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Step-parenting

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Original poster

Court orders

42 replies

fangle · 09/04/2022 14:40

I stupidly posted in AIBU and will request its deletion as I forgot all step parents are scum here but I'm genuinely confused as to how they can resolve this. Each thinks they are right. She thinks the weekends aren't included and he thinks holidays are separate from term time and should be split down the middle regardless and weekends should remain as they are with holidays superseding them but the pattern for weekends remains the same -

So if the court order says -

Children to live with the mother
Father to have contact during term time every other weekend (from end of school on Friday and return to school Monday) and one night in the week (Wednesday) and Half of the school holidays split equally between the parents arranged in advance ....

Then how do you split holidays?

My ex partner and I just split holidays down the middle in half so the kids don't have to go to and fro and it's easy for us to plan in advance as we both know if it's the last day of term and they would be with either of us then we "get" the first half or what ever. Straight forward and amicable. Apart from the summer holidays where if there's a special date or any thing we try and accommodate and make each other's lives easier so the children are settled and know what's going on.

What happens when parents can't agree? DP is having a mare with his ex and I can't advise as frankly I think it's ridiculous they're squabbling about numbers of nights and emailing spreadsheets to each other

So if it's a week holiday split in half down the middle

If it's two weeks (like Easter) and covers 3 weekends - how do you split it? My ex H and I split down the middle - our EOW remains constant and won't change - holidays get lapped over the top but the weekends don't change.

For example this Easter ex has them for first 10 nights then I have them - then they go back to school and they're back with me the consecutive weekend.

My partner and his x can't agree and she thinks the weekends aren't part of the holiday and shouldn't be included so she's saying he should have the DC 5 days extra over the next two weeks but when she wants him to - and she still gets them on "her" weekends meaning we can't go away on our booked holiday.

I'm confused and frankly hate the drama so any advise much appreciated. Hope this makes sense.

OP posts:

Original poster

fangle · 09/04/2022 18:37

@ThisMustBeMyDream pathetic it is! I think it's because she's trying to change how Christmas works out for her this year too. If it changes to this style of weekends not being in t he holiday she will get them for Christmas Eve and Christmas Day when in reality they're meant to be with their dad this year as they were with her last year.

Fucking people 😂 it's made me see my ex in a whole new light.

OP posts:

Pinkyxx · 09/04/2022 18:53

@Sayitaintsoiwillnotgo sorry totally mis-understood your point! agree with you.

ChoiceMummy · 09/04/2022 18:54

The order is quite specific, if of course you wish for it to be.
Children to live with the mother
Father to have contact during term time every other weekend (from end of school on Friday and return to school Monday) and one night in the week (Wednesday) and Half of the school holidays split equally between the parents arranged in advance

School holidays supercede the school term time arrangements.
By the ex's logic no contact would happen at weekends as the children aren't at school during weekends!
There are 13 weeks school holidays and inset days. So over the course of the year they each have 6.5 weeks of school holidays. Ideally they would have an equal share of each school break but other things may come up.
My suggestion would be to simply email her, citing the wording of the order, and that in accordance with the order these are the 6.5 weeks you wish to take, reminding her that this year is your ohs year for Christmas as agreed.
If she refuses, then explain that mediation and court costs will need to be pursued by her instigation, as you will be following the order to the letter and give her notice that you will have xyz weeks.

Finallylostit · 09/04/2022 19:02

Times like this I am grateful for such a half arsed twat for an EX when he was with his first new DP. He could not be arsed and 6 weekends per year was me expecting too much.
The first year despite 5 months notice he picked up DCS for the weekend and took them on holiday for 2.5 weeks - over the exact 2 weeks I had given him notice for and he had said was not enough notice.

AS that was my only summer leave from work I managed to move it and not be around the week they got back. Could have got a flight back within 2-3 hrs but as I officially did not know where they had gone or when they were returning there was little I could do. They ended up having the DCS for a further week - which royally messed up work for them!

After that I did what I wanted and he never took the DCS on holiday as could not afford to take his own on long haul holidays but could take his DPs!

After that he got an email twice per year telling him the years plans and I do not budge. Luckily his new DP is lovely and she and I co ordinate - all calm for 5 yrs now.

Soontobe60 · 09/04/2022 19:09

[quote fangle]@toobusytothink I think it's sensible that way too but he will have to seek clarification from the court. It's so frustrating why everything has to be a battle 😩[/quote]
Because there are 2 people who have different interpretations. She thinks she’s right, he thinks he’s right.
The court order is at fault here. They need to return to court to have it specified if they can’t agree.

OutingHobby · 09/04/2022 19:17

Sounds like they might have to go back to court and get it spelt out for them. Poor kid.

LittleOwl153 · 09/04/2022 22:18

If it changes to this style of weekends not being in t he holiday she will get them for Christmas Eve and Christmas Day when in reality they're meant to be with their dad this year as they were with her last year.

Ah now that's the crux of it... there had to be something! She's hoping he'll agree and not realise the impact on Christmas!

ChoiceMummy · 09/04/2022 23:07

@LittleOwl153

Ah now that's the crux of it... there had to be something! She's hoping he'll agree and not realise the impact on Christmas!

If it really is over Christmas, perhaps the easiest solution is to say she can have Christmas for a sensical approach?

LittleOwl153 · 10/04/2022 12:02

@ChoiceMummy by doing this dad looses both Easter weekend - and the booked and paid for holiday, and Christmas?

On the basis of OP/DH having the odd numbered weeks this means mum will have had easter and Christmas last year, is demanding effectively the same this year and by virtue of the weekend change will also have them next easter... and most of next Christmas. I wonder where birthdays fit into all of this?

Do you actually think that that is OK given that the arrangement is very close to 50/50 normally?

ChoiceMummy · 10/04/2022 17:10

[quote LittleOwl153]@ChoiceMummy by doing this dad looses both Easter weekend - and the booked and paid for holiday, and Christmas?

Do you actually think that that is OK given that the arrangement is very close to 50/50 normally?[/quote]
I think that if the mother's driving factor is the Christmas day situation, then give her Christmas day, say the rest of the holidays are split as should be, so none of that it's my weekend crap in school holidays and make own traditions for say Boxing day.

The focus should be on resolving this in the best interests of the children.

Let's be honest, how much effort is it likely the father put into Christmas when the couple were together? For many parents they see Christmas as a right and a point to get one over the other parent. Wouldn't the parent concerned rather have boxing day than this animosity?

Do you actually think that that is OK given that the arrangement is very close to 50/50 normally? the arrangement is 38% of the year with father versus nearly 62% with the mother, so yes, I do think that probably on balance, that Christmases should go to the parent with the lived with order in their favour as that is the child's primary/main home regardless of how this makes the other parent feel. This is about the child, do you think that it's in their best interests to be shunted from house to house each year for Christmas or better to have Consistency of knowing where they'll be without having to consult a calendar or court order?

ThisMustBeMyDream · 10/04/2022 17:32

I think it is far better for a child with a loving and involved father to spend christmas with them also.
That attitude is awful. Absolutely awful.
I had to watch my poor DSD have this done to her every year. It took until her 6th Christmas for the court order to be followed (the parents were never together beyond 3 months of dating). Seeing her little face on Christmas eve with her dad last year and her telling him how she was so excited... absolutely heartwarming. Just a wonderful moment for her to know that father Christmas came to daddy's house just in the same way as he came to mummy's house.

ChoiceMummy · 10/04/2022 18:09

@ThisMustBeMyDream

I think it is far better for a child with a loving and involved father to spend christmas with them also. That attitude is awful. Absolutely awful. I had to watch my poor DSD have this done to her every year. It took until her 6th Christmas for the court order to be followed (the parents were never together beyond 3 months of dating). Seeing her little face on Christmas eve with her dad last year and her telling him how she was so excited... absolutely heartwarming. Just a wonderful moment for her to know that father Christmas came to daddy's house just in the same way as he came to mummy's house.

Now I'll have to r honest and say that I'm for the best arrangement for the children. But this to me sounds like this was solely about what was right for the other parent, not the child.

A good non resident parent, would be focussed on making traditions that could well include a second visit from Father Christmas. So that's imo, a poor reason for pushing the order was adhered to.

And your comment really does illustrate why it was about the parent's needs.

Children shouldn't be carved into pieces to make the non resident parent feel better.

If it was what the child requested absolutely they should. If shared custody of 5050 absolutely. Less than no it shouldn't be the expectation. Sadly, so many NRPs only wish to be there for the good days, the special occasions, not for the dentist appointments, the school runs, parents evening, sad days, the learning to read and homework days....

ThisMustBeMyDream · 10/04/2022 18:25

What a waste of your time posting that. You clearly didn't read what I wrote. Or if you did, you made it in to what YOU wanted to see.

ChoiceMummy · 10/04/2022 19:55

@ThisMustBeMyDream

What a waste of your time posting that. You clearly didn't read what I wrote. Or if you did, you made it in to what YOU wanted to see.

You think that the father pushing for the order to be followed and that after 6 Christmases with the resident parent, the mother, that this was in the best interests of the child? A parent who was never in the child's life beyond eow fun days? No I read your post!

ThisMustBeMyDream · 10/04/2022 22:34

You clearly did not. Where on earth do you get "eow fun days" from? You don't. You made it up.
The best interest of the child is to have a loving, involved father. As I already said.
Stop being ridiculous.

Pinkyxx · 10/04/2022 23:15

Refusing to adhere to court ordered contact because one doesn't agree to what was ordered plainly isn't in a child's best interest. Nor is empowering a young child to 'choose' when / how contact happens. Where parents cannot reach a consensus themselves as to how contact ought to work, the court decides. If everyone respects the terms of the order then there's nothing further to debate around contact which reduces tension / conflict (which is harmful to any child). Adhering to the terms of the order also allows the child to settle into their new routine and enjoy their time with both parents - which is the ultimate objective of any court order.

JeffThePilot · 11/04/2022 00:19

Term time arrangements are suspended in the school holidays, which usually are considered to commence from the last day of term. It’s usually pretty clear.

Unfortunately there are a minority of parents who need the court to absolutely micromanage every single detail. Ridiculous but there you go.

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