Puppy Survival Thread - for old and new pups heading into winter

[Lougle]

A thread to continue our journey with our puppies as we head into winter.

If you're new to having a puppy, jump straight in.

@Chocolatebuttonns
You are not the worst person in the world - far from it. You are wanting the best possible outcome for your whole family - yourself and pup included. Whatever you decide, it sounds like you are considering everyone's happiness and needs - that's the responsible thing to do.

@Chocolatebuttonns I admire you. You are considering her welfare and recognising that you don't actually have the time it takes to raise a puppy. You are working full time, with a husband that works away, with a child....where was the time going to come from to take a puppy out to toilet every 20 minutes, feed 4 times per day, do crate training, teach basic puppy manners, etc.? It takes time and repetition and most of all consistency. You are not demonstrating a character flaw. You are showing responsibility and awareness.

@Chocolatebuttonns I’m on my own and it is hard. I previously had a puppy with ex-H and it was worse because he was useless and I rented him. At least time I know it’s just me.

You are doing the right thing for her. That doesn’t make you a bad person.

Tbh, I think you're doing the right thing, but I'm going to go back to 'expectations'. Puppies do need 24/7 supervision. But if you can't supervise them, there are things you can do, such as buying a puppy pen and having that set up near you, so that she can only do 'good' things while you supervise her. I think you could make this work but only if you were able and willing to take a good look at your environment and put in puppy proofing measures, so that the pressure is reduced.

But a puppy pen can help with that. You can put the pen along the wall she chews and have it right next to you. It's not confined like the crate is, it just stops access to things that are inappropriate.

@TheSproutOfWrath our wcs is now on butternut box and loves it. We have to give it in a lickimat though or it would be gone in seconds.

Big dog is being castrated on Wednesday, so we decided to trial using puppy pen panels as separators because they play constantly and he'll be tender. Hazel is not massively impressed!

Poor puppy having her fun ruined!

@Chocolatebuttonns I was where you were about 3 weeks in and I just wanted to say it gets so much better. I was trying to rehome as my husband was losing it over the mess. He's still not toilet trained and that drives me mad but he doesn't bite heaps anymore, he's capable of napping and he loves walking as do I. We can leave him for a few hours without worrying and he's a central part of our family.

we had ours neutered in September. We found the first day or two hard going and we basically made sure dh or myself was with him all the time. He cried alot (effects of anaesthetic?), and always wanted one of us near him. He wouldn’t sleep in his crate so we had a night or two sleeping on the sofa. We got a couple of surgical suits for him rather than the cone of shame. However, ditched them after a few days due to that early September heatwave.

@Riverlee I'm hoping big dog will be ok. I feel guilty that he's being neutered at his age, but we can't risk puppies and DD2 wanted a female puppy. I was a bit wary of having two males in the house, so either way he would have ended up getting castrated.

Have we made a mistake with our pup as since he's been with us (he's 10 weeks) we've allowed him to sleep on our bed? We have a crate but he doesn't go in much despite me putting licky mat in there and lots of treats.
I know we should have made him sleep in crate at night but is it too late to change this.
Also his biting is off the scale / he lunges at us , both hands and face and no amount of distraction techniques seem to work when he's in the mood.
Feel a bit fed up as I so wanted a dog but it's such a chore at the moment.

@cockapup I imagine you can teach him to go in his crate, bear in mind that some people don’t even have their pups until 10/12 weeks. We were lucky that Maggie just went into hers, but we definitely had to build up to it in the daytimes by increasing the time gradually and (a bit like with a human baby) putting her in “sleepy but awake” at the right time so she did actually sleep in there. It was never an option for her to sleep on or in our bed or room, or even upstairs, so we had to make the crate work. The pen, well that’s another story. She flatly refuses to go in it, except for food and immediately whines to come out so it’s just not working (yet). It’s in our hallway as I can’t fit it in the living room so it’s just not as easy to work with her going in there. Re the biting- have you weighed him and is his food allowance enough? We find Maggie gets extra bitey when she’s had or is having a growth spurt.

@cockapup it's not too late. I would start by luring her into the crate. If he won't go in for a bit of kibble, make it a bit of chicken, or hot dog sausage, or cheese....whatever he'll go in for. Hold the treat through the crate bars towards the back of the crate, so that he has to go into the crate to get it from you. Give great praise when he does, or if you've used a marker word for training, use that (e.g. 'Yes'). You need to repeat this step over and over again, until he's freely walking in and out of the crate without hesitation.

Then, you can start to close the door, but only for a second. Once you've done that, open it and say 'yes!' and encourage him out of the crate with a treat. So you're making it a bit of a game. He gets a treat for going in, and for going out. Once you've done that a few times, you can start to increase the time, in increments, that the door is shut.

Once they're crate trained, it makes things easier. Now, we don't have the crate door shut. We have a pen around the crate, and Hazel can wander into her crate, lay down, sleep, etc. She might get up and wander out to have a drink, then flop on the floor, then go back to her crate....she knows it's her safe sleeping place.

Re. the biting, how much sleep is he getting? He needs about 20 hours sleep per day at this stage and we always knew that Hazel was overcooked if she started to bite. Bitey puppies are tired puppies.

@Lougle that is so helpful, thank you. I don't have a bed in his crate - I think I read somewhere not to put a bed in it. But would you say it would be more comfortable for him with a bed in there?
The biting is really getting us down. How do I make him settled and sleep when he's hyper and trying to attack us🙄
I will check food amounts, thank you

We used vet bed at first, then added an old pillow when she was about 15 weeks.

Everything that Lougle said! It's not too late.
I took it a stage further. As our routine was into crate for all naps we only ever went straight outside for a wee after leaving the crate. So as well as treat to come out of crate we skipped (to make it fun) or danced or something to the back door and as soon as she went outside another YES and treat. Seems like a lot of treats and it is but you take it from their food allowance and it's not forever.
I seriously did this 100's of times over and over again in the first few days. All the time making it a GREAT GAME and she got it and loves her crate. Still goes into it if I'm working in the kitchen.
She has free roam of the whole house now but chooses to sleep 2 inches from my nose.

Oh yes, we got to the stage where Hazel wouldn't come out of the crate. We had to lure her with treats!

@cockapup ny the time he’s biting frenzy he’s too tired. You need to make sure he’s in a routine so that he’s getting enough sleep and not getting to that point. When my pup was/is like that (he’s almost 16 weeks now and it’s much rarer), we stand up and walk away, out of the room is necessary for a few minutes. Rinse and repeat until he understands that fun stops when he bites.

I also used to put him in his crate for a nap. But we had crate trained and stayed with him, shushing him, until he calmed down.

Freddie sleeps in his crate, except after his 5.30am toilet stop he’s allowed on my bed, because I am not getting up at 5.30 🤣. I’m our campervan he sleeps on bed as there isn’t really anywhere else for him.

@cockapup
2 things worked for me
Hyper and not sleeping- I ignored him, sat on the sofa and yawned big slow breaths and shut my eyes and pretended to go to sleep! He'd be asleep next to me in 5 minutes.
The other thing that worked unintentionally was ignoring him and talking to DH. This still sends him to sleep in seconds- we're obviously very very boring 🤣🤣
The only defence against the biting was always 100% of the time having a toy in my hand to shove in his mouth when he approached!!

Hi, please can I join?

We have a 5 month old collie, he moved in late August, and I am at the WTF phase. I work with dogs, and we had a collie previously but I think I've forgotten what it's like!

I know what to do, and people comment on how good he is, but today he's been full on and demanding - and the lead pulling is getting out of hand.

It's that feeling with some of it that we are going two steps forward and one step back. I also think I am overthinking some of the things he does as I know too many messed up dogs, especially collies, even though I have no reason to expect any major issues.

Really, DH is away this week and I think I am just TIRED. I can see why there is a 'survival' thread!

Here he is…