Blw- choking hazard

[racmun]

Dd is 7 months i've been feeding her purees but after grabbing a piece of ds' toast this morning I decided to try her with some cucumber and carrot sticks and she really enjoyed it. I then ventured onto a piece of pasta but she just ended up with quite a large piece in her mouth which I fished out as I was worried she was going to choke.

I can't see how it's safe? Surely there is a huge choking risk?
Can anyone reassure me that it is safe as I would like to do it this time round.

Thanks

We've been blw for a couple of months and it really is amazing. All babies will gag on food at some stage, but their gag reflex sits much further forward in their mouth than an adult's. When they gag, they are nowhere near choking. They are really good at gagging and bringing food forward in their mouth for another chew. It's how they learn how big the hole is

The key things to remember are that gagging is noisy, choking is silent, and never to give them food that could be a plug, like whole grapes or cherry tomatoes. Research some first aid just in case, it baby will most likely manage. Oh, and never leave baby alone to eat.

You have to practice your calm face though - it can be scary to watch.

We actually cheer a good gag now as it's a clever skill.

I wouldn't give carrot uncooked though, and I am a hardcore blwer

Missed that - sorry - I wouldn't give raw carrot either.

Agree that carrot should be steamed or roasted before being given so any bits bitten off are soft.

Fishing food out of her mouth is more of a choking hazard than letting her deal with it as you could be pushing food down her airway unwittingly.

Try going on the baby led weaning website which gives good advice on managing gagging and being prepared for choking (which is rare). Soft, age appropriate finger foods are perfectly safe as long as the baby is supervised, you understand that they can deal with gagging themselves - and that you know what to do in the event of choking.

Cook hard food first and mash it with a fork.

It might not be BLW, but who wants to watch their child gagging.

I don't have a problem with gagging, it's just them learning to move food around and chew.

Pombal - what an unnecessary comment.

Yup, soft things that mush up easily I n the mouth. I blwed DS and he never once choked.

Once you understand the gag reflex, you understand the difference between that and choking.

I used tagliatelle with ds when BLw rather than shells or penne as it was easier for him to pick up.

Do more research before committing, but it works for loads of us, so it can't be poppycock!

Babies' tongues and gag reflexes are highly developed and in the early months work differently from adults' (they gag when something touches the back of their throat, we don't). What you might think is choking is often gagging, which is an effective way for them to move food that hits the back of their throat forward.

I'd say:

1. learn baby first aid for choking, so you feel confident you can avoid and deal with it (never panic, you'll scare her and may worsen things, and Tondelay is right about fingers in their mouth).

2. give her soft, ripe or roasted foods to experiment with, and let your confidence grow with hers. Chunks of avocado, ripe banana, large strawberries (she will just suck and gum it), roast sweet potato, roast aubergine, ripe pear.

Look at it this way - you're teaching her to chew and swallow, which will protect her from choking.

I didn't like it, instinctively it didn't feel safe to me. The gill rapley book was a bit propaganda-ish too. I do wonder if there will be a BLW incident in news one day that might ignite a bit more critical thinking on this

That's not to say some of my friends didn't swear by it and there children thrived. But from what I witnessed with my baby, twice in fact, 'harmless' gagging led to helpless choking. Once on a bit of bread, once on a bit of cherry tomato. I know my view isn't fashionable but no I don't like BLW.

I never puréed but she had lumpy mashed portions of whatever we had - mainly risottos, veg curry, shepherds pie and very soft finger food: very steamed broccoli and carrot good as really they just fall apart in their mouths, and then we increased texture slowly, at her pace. Now, at nearly 2, she is a brilliant eater

their children thrived

I didn't do BLW, mainly because when I had DS almost 10 years ago no one had heard of it.

I fed DS a mix of purees, and finger food, mainly so his hands were busy for me to shovel in the purée!

We have a friend with an IVF baby, understandably they get very nervous. They waited until the baby was a year old to give him anything solid as they were so nervous. They asked me to get him started as they knew I was calm and had already weaned 2DC. I think his gag reflex wasn't as strong as he was older.

I have photos of DS eating sticks of cucumber and melon at 5 months in Greece.

Can I just point out that "traditional" weaning with purees should also involve giving finger foods alongside. The NHS weaning advice is to give appropriate finger foods from 6 months, so it's not like BLW is some wacky crazy idea. It's just offering finger foods only, rather than puree plus finger foods.

I would also point out that babies can choke just as easily on puree as well as finger food.

FWIW, I felt instinctively that BLW was safe and a sensible approach to weaning. The Gill Rapley book is obviously promoting her approach to weaning, so I read it with a critical eye, but still found that a lot of it resonated with me.

Brighton that's said a lot, that children can choke just as easily on purées, but I just don't think it is true.

Well I have no access to statistics to prove that either way, but a quick google of "baby choking on puree" shows several anecdotes of exactly that happening.

Any time something enters a baby's mouth there is a choking risk. In my opinion the risk from doing BLW is no higher than purees plus finger foods.

I googled that just now and all I find is people saying their babies gagged on purée.

I don't know, just seems more likely a baby would fatally choke on a piece of something large enough to block their tiny airways than purée/mashed up food

I'm not trying to turn this into a debate though- all I know is my own experience and who's to say my baby was just particularly prone to choking. Although she can't be the only one and I would hate to think how she would have fared if I'd been a die-hard BLWer instead of being happy to drop it when it clearly wasn't working

Once when I was attempting BLW I gave her some bread. She seemed to eat it just fine. Then as I was putting her down for a nap, I saw a lump of it congealed and stuck to the roof of her mouth, which I hastily dislodged. Scares me to think what might have happened if I hadn't noticed and she had gone to sleep like that

It's about giving appropriate foods though. Then changing those foods as DC becomes more confident in chewing. The first BLW foods should be easily mushed either in fist or mouth.

Even with "conventional" (can't call it traditional because blenders are a new thing in terms of weaning), you should accompany the purees with finger foods.

If I'm honest, I doubt DS actually ate anything for the first month, but that's not what weaning is about. Nutrition is provided by whatever milk they are getting, BLW allows them to explore food.

I also appreciate it's not for everyone, but I believe that's more to do with parents own issues with it rather than the child's.

You can ASPIRATE on a puree, but no, you can't choke on it. Choking means something solid blocking the airway. Aspirating means something getting into the airway that shouldn't be there.

I saw someone mention cherry tomatoes. Never never give cherry tomatoes to a child--they are a serious choking hazard.

Lastseasons cherry tomato (along with whole grapes) are the perfect thing to get stuck in a throat, they should never be given to small children, they're so slippery they can't manage them in their mouth.

I'm not a health care professional, so clearly don't know the terminology. I imagine aspirating puree can be as lethal as choking on a lump (which could happen with lumpier purees as well as finger foods).

Nobody should be dogmatic enough to continue to persist with giving finger foods if their babies choke every time. If my baby had struggled with eating finger foods, I would have held off and given puree instead for a while if I had to.

I agree that its about giving appropriate finger foods as and when your baby can cope with them. In the BLW book it is very clear that you should also check your baby's mouth at the end of a meal to make sure that there is no food lodged anywhere. I imagine the same is true of "traditional" weaning books/advice as well, as this would apply to lumpier puree/finger food. I found bread/toast to be a particular culprit for this.

The cherry tomatoes were quartered, I thought that was considered ok (although it clearly wasn't for DD)

I think giving small pieces of something firm isn't a good idea early on. Large bits of things that are soft fleshed so unlikely to snap in hard chunks are better. Like mango, juicy, but fibrous.

Anyway lastseasons it sounds like you easily worked out what was best for your child so not criticising, just adding a tuppence of experience for new weaners reading.

You can aspirate anything, liquid, solid and puree. The reason adding baby rice to bottles is strongly discouraged is because it is a cooking risk.

If you are offering finger foods alongside purees it isn't blw btw. BLW is exclusively finger foods. The NHS guidelines for traditional weaning includes mashed food and finger foods. So even if you aren't keen on blw you still need to offer suitable finger foods.

It might be with checking out info on the best types off finger foods. As someone said grapes and cherry tomatoes are really dangerous but bread isn't good until the baby is competent at feeding themselvesand moving the food around their mouths. Toast works much better as it didn't have the tendency to sit in the roof of the mouth in the same way.

I have linked to this before but I think it is a really good nhs leaflet about weaning.

www.nhs.uk/start4life/documents/pdfs/introducing_solid_foods.pdf

From the standpoint of the gag reflex, it always seemed to me that the only really bad idea is to eat purees for so long that the gag reflex has moved back then switch to harder stuff that could actually choke after the baby has lost their protection.

We did BLW and had two gagging incidents in 6 months. We avoided cherry tomato and grapes but otherwise DD ate what we did. The people who did purees first had far more problems with gagging and at least one choking when they tried to switch than we had going for 'proper' food from the off.

Ice - with respect I don't believe your view of purées leading to more choking incidents is true in general. I'd like to see some proof. Ask an A&E doctor about the number of stewed apple related chokings they see vs grapes/peanuts etc.

The plural of anecdotes is not data

This is not to say I'm against BLW but ffs be realistic.