Please help - I'm worried I'm harming my baby

[CinnabarRed]

DS2 is 26 weeks old tomorrow. We started weaning him early (at 23 weeks) because he won't drink breast milk or formula.

He started off really well. Seemed really enthusiastic. He didn't really get the hang of opening his mouth for the spoon, but would suck the contents off when I held the spoon to his lips.

On the HV's and nurse's advice I quickly moved him on from fruits/veg to dairy and then protein. We also started giving him cow's milk as his main drink (again on the nurse's recommendation) on the grounds that it's better to get milk of some kind into him rather than none and we can supplement him with multinvitamins and he was (at the point) eating well.

For the past week he has refused to eat solids. I think it may be because I tried him on slight lumps that made him gag. But frankly it could be anything. He has gone from eating three meals per day (two courses) each of which was roughly the size of a jar of baby food, although his food was home cooked, to virtually nothing. He also cries when I put the spoon to his lips.

I would still be worried but less so if he was still drinking EBM or formula, but he won't have any. He has upped his intake of cow's milk to 6 bottles per day.

I've tried him with finger foods but he doesn't seem to know what to do with them. They go to his mouth but he doesn't suck, bite or swallow them.

The HV and nurse just say not to worry and that he won't starve himself. But surely he's not getting all the nutrients he needs?

Does anyone have any advice at all?

Doesn't sound right to be fed solely on cows milk.

Is he sitting up unaided, or at least in a high chair. Have you tried finger foods? If he can get them to his mouth himself he should be OK and he may prefer feeding himself. Also the amount he was taking does seem a lot for newly weaned, are you expecting too much of him?

I would query the cows milk though

Sorry just saw you have tried finger foods already

he does sound like he's still at the milk stage and has a liking for it. ds3 did something similar - really interested in food but then decided he liked milk much more. (and now he@ near 2 and his diet is still milk with a small amount of food )

no I wouldn't be bothered about the milk intake - I would be concerned that it is cows milk though. Are you getting the vitamin supplements in him? Do they contain iron? If you are I wouldn't worry as longs he is getting his quota how he gets them isn't that important.

Remember loads of us were weaned on this in the 70's and are still living even if it horrifies people now.

Anyway things my fussy horror likes to eat if it helps;
bread and butter.
Fruit pots,
rusks (good for iron)
Baby cereal (at that age till he found rusks)
boiled eggs.
yoghurts. - especially fromage frais.

I worry about the cow's milk too. Should I take him to the GP, do you think?

I should add, to be fair, that he does have two bottles of EBM during the course of the night when he's too tired to resist something that he clearly considers to be only one step away from poison.

Multinvitamins go in no problem.

He can sit unaided for long periods, and can form a pincer with his thumb and finger. Still seems to thrust food out with his tongue, not sure whether by reflex or as a conscious action (assume the latter given he was managing to suck solids fine until last week.

I wouln't worry. youre still getting ebm in him and his multi vits. He's just decided he doesn't want to be weaned.

If it were me I would give it a break for a week let him have his milk and then start from scratch.

If he's going to be quite fussy blw is quite good. It gives him control of what he puts in his mouth. dont worry about the amount of food he's having because he will still rely on milk for at least another 6 months.

(lapse mummy emotion by the time I weaned no3)

yes, i would worry about everything ypou've described?

what happens if you offer him a breast? or a bottle of ebm/formula?

some babies are very distractible, and don't like feeding much during the day
sometimes they go on "nursing strikes" when they refuse to feed

i can't udnerstand why he will drink a bottle of cow's milk but not formula or breastmilk

yes, you should definitely see the GP. I cannot believe they have advised you to give cow's milk as a main drink!!! that's actually really, really awful. even with a multivitamin it just sin't what he needs. the balance of proteins and fat in cow's milk is designed for calfs... not for babies. so it isn't just a matter of having vitamins as well

i am quite concerned about him. was he being breast or bottle fed before this started?

btw, i woulkdn't be worried at all by the lack of interest in solids. but i would be very worried aboutt he milk situation

OK, here's the potted history of DS2's odd relationship with nutrition:

Up until 9 weeks: all completely normal. DS2 was EBF other than a bottle of EBM from DP at around 11PM.

9 weeks: started fussing at the breast. Persevered with EBF, but took DS2 to three breastfeeding clinics to try to improve his intake.

15 weeks: a BF counseller suggested topping him up with EBM after each feed in case supply was the issue. From that time onwards, DS2 refused point blank to take the breast - he screams if I put him to me.

15-22 weeks: mixed feeding. 3 EBM feeds and 2 formula feeds, all by bottle.

22 weeks: starts to refuse bottles of EBM and formula during the day, but will take them at night. Down to 2 bottles per day, at 11PM and 4AM - it genuinely seems he would rather go without than take formula or EBM when wakeful during day hours.

22 weeks: start weaning on fruit/veg. Still only taking EBM/formula at night, but weaning going well and DS2 taking large volumes of puree during the day.

23 weeks: move onto dairy. Still only taking EBM/formulat at night but eating well during the day.

24 weeks: move onto protein. Still only taking EBM/formulat at night but eating well during the day.

25 weeks: Start giving cow's milk during the day, and multivitamins. DS2 loves it, and suddenly stops taking solids. He's taking 3 bottles of cow's milk during the day and 2 bottles of EBM at night.

Hope that makes the chronology a bit clearer - sorry for any confusion.

I should add that in every other respect DS2 is a lovely, normal, happy baby who is meeting all his milestones. The only time he ever cries is over feeding, and the only time he screams is if I offer him formula/EBM during the day.

My instinct, and that's all it is, is that he has had a lot of new things introduced in a very short space of time.

I'm not an expert but I'm a bit concerned that you have ben given all this advice which seems contrary to curent good practice without seeing a doctor. Who is the nurse you have seen? Is she an infant feeding specialist ?

Probably stupid question but have you tried other brands of formula?

Otherwise I would be inclined to put a small amount of formula or EBM into his cows milk and gradually increase it.

But, don't worry unduly -it's not ideal but not long ago all babies moved onto cows milk at 6 months & if he's taking the multivitamins he's not going to be missing out on much.

I had a milk hating baby too - first rejected breast (3 months), then EBM (6 months), then bottles (10 months). She will now occasionally countenance a beaker of cows milk during the night!

i wouldn't worry about him going off food, i think that's not uncommon, they get all 'ooooooh' and then 'aw ffs i have to do this all the time now?' and you just ride it out. esp easy with BLW/finger food because you let them choose when to move forward.

i'd be concerned about the cow's milk as well, i take it you've tried every formula on the market?

I think you should ask to be referred to dietitian or paed. Do not think it's a good idea that cow's milk is a main drink - it will be filling him up too much so he is not hungry. I would let him feed himself and give him a good variety of food 3-5 times a day and relax.

Disclaimer: I know nothing and have no qualifications.

Bottles: will he take water from his usual bottle? Have you tried different bottles/beakers?

And apologies for this question but someone I know was completely caught out by this - have you experimented with different flow rates of the bottle teats? Usually they're right for age, but my friend's little boy for some reason much prefered the two-hole teats even at 6 months. Rather than gag at the faster flow, he would just spit out the bottle.

Oh, and a couple more things I've thought of, although I'm not sure how relevant they are.

1. DS2 never demands a feed during the day. I offer him a bottle; sometimes he takes it and sometimes he doesn't. If he didn't wake during the night I'd think he had one of those very rare syndromes where people don't have any sense of hunger.

1. DS2 is doesn't posset or sick up milk with a burp, and never had done.

Yes, he'll take water from his bottle. The teat thing is interesting because he always coughs on the bottle. I wonder if he's prefer to go back to a slower teat? We moved him onto a faster teat in the old days when he used to fall asleep on his bottle, but that's long passed.

My instinct is that there's something wrong with the way DS2 relates to nutrition in some way. I'm relieved in many ways to see someone suggest a paed referral, because it's been on my mind too.

Could he have silent reflux? There won't be much possetting so hard to spot. I just wondered why he rejects the breast and bottle - sounds like it bothers him. That combined with rejecting the solids, especially lumps - maybe he's learnt that solids cause the same problem.

I'd push for an immediate referral - get an appointment tomorrow with your GP and get them on the case.

Some areas have a paed dietician drop in clinic in children centres (sure start centres). Worth checking out your local ones in the meantime.

definitely definitely see a GP

try going back to the slower teat on the bottle and see if he will take formula/ebm from that.

i cannot believe you were advised to top up after every feed was this a proper bfc?
it sounds like he got so used to the bottle that he wouldn't take the breast
possible then that because you were keen for him to take it perhaps you pushed him a bit much and that led to refusal altogher??? projecting there though, may not have been like that

mine have ALL gone through a really, really distractible phase at around 5/6 months where they have all but refused to feed during the day, so it is possible that that was the case and then adding the bottle and then solids confused him?

ok.... if i were you i think i would, make an appt to see GP.
the fact that he will take a bottle of cow's milk makes me think it's not a physical problem, but i would go right back to basics.

cut out the solids altogether. give him small bottles with a slow teat of formula/ebm.
try and feed him lying down in a darkened room so it's like nighttime....

I wonder if you might google rapid letdown, that may have been the source of your issues qith the breast, although it's not so much an issue now unless oyu have another DC (and solvable).

Personally i'd have him on goats milk (NOT the formula- normal, in milk section stuff) adn see if it cow's milk related blaoting- 3 / 4 of mine are casein intol and the bloating if they have cows does reduce their appetites.

But I'd be tempted tor equest referral to dietetics, and in the meantime pull back for a while on milk and vits, whilst keeping a close eye and you know- leaving bits of finger food close but unmentioned with no pressure.

iggly, i was going to suggest silent reflux too,... but would it come on suddenly like that?

It's the fussing that started at 9 weeks which made me wonder. My DS went funny on the breast around 10 weeks then stopped feeding at 12 weeks. Went on nursing strike until about 8 months. I could only BF at night or when he was asleep during a nap. I didn't give many bottles so he didn't make that negative connection with those and formula was not an option as cows milk flares up his reflux.

I found as he got older it got better, but took a turn for the worse again when he started on solids and had a growth spurt so meds wore off quickly. I had to cut a lot of food out of his diet and he didn't like lumps at first (would tilt his head and arch his back). I thought his silent reflux had gone - took a while to make the connection!

dd2 always refused anything but one-hole bottles. still does, and she's 2. (gets a bottle of water at night).

I've really fucked this up.

NO. absolutely NOT.

do NOT turn this around on yourself, it's not about you AT ALL.

i GUARANTEE you that you have taken advice at every step of the way, precisely because you want to do your best to keep your son healthy and happy. which he IS, remember. he's just quirky. no beating yourself up, it's bullcrap. you've done your best with your quirky kid.

Awitch is right! YOU haven't fucked up at all. you've asked for advice and sadly (i think) you've been given bad advice by people who ought to know better

you still weren't sure about it, so you posted here.
you clearly want to do what is best otherwise you wouldn't be posting here asking for our opinions.

please don't beat yourself up