said, her style is marmite.

If anyone likes historical fiction, especially the Tudor’s and loves a good detective story, read C J Sansom’s Shardlake novels. Full of detail and draws you into Tudor London / England. Amazing series of books.

*Tudors (sorry, autocorrect)

I’m really enjoying Mirror and the Light - though I’m not racing through it, only about 1/3 through despite lockdown! Have already broken off for something fluffier and will do so again soon for another slice of light relief. I love these books, though conscious that I might find them a lot less approachable if I hadn’t done an A level on the period a long time ago. I wouldn’t start with this one, definitely start with WH and grit your teeth a bit with the ‘he’ usually being Cromwell - the next 2 books have improved a bit on clarity. I love the way they take you right into the minutiae of interactions between all the big players - well beyond how I could ever have imagined it all. I keep thinking if these books had been written before I was 16 I might have attempted them before starting A level history... but it might well have made me change course as I’d have found them too hard! I’d love it if HM could give us another book or series in the same vein - another period perhaps and another character from an inner circle - or perhaps other writers will follow her lead?

I loved both Wolf Hall and Bring up the bodies - beautiful to read. I am saving the last one as I need to finish her French Revolution novel first.

@Makeitgoaway

Oh, why so popular and award winning then?

Because people have different tastes. I don't read romance no matter how well written

I really enjoyed the audiobook version of the wolf hall trilogy, excellently read. I’d give it a go if you’re struggling with the books.

I read wolf Hall and enjoyed it very much. I think it helped that I had watched the BBC dramatisation of it first and also that I already had an (admittedly fairly basic) knowledge of the events in that period of history already.

I bought Wolf Hall when it was first published but gave up on it, but since watching the BBC's Wolf Hall at the start of lockdown and had reading the first couple of Shardlake books, gave it another go.

I loved them, they're dense but the prose is so clever and witty. I'd also recommend listening to them on Audible too. There's a version that covers the 3 books. The BBC drama covers the first two so includes Bringing Up the Bodies and I believe that they are going to film The Mirror and the Light too.

Yes, to there being lots of Thomas', Marys and Henrys! It is hard to keep track of the galaxy of characters but is so satisfying.

I have read all of her books and loved them. I am hoping to get The Mirror and the Light for Christmas. I lent A place of Greater Safety to my son's French girlfriend, and she said she really enjoyed it, and though she had studied the French Revolution at school, she learned a lot more from the book.

I love the audiobooks, the versions read by Ben Miles. They’re excellent.

I enjoy historical fiction but just don't like her writing style at all.

Currently enjoying Philippa Gregory's White Princess & agree with Mr Mustard above about the Shardlake novels.

But don't read the Shardlake novels and the Cromwell trilogy novels too close together. I made this mistake and didn't know if I was coming or going.

WH: pronoun hell, nearly put me off.
BUtB: Mantell made an effort to be clearer and this was my favourite
TMatL: essential reading having read I and II but I found it a real slog.

I really enjoyed them and didn’t find them hard going. Mirror and the Light was my lockdown book.

Hated Beyond Black

I listened to the audiobook of Wolf Hall and it was easy to listen to and great - I recommend doing it that way.
Why not start with a shorter Hilary Mantel? "Eight Months on Ghazzah Street" - about a woman who moves to Saudi Arabia - is great.