Alienating baby mum making our lives hell!

[TheLilacViper]

My partner and I have been together 8years and have 2 daughters together, he also has 2 kids 11 and 10 from a previous relationship. She is extremely high conflict, controlling and impossible to compromise with. She moved away 4 years ago around an hour and 30 minute drive away and refuses to do any travel so was forced to cut contact down to every other weekend and half of the holidays. During our weekends we had noticed that contact between baby mum and step children was ALOT it was continuous texting asking what they were eating for every meal telling them what time they should go to bed or making comments that it’s too late or too early if we were out it was asking where we were going. It escalated to a point that the kids were never putting their phones down as they were constantly having to update their mum and if they were pre occupied they would be bombarded with texts telling them that she is worried about them and then my partner would get a text asking them to check their phones and that she needs to have constant communication with them. She is always promising them to give them things when they get home (example, sleepovers with friends, presents ordered from Amazon, surprises, days out) which I feel makes them itch to go back home with their mum I don’t feel it’s fair when we only get the 2 days with them. My OH has had enough and has said the kids are not having their phones so that they can be in the moment when they’re with us and enjoy the 48 hours that they get while they’re here that they can tell her about their time when they get home. She has since blocked all of us from their phones including my 5 year old daughters iPad so she can’t FaceTime with her siblings! And has encouraged SD10 to call OH and tell him she won’t be seeing him anymore due to not being allowed her phone and that it’s her property to do with as she likes. This conversation was super awkward and out of character for my step daughter and she sounded uncomfortable and withdrawn. She absolutely loves coming to visit and hates any kind of confrontation so I’m certain she has been made to make this phonecall to her dad. Any advice on this. There is already a court order in place and this isn’t the only time she has stopped contact it happens every time my partner doesn’t ’do as she says’ we won’t be getting court involved it’s not fair on the kids and she’s already convinced them that it’s all their idea. I’m not sure if contacting their school maybe is the best course of action to get them support?

My DH's ex wife is like this, and it's still going on with the youngest DSS - he's 34 years old, mildly developmentally delayed, lives with her, visits us.
She blows up his phone with fake emergencies, family drama etc, to the point he rushes back home ( 3 hrs away) on zero notice, meaning we have to arrange transport etc.
How we handle this is; I stay out of it completely, apart from driving him to catch the bus.
My husband is grateful he does not receive pressure and complaining from me, he gets enough stress already in this mess.
The Ex wife shows her true colours to her son and family, we stay quiet and supportive of DSS.
It's horrible, unfair and exhausting, but we are focusing on being as neutral as possible and giving him a calm, enjoyable break when he is here.

Op, your dp needs to go back to court. If the issue is phones, all the evidence will be available from the account.

There is no other way.

Agree with this.

You can't reason with someone like her.

I was left by a horrible emotionally abusive man 6 weeks before our baby was born. I don't let this impact our now toddler being given opportunities to build a relationship with him and I don't spend time thinking about his new gf when making decisions. I'm triggered by it often but it doesn't impact on my child's time with him and my feelings won't be my child's problem. This is because I'm mature and a good mum (not because my ex deserves kindness from me).
Even if you were the wicked witch other woman, she shouldn't be involving the children.
He should invite her to mediation to discuss phones and reasonable communication and make a parenting plan about this- if she wont then a court enforcement order would be needed . Courts are very keen to support sibling relationships and prioritize these even above parents sometimes

Its the perfect reaction. Their father is rightfully taking the responsibility, guilt and burden off of his children and protecting them from a very toxic dynamic. He sounds like a good dad.
I bet the children find it incredibly freeing (of course unable to admit that to mum).
I feel very sorry for your Step children having to shoulder the burden of their mothers co-dependency and obvious inability to prioritise their neeeds over her own.

Another mother who was controlling and abusive in the marriage, continues to be so, but not so much that the dad would go to court or disrupt his life in any way to protect them.

Well you certainly got a taste of sauce for the goose there, didn't you?

Your H was completely wrong to refuse the girls their phones.

The correct way to go about sorting this out was family court. Your H could have filed a motion asking for clarification as to what is considered reasonable phone contact between the girls and their mother while with their father. Once or twice a day? Fourteen times a day? Somewhere in between? He could have petitioned the court to issue an order to the effect that reasonable phone contact means three calls a day and unlimited texting, for instance.

But he lost his rag and now he has been given a taste of his own medicine.

I pity the children caught in the middle of these two immature parents.

.............
I'm not even going to mention that term "baby mum". Horrible.

You and H have no right at all to look at the messages between the girls and their mother.

I can't begin to describe how wrong it is to ask to see these messages, if that's what has happened.

If the girls have come to you and H upset at what their mother is saying to them, and volunteering their phones to be examined by you and H, then you and H should have gone to family court to report a case of alienation of affection, and asking for an order prohibiting each parent from speaking badly of the other.

Your H is going about this all wrong and it's the children who are suffering as a result.

The kids being constantly on their phones isn't necessarily all due to their mum. They could be texting friends, checking homework on Google classroom, just browsing the net etc. Then when your (controlling?) Dp asked them why, they blamed their mum texting them what utter bollocks. No ten and eleven year old needs to have constant access to their phone. If anything parents who allow unlimited screen time at that age aren’t being controlling enough.

As for the “well he left when when they were little” comments, so what. If he’d only just left and shacked up with someone her reaction might be understandable, but still not ok, and if she posted on mn she would have received sympathy but still be told to put her children first. But this was at least eight years ago. She needs to get over it and put her kids first.

Op the only thing your partner is doing wrong here is not going to court. When the kids are older they will remember that their father didn’t even try to get access. He has to go to court. The kids are old enough now for their wishes to be taken into account.

'Baby mum'? 🙄

I'm not going to comment on the childrens mother, from what you've said here, she doesn't sound great, so you would have already been ahead without the need to refer to her as 'baby mum'

Anyway, taking away the phones was not the right move and neither was reading messages between the children and their mother.
You say they don't care about their phones so surely they could have put them on silent and responded at an agreed time/rate later (agreed between their dad and them, not mum) So what if she constantly messages? Doesn't mean any response or engagement is needed.
You should have simply asked her to stop the constant communication and then, when she didn't, gone back to court to tighten up the agreement to include a reasonable communication plan for when the children are with you. Perfect opportunity to try for shared travel as well
But no, it had to be as dramatic as possible with no real and achievable solution.

Go back to court and get it clarified whilst they are still young enough that they don't really have a choice but to spend the time with you

They may not be bothered by their phones, but they soon will be. Outright banning them seems OTT. Surely there can be some comprimise eg: no phones when out for the day, no phones at the table but when chilling in the evening they can text her.

From what you have said the teenage years will be a nightmare. I would also just be mindful there are 2 sides to every divorce and you only know 1 of them.

Indeed.

She sounds very hard work but I'm struggling to understand why your DH only sees his children every other week?

Yes, ideally the mum would share the travel, but I can't imagine any scenario where a 1.5 hour drive would stop me from seeing my own children... some people commute that distance every day.

The kids will see their mum as their default parent because they spend the vast majority of their time with her. If he wants to change that he needs to put the leg work in, regardless of whether that feels 'fair'.

Or if his children were adult, living their own independent lives and just visited.

OP, the ex does sound as though she is OTT but she obviously still feels aggrieved so please cut her some slack. She is insecure, you are not, you have her man. It will take time for her to not think of him as 'her' man. You may find yourself in the same position one day and then you'll understand.

The children don't have to answer their phones all the time, nobody does that, a couple of times in a day is sufficient. It would be wrong to take their phones off them when they are with you.

Leave it to 'your' man to sort out.

She sounds incredibly controlling and anxious and what she is doing does sound like abuse, if this was a wife on here saying her husband was blowing up her phone when she went to a mates and then he stopped her from seeing her friends/ family the lynching squad would be out! She needs some mental health support but that's not something you can influence. What you are seeing might be the tip of the iceberg, you don't know how controlling she is with them at home. You also mention that's why your partner left. Contacting the school to see if they have concerns might be sensible as if they do it might help build up a bigger safeguarding picture. I don't know if you think there might be a reason for social services to get involved? If not I do think the courts might be in order, I know you said you didn't want to put the kids through it, however is that not better than how they are living now?

I agree. It’s all seems very tit for tat and not grounded in whatvis best for the children.

Can you not limit the phones rather than removing them. I don't think you can expect DH to have free contact via the phone when in mums care if you're not allowing the same

She sounds unbelievably nuts. She will turn her children against herself hopefully.
Anyway are the kids phones on a contract? If not and all the messages are WiFi switch the WiFi off, or change password something along those lines and just lie if they see you using yours, you got data left, router on the blink etc.
If they are on contract and you say they aren’t bothered about phones. Discreetly when they are occupied put theirs on airplane mode, oh and photograph messages from the mother. Then take her ass back to court. She needs help.

PS I am not a stepmother, but I have done some of the above due to having a narcissistic asshole ex who would send messages not suitable for young minds. Example your mum is stopping me from seeing you etc. He would also constantly FaceTime her being young she would wander around the house, so her older brother would switch the router off as he found it intrusive. He got his ass handed to him on a plate at court. Set times! Guess what because he was told by courts what was appropriate he stopped all together, he never did like boundaries.

I do offer this though be prepared when they are old enough they may want to live with dad.

If this was written as a separated/divorced dad wanting constant contact, blowing up the kids' phones, making them feel bad if they don't respond right away and interfering with mum's parenting, I bet the responses would have been incredibly different. It'd be "he's attempting to continue abuse/coercive control through the children, you should stop contact, he's unsafe".

MN sometimes struggles to think that mothers may not always be perfect, or that some exes may not be able to keep their kids' best interests ahead of other issues.

Interestingly, there was a thread (maybe in AIBU) the other week where a poster was wanting to justify not allowing her kids to ever see the OW and she had her ass handed to her on a plate. So I wonder if it's more that different kinds of posters hang about in the step parenting area.

So you got with this man when his children were babies/toddlers? While she was left in the shit trying to bring up 2 tiny children on her own? No wonder the woman is bitter.

However that aside, perhaps their dad can have phone free periods during their visits. Ie they can use their phones fron X time to X time and then it's put away. That way, they still have context with their mother but dad still get alone family time with them.

A good dad? Fucking off and leaving the mother of his children in the trenches with a baby & toddler while he goes on the hunt for a new girlfriend? Don't make me laugh.

I would've approached this a different way. I wouldn't have removed the phones but simply had times phone free over the weekend, so for instance on a day out no phones are going so leave them home and I wouldn't have told the children this until they next came over. They aren't old enough to hold that decision so your dh needs to parent at the time not in the weeks in between or this sort of thing happens. And he needs to tell his ex wife that the girls are with me we're going out and leaving phones at home.
What's done is done now and your dh needs to convince his children to come over, remove phones for certain periods and reply to mum that they are fine and having phone free time.

On another side my ex husbands new daughter was FaceTiming my children at 6.30 this morning and I too asked her to block the child and have a word with their dad. I didn't need that intrusion in my home that early!

@DoTheDinosaurStomp why are you inventing your own narrative? You have no idea of the circumstances of their separation. Maybe she threw him out. Op said she was abusive towards him just like she is being abusive and controlling to her own kids. But well ignore that because she's the scorned woman bitter ex so she can do no wrong.

Them being 1.5 hours away means he can only see them every other weekend? That's laughably pathetic. I know multiple people commuting that distance to work and then back again five days a week. I also don't understand how it can be that your partner feels his ex is abusive but is also happy for her to have his children in her care for the vast majority of the time.

That said, from what you've written the children's mother doesn't sound great either. I feel very sorry for the children involved in this situation.

I can't get past the term Baby Mum referring to the mother of 10 and 11 yo. When he was in a relationship with her. I thought Baby Mamma referred to a woman a man got pregnant but was never a partner to?

She's his children's mother.

I think k a lot of growing up is needed tbh?