Am I being unreasonable??

[lovenotwar321]

Me and my partner have been together for 7 years he has 2 children from a previous relationship that we have every other night. 5 months ago i gave birth to our child and obviously things in our household just got a whole lot busier. My partner doesnt finish work until 6pm every night and then every other night collects his children after work and by time they get home our child is in bed and i have cooked them all dinner. One of my partners children plays football and goes training once a week and plays a football match every weekend. I cook and clean for all the children even though they are teenagers and old enough to help out although it would be me making them do this as my partner always forgets and wants an easy life but i dont want to be the bad guy. My partner has started going to the pub every friday night after work now and he works hard so i understand he needs to let off steam but it means that most of the week he doesnt see our child apart from he gets up for an hour every morning whilst i sleep. He then takes his child football training every other week after work when it lands on our night and football matches again every other weekend. The childrens mother does not take the child either training or football on her nights my partner has to arrange lifts.

So my question is this am i being un reasonable to ask my partner to stop taking his child football training every other week and to stop going to the pub every friday. I never want to get in the way of a relationship with his children but its just too much at the moment our child is still up 3 or 4 times a night and i do it all but he helps on the weekend. The football matches means hes normally gone most of the day on the weekend and training means he doesnt get home until 9pm and he says his child is missing out if he doesnt take them and its not fair to keep relying on other people to take them. With him now going to the pub i feel like ive had enough of constantly being alone and raising our child and cleaning up after every one but dont see a solution to changing things. Ive gone mad at him tonight a build up of emotions and he says im over reacting and its mot fair to ask him to do that. I just want to know if i am being unreasonable or if im not the only one who thinks hes got to make changes and he cant always take his child football as he now has 3 and a partner to share his time with.

I do think that children do have to make sacrifices when a parent has other children
Planned sacrifices, when it is discussed before, arrangements are considered, possibly, but to have the baby, and then in a tantrum demand that they don't get to enjoy their activities any longer is totally unreasonable.

How far away is training? Is it a case that by the time he drops them and come back, it would be almost time to go out again?

Pub, why can't he come home, put baby to sleep and then go out again and then agree that it is eow only, the other Friday, he cooks a meal or order something and you have quality time together as a couple?

I hate how parents of younger children assume that teenagers don't need their parents any longer. If anything, I think it is the time they need their parents the most, clearly not showing it, but it is a time they need reassurance that their parents still love and care for them, and still need directions when they pretend to know all about life but deep inside are full of doubts.

I didn’t take my son to football this morning due to his younger siblings being really hard work. I do feel extremely guilty and I will make it up to him later and take him swimming.

For an older child it’s the reality of having younger siblings. This vision that older siblings must never ever once miss anything is unrealistic because it will happen at some point. I do feel terrible, but I still stand by my point that sometimes older children will end up compromising. Not saying it’s right. Just saying it’s a reality.

I’ve been on these threads on and off for 4 years and (as a mum and ex partner to a man with children) I can see why so many women do come on here and are judgemental.

1. you knew this was his commitment to his children when you decided to have another child. That was your and his choice, knowing his commitments to his children. To now expect any of it to change (regarding the football) is completely unreasonable. You chose to have another child knowing his commitments and no I don’t think it’s fair that his children now lose time with their dad because he chose to have another child. These years will pass incredibly quickly.

2. I also think this man is getting a hard time and you need a bit of a reality check. Let’s look at this.
   He gets up everyone morning and spends an hour with your child. Letting you sleep.
   Every other night he is home by 6pm to put his child to bed.
   Every other night he is collecting his other children and actively parenting them.
   Then every other weekend he spends a whole day supporting his children / bonding with them over what they evidently love.
   I presume on top of this that he is also working fulltime and supporting all his children? And you? (Correct me if I’m wrong on the last point).

3. please reread all of the above and think about just how much this man hauls ass for his family and all his children. Then read some other threads about how useless some men actually are.

4. you have an issue with doing the extra work that his teenagers should be doing? Tackle that with him. I agree, children should pull their weight. My children (since ages of 9/10) make their beds, clean their rooms, bring their dirty washing down, set and clear table, load and empty dishwasher....do you get the point? You’re not the maid, make them step up.

5. you have an issue having no quality time. Or your time. Tackle the every friday night at the pub. And as many others have said, what about twice a month instead. And then once a fortnight he stays with the baby and gives you a night out.

6. don’t touch the football. Or the practice training or the matches. This matters to kids. And he’s right. He cannot perpetually expect other people to ferry his kids. It works now because other people help him and then when he does the runs. He most likely offers to help/ take others. The fact that his EXW doesn’t take the kids is her problem and the children will remember that, trust me.

I would have loved more children. As would have my ex partner. I made the decision to not have them, knowing that it would have spread us all too thin and actually, us having another child wouldn’t have been in the best interests of our existing children.

I’m not knocking your decision to have a child. But if I had gone ahead and had a child with my exDP, I was under no illusion as to where that child would have come in the pecking order when it came to his NR children. EOW I would have been with our child as all his time and energy pivoted to fulfilling the needs of his NR children. Which was the right thing to do, for him and his children.

Was I prepared to bring another child into that? No. And if I had. I would have sucked it up knowing we made that choice with what we already had on our plates.

And for people coming on here and giving examples of what happens in families with ‘siblings’, you’re deliberately simplifying dynamics that are not the same in second/ blended/ step families.

Sibling relationships are intensely secure. As are parent / child relationships. Biology / evolution has ensured that. My children can take chunks out of each other one minute and within minutes be best friends again. Step sibling relationships are not that secure (and research is showing this). You have intensely complex emotional dynamics at play. Especially within children.

If I had had another child with my expartner and my eldest children had to start missing something they loved to compromise for the child. Trust me. It would cause immense issues. Far more than if that was a full sibling between their dad and me. Because at the end of the day, it’s another full version of them. Biology.

sassbott

My children have an older sibling who they are close to. I’d expect the same sort of compromises to apply e.g. if it was my stbx’s child in the position my ds was in today, I’d still see it as the reality of having younger siblings.

My stbx is moving out on Monday. Meaning my children will be from a “broken family” too. Does that mean my children will suddenly start getting special privileges? Where do I sign them up?

But if I had gone ahead and had a child with my exDP, I was under no illusion as to where that child would have come in the pecking order when it came to his NR children. EOW I would have been with our child as all his time and energy pivoted to fulfilling the needs of his NR children. Which was the right thing to do, for him and his children.

Is this supposed to mean your child would come last in the pecking order? I don't agree that that's right at all, my partner made the decision to have a second child knowing that things would have to adjust as a result, and I expect him to split his time accordingly and prioritise them equally during the time he is with both of them. There is no pecking order, any more so than there would be if they were both mine. I would not have had a child under those conditions and my child is no less his child than the older one is.

In fact to the contrary of what you're saying, I made it quite clear to my partner that any extra slack that came from his decision to have two children would fall to him - so I wouldn't be endlessly doing it all at home and with our little one so he could focus entirely on his other child, he would be the one to need to find a way of balancing both because it was his decision to have both. He totally agreed.

I don't think very many parents or step parents would deliberately try to make the older children sacrifice something where there were other ways of finding the time (in this case, for example, the dad could stop going to the pub before he resorted to stopping the football training), but the backlash against step parents mentioning compromise always seems to come up when they voice the opinion that there should be the same level of compromise as there would be in a conventional family, which is rarely none. It is not a gospel truth that this should not be the case, it is a very logical and non malicious part of a parents decision to have more than one child.

@funinthesun19 Yes sadly she lost her baby! I don't know why you would think that would make me happy in any way whatsoever?! Having more children always has an impact on older siblings whether they are all living together or not and my children have suffered the hardest consequence of that, through their fathers choices. Now that baby may not have been born, but I have no doubt in my mind that they will more than likely try again and good luck to them. I wouldn't wish the loss of a child on anyone.

I cook and clean for all the children even though they are teenagers and old enough to help out although it would be me making them do this as my partner always forgets and wants an easy life but i dont want to be the bad guy

Why do you act like a martyr and then complain when he behaves like the selfish twat that you've enabled him to be?
He doesn't actually parent his own kids at home, leaving all that responsibility to you, and you decided to have a child with him?!!!!

How about you step back from "treating them like my own" until HE accepts responsibility for ALL his kids?
He's got it cushy, you do everything for him other than wiping his arse...and he ACTS like a parent when it suits him, like when he wants to avoid home responsibilities and enjoy 'playtime'.

He KNOWS he's taking the piss, he just doesn't care - that's why he decided adding in weekly pub visits was mandatory now too.
It's all about HIM.
You do everything at home and for the kids yet you don't recognise that as 'work' yourself? You don't demand 'downtime' for yourself?

You're bringing all on yourself.
Find some self respect, tell him to stop the weekly pub visits and step up at home whilst YOU take a step back to concentrate on your baby and health.
If he wants to go pub etc then he needs to do the childcare so YOU can also take some time out for yourself.....i bet he'll complain about that though, probably doesn't even know how to change a nappy let alone anything else

Its very clear that there are a large amount of people that make assumptions on other peoples relationships without knowing much about them or reading my OP properly. Just for those of you who have decided to judge us having a baby we decided to do this because we both wanted a child we have a lot of love to give and had IVF 3 times to successfully concieve our daughter. During the time of me undergoing the second treatment my partners son decided to take football up again after having a year out so no the commitment was not in place before our planned pregnancy. Secondly at the time of conceiving our child my patner had a different job which finished earlier in the afternoon but was made redundant when i was nearly ready to pop. Fortunatley he found another job quickly but the hours are longer. NO ONE knows what it is like to have a baby, physically and emotionally and how it will affect your life and sanity until you ACTUALLY DO IT regardless of what people tell you, also it depends on what sort of baby you have if they struggle with reflux alot are a good sleeper etc. Im actually dissapointed that a place called Mumsnet is full of judgemental aholes most likley parents themselves who maybe have forgotten how physically draining it can be. Handbagsatnoon also maybe you should have thought a bit more carefully about who you had children with before doing so clearly with a man who does not put their needs first. monkeymonkey2010 again thanks for passing judgement without knowing, my partner is a great guy he works his arse off to provide for his family and does not take the piss deliberatley just somtimes has tunnel vision and needs pursuading to do more around the house just like most men we all know. I purposley try not to have a go at his kids to do more as they have not had it the easiest and i care for them.I had trouble with my own dad and partner so would never want them to feel the way i did in their house. I do everything i can to help my partner as we are a team but somtimes theres things we dont see eye to eye on and discuss it until its resolved. I have apologised to him for asking him to stop the training i am well aware it is valuable time with his son and dont want to be that person but also am only human and have needs too. He has agreed to stop going to the pub every friday instead agreeing to go once a month. I wouldnt have had a child with him had he been a piss taker as im not the sort of person to pop children out with anyone. So again thanks for passing judgement all lol i cant tell there are lots of angry folk wanting to have a pop at people who are generally asking for some valuable opinions as they dont want to do somthing wrong. Pretty sure it will be the last time I do. Thanks to those sharing their veiws in constuctive and no judgmental ways. Im no longer going to be active on this post as the issue has been resolved so keyboard warriors eat your heart out.

@lovenotwar321 You're right, but after being with someone for 13 years and also trying for a baby for 4 of those years you'd think I knew him pretty well?! unfortunately for me and my very much loved and longed for dc, their father decided he'd much prefer to stick his penis elsewhere and leave the family home as he couldn't handle the responsibility of being a dad, but of course I'm to blame for that aren't I?

I'm sick to my back teeth of woman like you who think it's ok to throw accusations around at other womens choice of men, therefore taking away the blame from the feckless father and its women like you who stand behind those men believing all their stories about how bad their ex is and what she does and does not do.

And I think the only keyboard warrior on here is you, you were obviously bored and knew exactly the reaction you wanted. Hope you had fun

and you both really should have thought about what was going to happen before you had children

your words to me, if you cant take it dont give it.

Oh I can take it, clearly you can't!
I didn't know my ex was a cheat, you knew your partner had children before you both decided you wanted more.

I stand behind my pp, you should have thought about what was going to happen with his older dc, he's their father as much as he's a father to your DD. Imagine how she would feel if you were to break-up and he has another child with someone else and they ask him to stop doing an activity with your daughter.

I was under no illusion as to where that child would have come in the pecking order when it came to his NR children

Fair enough to decide not to have a child for all the practical reasons stated but this is just hideous. How could you be with a man who you really honestly thought would treat his own flesh and blood, his child with you, as second class??

@lovenotwar321 God you've had a hard time on this thread!

I actually don't think you're being unreasonable at all. How far away is this football training that your partner has to stay for the entire duration with a 16-year-old? Surely it's fairly local for him to be in the team? At that age I'd be expecting to drop off and pick up, max.

Is there no way SS can get there on public transport and then your partner can just pick him up after?

I feel for you and it sounds like you're getting the raw end of the deal, having to do everything at home for all of the kids while your partner picks up the easiest bits. Maybe you should swap and you drop your SS to training! Then sit there for the 2 hours and have some time to yourself .

@Youseethethingis I am with that man because he prioritises his children who hardly get to see him.
Why would I not be with a man who had children and tries to hard to ensure their needs are met?

This isn’t about him treating our child second class one bit. This is about the reality of what stepfamilies see happening day in/ day out. This board is full of examples like this, books and blogs are full of examples like this. Spend time with a counsellor who specialises in step families and these issues are everywhere.

What’s the issue? The parent who has resident children and then NR child/ children (most likely EOW contact) genuinely struggle to meet everyone’s needs. In their minds, they see their resident child every day. That child gets the time and attention. That child is not going without, that child is the abundance. The NR children are scarcity. Their contact is limited and controlled (perhaps via strict court orders), and that very naturally lends to emotional dynamics that become unhealthy very quickly. And they are insidious in how they creep in. None of it is deliberate.

So why am I with someone like that? Because he’s human. And if I was in his shoes, I can imagine that naturally my energy and attention would pivot to the child I didn’t live with and didn’t see.

I wasn’t blind. I opened my eyes to the reality of the situation. And accepted that, for us, this wasn’t the right thing to do.

Second marriages where children pre-exist from a previous relationship have divorce rates in the 70’s/ 80% mark. They’re through the roof. It’s issues like this that break those relationships. And it takes trust, communication, compromise and a lot of work to get through these issues. From both adults.

@funinthesun19 I can’t actually decipher your post. What on Earth are you talking about? What special privileges is it that you think my children have and yours should get?

All well and good but I still can’t see the good in driving a wedge between siblings like that. My DH operates as a father of two when DSD is with us. I can’t imagine it ever being any other way.

You are no different to most mums in this world, you want the best for your the child you love so intensively. That's normal. However, this love seems to have tinted your perception of reality.

It's not true that parents take things away from their elder kids just so that their younger can have more. It doesn't work like that. I don't know one child who was told that they would have to stop and activity they were committed to, just so that one of their parent could spend more time with their new sibling, especially when that parent spend time with that sibling already that they don't get. It just doesn't happen like that because you wouldn't shift the happiness and security of one child for another.

What gives up is quality time between the couple. Most parents I know spend their evenings and week-ends juggling, between work, kids' activities, housework, and allowing each other a few breaks. In your case, it is to sleep later in the mornings, for your OH, it's his time at the pub. What becomes an absolute luxury is quality time together as a couple (and why many end up breaking up sadly).

It is without a doubt the consequences of kids doing more outside of the home, as well as couples not willing to accept the reality of being parents and that the time will come when they will have more quality time together (and wish they had less :)).

You are extremely defensive and come across as justify everything to suit your needs. You are clearly unhappy so there's nothing wrong in talking to your OH and see what he can do different to help a bit, and giving up some time at the pub is reasonable, but similarly, you need to accept that you can't have the perfect life you imagine and that his kids do deserve what their parents committed to them.

It's great that your SC are active outside of the home rather than glue on the Xbox or phone. It's great that their dad is encouraging them to do so. One day, it will be your child who will want to do these activities. In all your heart, can you say that you'd feel to guilt if you were to tell her she had to stop and activity she loved and that you take her too and enjoyed going to see, if your OH suddenly said that he wanted to spend time with you during these times?

As said, I don't know one parent who has told their eldest that they had to stop and activity so that one of their parent could have more time with their younger ones. They share their time, which is what your OH seems to be doing.

@Youseethethingis then your DH has it figured out and is able to be a hands on parent with both his NR child and your child. Without any guilt. Good for him. Maybe he has high EQ, maybe there is no conflict between him and his DD’s mum. Maybe he was happy for his marriage/ partnership to end. Either way, he’s fully available to both his children and can manage that.

Not everyone is in that space. Some men didn’t end their marriages, then have to fight to see their children. And then live with the knowledge that another man (who was your replacement) is now raising your children with your exwife. That’s a tough pill to swallow. And leads to a host of very conflicting emotions. I couldn’t imagine how that would feel.

And sadly where there is conflict between the parents, this emotionally can severely impact the children too. So the last thing his existing children would have reacted well too was seeing daddy with a baby who lives with him. Again, threads and board are full of stories where sadly the arrival of a baby has sent an existing SC off the rails behaviourally. Leaving SM’s and fathers tearing their hair out wondering what has happened.

I’m with my DP yes. But at least I saw the writing on the wall and didn’t sign up to to a life of being left holding our baby EOW. Maybe if my DP had been like yours. I would have taken the plunge and Had another child.

But my DP’s limitations don’t make him a bad person. I respect him for his focus on his children. If the myopic EOW focus remains then I will never live with him, because the reality is that it isn’t a healthy dynamic to live with or bring into a new relationship. He’s working on it, and starting to be able to be more balanced and actively consider wider needs (especially if his siblings and nieces and nephews are visiting)....it used to be all about his children until it was pointed out to him (by me), that his approach was grossly unfair to the rest of the children and that if he wanted to teach his children the art of compromise and thinking about other people’s needs, then he needed to start doing that with his nieces and nephews and indeed my children. Otherwise within a few years these children would vote with their feet as mid teens and do their own thing.

I’m not saying by any means that the OP’s situation is ideal. It isn’t. But when I went to see my counsellor she told me her days are choc a block full with stories like these and relationships at breaking point as a result.

What’s needed is more education and discussion and support. More counsellors trained up whom understand these dynamics. Less judgement. And an acceptance that second family dynamics are intensely complex.

@Dontdisturb I completely agree. When my youngest was a baby my older ones were playing football on weekends. The arrival of the baby didn’t stop that. We divided and conquered. Eventually when the baby was a toddler and the weather played, they too joined. Families (even with full siblings) spend the weekends ferrying their children to their respective activities.

Still unclear why he should feel guilty for not dropping DS like a hot potato as soon as DSD appears. There has been conflict and issues but he’s still DS father, regardless of the state of relations with his ex that day.
It’s interesting the way step-parenting threads go sometimes. One will says it’s the step child’s home too and of course they should have the largest bedroom because they are the eldest. Then allowances must be made because it’s not really their home is it, if their mum isn’t there. Then it will be that the SM has to respect the mother and not overstep by going to the school play/telling the child off/ taking the child to see a film at the cinema before the mother has. Then it’s that the children have to all be treated the same at all times, so the SMs children shouldn’t get a holiday if they can’t afford to take step kids too, even if those kids have just spent a month trekking around Florida 5*. Then the SM should be leaving an equal share of her assets to her step kids in her will. Then she should accept that the step kids aren’t her kids real siblings after all, because it’s complicated, and so they should be happy being ditched by their dad when they are around.
Not all of these things can be true. It’s an absolute minefield and we all must find our own way. Very glad you made the decision you did though - your set up sounds like it could have been awful for everyone concerned.

I laughed at your last post @yousee. You’ve hit the nail on the head. You’re damned if you do. You’re damned if you don’t. Nothing is ever right or enough or it’s too much or it’s too little.

You’re spot on, all of these things are for us to navigate based on the people we are dealing with and how the children are doing. Yes, bringing another child into my situation would have been the worst thing I could have done. Sad but true.

And now I don’t have an ‘our’ child, it’s made life a lot more binary and easier.

1. My DP’s children are not my children and nor are they siblings to my 3 children. They are his children and mine are my children.
2. as such, my assets are fully protected (and would be if I moved in with him). My assets are for my retirement and for my children (if there’s anything left). They are not for my DP or his children. Their inheritances etc are for their parents to manage.
3. I pay my own way and as such, my children and I will take holidays. If my DP wishes to join, fine. If not, equally fine. Where I holiday (or don’t holiday) is not restricted by my DP’s DC, his restricted contact schedules or his financial situation.
4. My home is mine and my children’s home. Not his children’s home. They have homes with both their parents. They are welcome here and always lovely to see them. But until such time that their father is financially contributing (in equal measure) and living with me, this is not their home.

The above sounds potentially harsh, but because I haven’t bought another child into this situation, I can be more clean cut. My DP focusses on his children’s needs and I focus on mine. I’m not resentful or feeling hard done by. There’s zero conflict. And all the children (especially his) are now doing much better, because we haven’t forced a situation that their mother would have been able to make more negative.

Sad but very very true. I think there is no one size fits all and there are a lot of lovely adults trying so hard to make these situations work. Some (like your DP) evidently have it figured out. For others, they’re still rubbing sticks trying to discover fire.

What can you do?

How difficult for the children being one moment here and the next moment there but I guess they have gotten used to the pattern.

I do think it is important they keep up with their activities and esp where a new baby has come into the picture dont have too much change. Very soon they will be learning to drive and take themselves, though it doesnt feel like soon now. It is not there fault you both had another child.

I think your partner should not be going to the pub on Friday night. This is extremely selfish. Cant he go out to the pub after a taking to football on a non custody evening?

As said, I don't know one parent who has told their eldest that they had to stop and activity so that one of their parent could have more time with their younger ones

For balance, I don't know any parents who have allowed one child to have a hobby that takes up the whole weekend, and actually stick around every time rather than just drop them off, given that they wouldn't even be interacting with them there. Not one. They would either be dropped off and picked up or discouraged from doing something so time consuming when there is a whole family to consider. What is the other step child doing during that time, I wonder?

It might be a side effect of the typically larger age gaps between half siblings, and commitments being set up without a thought given to how it would impact a wider family, but I have never actually encountered a father sticking around for the hobbies of one child that take up several days a week when he has two other children.

It doesn’t sound harsh at all, just pragmatic and sensible.
I wouldn’t say DH has it figured out. He is hurt I’m not leaving my assets to his DD. But on the flip side, I don’t even get a birthday card from DSD because I’m not her mother, so it’s a bit much to expect me to take from my son and hand her potentially hundreds of thousands of pounds.
We lived in my house which I owned on my own before I met DH. I put it on the market weeks after I found out I was pregnant because I didn’t want DSD to feel pushed out ( in a two bedroom house owned by his mother, my child would absolutely have had the bedroom occupied by DSD) and then DH was pissed I assumed that the baby would get the bigger room. In a home that I put down the entire 50% deposit for, I was expected to consider giving my son, for his one and only bedroom in his one and only home (where ALL his stuff is), the smallest room. While the larger room sat empty about 2/3 of the time.
I actually found mumsnet years ago because I was trying to gain insight and understanding of DSDs mothers position and feelings when she was being a nightmare, stopping contact, picking fights etc. It was 2 years before I even met DSD and she still felt it was too soon and DH didn’t want to upset her. He had to force the issue in the end.
I’m afraid MN raises as many questions as it answers sometimes. As you say, we all just need to pick our way through our own particular situations as best we can.

For balance, I don't know any parents who have allowed one child to have a hobby that takes up the whole weekend

And that's not what happening here

but I have never actually encountered a father sticking around for the hobbies of one child that take up several days a week when he has two other children.

And neither is this.