Active discussions

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Step-parenting

Connect with other Mumsnetters here for step-parenting advice and support.

Original poster

Does anyone here believe CMS should take into account a step parents earnings and if so, why?

537 replies

PutItInYourPocket2 · 07/04/2021 12:21

Just curious as to people's opinions. I know the majority, or so it seems, believe they shouldn't take into account SPs earnings when calculating CMS or that SPs should be responsible if the bio parent cannot pay for whatever reason.

However it seems from reading another thread that there are those who believe they should.

If you do, what are your reasons?

OP posts:
Are your children’s vaccines up to date?
Set a reminder
Aimee1987 · 08/04/2021 17:07

It's more complicated than maintaining the lifestyle of the DSC especually when you take into account the nature of blended families.
My DPs ex had 2 more children. She stopped working after her child to her current husband was born. Why should my DP pr me ( who both work full time) maintain the lifestyle of her family when her and her DP choose not to work (he works part time)

User5747384 · 08/04/2021 17:07

"I don't know what the answer is, but it can't be right that parents (male or female) avoid paying because their new relationship means they can have domestic arrangements that don't require them to work."

Yes I agree it's definitely not right.
It's not something I could do at the expense of my DSS.
This is where the kids loose out and the NRP manages to avoid their responsibilities.

CMSARERUBBISH · 08/04/2021 17:09

@hashbrownsandwich

Yes I do. I'll give you my scenario. ExH and his newW have a company which makes around £10k a month. ExH takes only a few hundred pounds a month as his pay. The wife takes a large sum. ExH puts into the CMA calculator his own personal earnings. It also asks how many children reside with him. He has 2 with me (who only stay one night a week there) and his Wife has 2 of her own. So he counts her 2 as residing there. This therefore decreases the percentage that my children receive. Fair?
Not sure if you have tried this but If exH is a director of a Ltd company and only paying himself a low wage he probably tops up is wage by paying himself a dividend from the profits, this is monthly or annually. Unless asked he doesn't need to declare this on the CMS application. You need to ask CMS for a variation and state the reason being as a co director this is what he is doing to pay less tax. Most businesses do this, the CMS know this. They can then look at at his money via HMRC - any dividends will show there. Also read up on NRP purposely diverting money to avoid CMS - there is something they can do but I can't remember.
Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:10

If the non working nrp has the child 50% of the time, problem solved. Obviously doesn't always happen for various reasons.

That would be my requirement from either side.

BungleandGeorge · 08/04/2021 17:25

@Funfairballoon

If the non working nrp has the child 50% of the time, problem solved. Obviously doesn't always happen for various reasons.

That would be my requirement from either side.

What about the childrens wishes and continuity? You’re essentially changing an agreed residency purely because one partner wishes to give up work. I don’t believe a court would sanction that as being fair or appropriate. And the knocking of ‘poor choices’ this may be true but at the end of the day often the other parent has sanctioned and encouraged those choices so has some responsibility sometimes. If they were happy to have a non working partner looking after the house and children to avoid doing this themselves or paying for childcare they can hardly complain when the other person can’t get the best job in the world
Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:31

What if the children were fine with it?

Continuity? Fair enough if it's once a month to 50/50 but if a child has a good relationship with both parents there may be no issue at all.

Sanctioned and encouraged those choices?

Well dp never sanctioned his ex having a baby at 15 because he wasn't in a relationship with her. He encouraged her to try and get back to work but she refused. He paid for her driving lessons and a car to make it easier for her. Offered to pay for her to get some qualifications, she didn't want to do that.

I don't like this "mum gave up so much for dad" rhetoric because a lot of the time it's just not true.

He didn't particularly want her staying home with the kids until one was in highschool but he couldn't exactly force her to get a job could he?
.

Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:32

Essentially what you're saying is only mum's time counts, and only dad's money.

All too common a theme on this sight.

User5747384 · 08/04/2021 17:35

"What about the childrens wishes and continuity? You’re essentially changing an agreed residency purely because one partner wishes to give up work. I don’t believe a court would sanction that as being fair or appropriate.
And the knocking of ‘poor choices’ this may be true but at the end of the day often the other parent has sanctioned and encouraged those choices so has some responsibility sometimes. If they were happy to have a non working partner looking after the house and children to avoid doing this themselves or paying for childcare they can hardly complain when the other person can’t get the best job in the world"

I totally agree.

WhatWouldPhyllisCraneDo · 08/04/2021 17:38

All this thread actually shows is that there is no "one size fits all" solution and that actually the current system doesn't really work for anyone.

Theunamedcat · 08/04/2021 17:39

@Funfairballoon

What if the children were fine with it?

Continuity? Fair enough if it's once a month to 50/50 but if a child has a good relationship with both parents there may be no issue at all.

Sanctioned and encouraged those choices?

Well dp never sanctioned his ex having a baby at 15 because he wasn't in a relationship with her. He encouraged her to try and get back to work but she refused. He paid for her driving lessons and a car to make it easier for her. Offered to pay for her to get some qualifications, she didn't want to do that.

I don't like this "mum gave up so much for dad" rhetoric because a lot of the time it's just not true.

He didn't particularly want her staying home with the kids until one was in highschool but he couldn't exactly force her to get a job could he?
.

He didn't sanction his ex having a baby at 15? He had sex with her though right?
Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:42

No, he did not. That baby is not his. As I said he was not in a relationship with her then. The following two children are his.

JustLyra · 08/04/2021 17:46

Judging someone for having a child at 15 is a new low on these threads.

Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:48

@JustLyra

Judging someone for having a child at 15 is a new low on these threads.
It's okay to judge step mother's though?

I'm not going to defend her decision because I don't think it was a good one, however she made it and she dealt with it. That was her right.

I'm not allowed to say it's not something I would have done? Or that it wasn't dps choice when he literally did not know who she was at that point?

User5747384 · 08/04/2021 17:49

"Judging someone for having a child at 15 is a new low on these threads."

I thought the same..

JustLyra · 08/04/2021 17:49

Children of 15 don’t decide to have children. Judging a child is a new low.

And nowhere on the thread have I judged step mothers. Would be a bit stupid given I am one.

ColdTattyWaitingForSummer · 08/04/2021 17:50

I don’t think the step parent’s income should be taken into account.. However as the RP if I moved in with a partner, my benefits would be reduced or stopped based on his income, and my older son would lose part of his university payments, as these are calculated on the household income of the RP. So the system needs to even things up.. either SPs are responsible or they aren’t.
And yes it galls sometimes watching my ex and his partner splashing the cash, while he barely pays towards his dc, but at the end of the day, that’s his conscience not mine.

Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:51

@JustLyra

Children of 15 don’t decide to have children. Judging a child is a new low.

And nowhere on the thread have I judged step mothers. Would be a bit stupid given I am one.

What do you mean they don't decide to?

She had a choice to have the baby or not have the baby?

You're judging me now for saying I wouldn't have had a baby at 15 Confused

JustLyra · 08/04/2021 17:51

And once again a situation (child maintenance dodging in general) that is, in the most part caused, by men ends with women being snarky and judging other women.

No wonder it never changes.

Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:52

@JustLyra

And once again a situation (child maintenance dodging in general) that is, in the most part caused, by men ends with women being snarky and judging other women.

No wonder it never changes.

You're judging me!

And yes her pregnancy was caused by a man, but it wasn't dp which is what I was explaining to above poster who didn't read.

JustLyra · 08/04/2021 17:52

You're judging me now for saying I wouldn't have had a baby at 15

Christ, that’s some leap...

I’m judging you, an adult, for your snide judgemental tone about a child.

Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:53

@JustLyra

You're judging me now for saying I wouldn't have had a baby at 15

Christ, that’s some leap...

I’m judging you, an adult, for your snide judgemental tone about a child.

Snide and judgemental? It was a decision I wouldn't have made.

She made the right decision for her, but undoubtedly it has had an affect on the rest of her life.

Should I lie and say it hasn't?

Would you tell your daughter that?

JustLyra · 08/04/2021 17:55

Your derision for her is dripping from your posts.

I would never speak to anyone about a decision they make as a child with your tone.

JustLyra · 08/04/2021 17:56

The fact you even mentioned it, when it’s completely irrelevant to the thread, says it all.

Bibidy · 08/04/2021 17:57

@SimonJT

I don’t think their partners income should have an impact on the amount, but I do think child maintenance should be a family bill, so if the NRP is out of work for any reason maintenance should continue to be paid at the usual rate. Losing a job etc isn’t a get out of jail card for the electric bill, so it shouldn’t get an NRP out of paying maintenance.
Sorry, don't agree.

Children have 2 parents and if one can't pay for whatever reason then the other parent needs to pick up that slack, not some random person one of the parents is in a relationship with.

Funfairballoon · 08/04/2021 17:58

@JustLyra

Your derision for her is dripping from your posts.

I would never speak to anyone about a decision they make as a child with your tone.

Maybe that's because she has been nothing but vile to me for years? Maybe it's because she's threatened my life several times? Or maybe because she smashed my car window? Stopped dp seeing his kids?

Certainly not because she had a baby at 15. That doesn't effect me at all.

But it did effect her life, and I was making a point out of it that I personally as a step parent should not have to pay for her children because of decisions she has made that have fuck all to do with me.

You can sneer at me all you like, honestly, if it makes you feel better but it's obvious what I was getting at.

If you want to pretend having a baby at 15 didn't effect her life in any way, you do that, but it's bullshit and we all know it.