Is it unreasonable to keep DD apart from DSD...

[notsonambysm]

Hello lovely andnotsolovely stepmothers!

So most of you know my tale of woe but in a nutshell; DSD, 13, has been being alienated from DH over the past few years and things blew up at Christmas. Contact went from 50/50 to one day a week if that. Then 7 weeks ago, DH punished DSD for running up a huge phone bill (by enforcing no Iphone internet access for a month) and she finally voted with her feet with the support of her mother. (and said some utterly vile things about all of us e.g calling her Dad a little pussy and being cruel about his apperence in a really personal way)

Since Oct time last year she has been increasingly cruel to my daughter (6) who has loved her like a sister for the past 4.5 years (i.e. as long as she can remember) and dd has really struggled with this and ultimately finally "losing" dsd. She thought it was something she had done and her fault, despite me telling her otherwise. She has become very clingy, particulalrly at bedtime, and although she's stopped talking about DSD now, I find a lot of hidden drawings and stories that she has done for her so she is obviously hurting.

We all feel like we're greiving in different ways. It's been really hard. A week or so ago DH and I were on the brink of seperating because he was so down about things he was taking it out on me and withdrawing from me. I told him that if he didn't start concentrating on what he does have then he'd lose everybody and since then we have really turned a corner. Following this, the week before last, DH took it upon himself to go to DSD's mums house to talk to them both. DSD was vile and called him horrible names and said she would never see him again. But followed up late that night with a text to say he was still her dad and she wanted to work things out . Great news!! Dh was delighted and I was very happy for him.

A week on (last weekend) he took her for breakfast and he reported that she was chatty and pleasant and they had a lovely time. They agreed that he would see her for a few hours each weekend to start with and see how things went.

Then on Wednesday he told me that as my mum and family was visiting us this Sunday, he was going to ask DSD if she wants to come round. My dd will be at home, plus my sister and her little boy, my mum and her boyfriend etc. I (kindly but assertively) told him that I am not putting my DD in the line of fire for being hurt again and want some kind of assurance (as much as you can with things like this) That she's not going to disappear again the next time things don't go her way. An apology would be nice, but in the absense of that - a steady history of contact and normal reactions to discipline etc. I'm happy for her to stay here, just not when DD is around.

I thought that is was sensible and reasonable to want to protect my dd. I also thought it was far too soon for his and DSD's fragile relationship to be placed under the microscope/ limelight like that. They need to nurture it and get to know each other again. I made it clear that I wasn't just thinking of my DD but also his.

Anyway, he said he would "go along with it" if that's how I feel but only if it was a few weeks. And he wasn't happy about it. He looked really hurt like I was pissing on his fire in terms of the positive developmenets that have happened recently which obvously I don't want to do.

What do you guys think? Am I being cruel to him? Am I over thinking it? Or am I right to protect my DD? Maybe because DSD isn't my own child, I'm not able to think the est of her like he is. I'm just sick of my DD being trampled all over.

There is I'm sure an element of my own upset too. I have been very badly effected by "losing" my DSD. I am also still angry at her. There has been no apology for what she has done and she is still denying that her behaviour is wrong in any way. I get the vibe that she is "forgiving" her Dad rather than seeing that she has been unreasonable and wanting to make amends. And also, seeing as she sighted me in a lot of her reasons for how she hates coming here, I'm not happy to sweep it under the rug just so we can play happy families.

In short - I think that DH is putting a plaster over the problems and running way before he can walk.

But if I say that I will be faced with the expession of someone who's puppy has been shot.

What should I do?

namby you can set your own boundaries and make them clear to your DP.

The issue of suddenly spending a holiday with you after a prolonged period of no contact is one that we faced - and DP was strongly advised that it could do untold damage to reintroduce DSD to the 'family' while their own relationship was so fragile.

Your DP is not currently 'parenting' his DD - there are no rules, consequences or boundaries that he is enforcing. If she joins you for a week before that has been re-established, on what basis is she spending time with you? As a guest with no rules? How will that affect their relationship in the future - not to mention the damage it will do to you and your DP? Or will he suddenly start to parent her again; how well will that work unless she has respect for him?

There is nothing wrong with you saying; I'm happy for DSD to join us for a family holiday, but only if we attend family counselling first. He doesn't have to get his exW permission, and he can take his DD along to an appointment without telling her that her mum disapproves. He should do what he thinks is right, not what will keep the peace with his ex and DD - if he doesn't, then he is DisneyDad, wanting to be the popular one - and we all know where that leads!

All the while you are worried about being a WSM, and so compromise and tolerate being put last in your DPs priorities, he will keep pushing you further and further down that list. You owe it to your DD and yourself to stand up for your own values and beliefs - not allow them to be ridden roughshod over because you somehow think that will make you 'look bad'. Any decent partner would respect you for standing up for yourself, even if they don't agree with your POV. If your so scared of what will happen if you draw a line in the sand and say 'no more' then what does they say about the state of your own relationship?

You're very right NADM. I'm not very assertive really. I am confident but the problem comes when asking to be put first, or for my feelings to be considered above someone elses. I don't know why, but I feellike I don't deserve it. That's probably why I am so keen on fighting for DD's feelings.

DSD already knows that Mum wont allow counselling. So it really is a no go sadly. She just won't do it.

What makes it worse, I don't know if you'll remember this from a previous thread, but the holiday is staying at my aunts house in France. DSD didn't ant to go ariginally. But no wants to. Because of the baby it is her only holiday this year, she is keen to get away rather than send time with her dad and I. She has said as much. And her friend is coming, and it's in a quiet area ithout a lot to do. I can just see disaster ahead but not sure how to broach it with DH... he seems so much happier... And if/ wehn he tells DD she will either think that he is retracting the offer and hate him for it. Or know that it is me and hate me for it. Which I don't really care about but I don't want to be the factor that sends her off on one again. It's such a mess really isn;t it. How cana 13 year old have such an impact on a family!?

Sorry for the awful typos!!!

Have I read this right OP? There are posters disagreeing with you about keeping dsd away from her half sister, but as I understood it the girls aren't related? Your dd has a different father to dsd so aren't half sisters, is that right?

I think you are doing the right thing by protecting your daughter from anymore hurt.

Hi there, no they're not related. They met about 4/5 years ago when dd was just turned 2 and dsd was 9. Dsd spent 50/50 with us until last Dec and as dd spends every other weekend with her dad the girls were nearly always together when here at our house and got very close. Particularly dd as she doesn't really remember a time when she didn't have a "sister".
But no, no relation at all really.

Parenting involves giving DCs choices.

What your DP could say in this situation is that of course she can go on holiday with you, you are both looking forward to it - but because of the recent issues between you all, it is important that they are resolved so everyone (including her friend) can enjoy themselves, and so a condition of the holiday is that she attends family therapy recommended by the school/GP for these types of situations.
He could go on to say that if she's not ready for that, then that's fine, he totally understands - they can pick up their 'getting to know each other' dates again when you get back

So what if she turns it round on you or him. She's 13 - she only has that power to affect your family and household if you give her that power.

Oh, and i do think that you should stop contacting her directly - until she has a stable relationship with your DP, I don't think you should be a part of her life at all.
At the moment, you are giving her the impression that your relationship with her is unconditional - that you will always be there for her if she needs you. You won't - your DD comes first and your DSD has her own parents, you do not fulfil that role.
My DP explained this to his DD recently, by comparing my feelings about how DSD treated me and DD with how DSD would feel if someone hurt her favourite pony or best friend - it left her with a lot to think about!

I wish I was as strong as you NADM. I guess I just miss her really. Under all the annoyance over her actions, I am still mourning the little girl I decided I was going to love as my own.
It feels so wrong to not forgive her, she's only a child and is only reacting to the abuse that her mum has subjected her too. I am angry, an fearful for Dd, and DH, and myself. But... I don't know. It really is a tough one.

But of course you forgive her! It's not about holding a grudge or being pissed off - its about teaching her life skills

If your own DD was rude, disrespectful, abusive - there would be consequences, and you wouldn't give in and not enforce those just because you felt sorry for her when she turned on the tears or missed out on something she wanted to do.
This is no different. Your DSD made a choice. It might be one that she made while under the influence of someone else, or to avoid negative consequences from her mum, but it was still a choice and there are consequences to that.
If she was totally out of control, unable to conform to rules and expectations in all aspects of her life, then you could argue that she couldn't help herself when she made that phonecall to your DP, and said all those dreadful things to him face to face.

But it was a deliberate, conscious choice on her part - and so far, she has avoided any natural or imposed consequences because you and your DP want everything to go back to the way it was. By you and he behaving as if it didn't happen, she is more likely to do it again

I know that this isn't easy - but I honestly believe that you are at a crossroads. If you allow her to behave with impunity towards you, excusing her behaviour because of her age, or alienation, then it will continue into her adulthood and your DPs relationship with her will be based on disrespect (from her) and acquiescence (from him).
What my DP is realising is that his DD needed that separation from him in order to realise the value of the relationship; although it was hell at the time, having no contact for 18 months was probably the best thing for her under the circumstances; it gave her the space to work things out for herself without the constant emotional conflict and pressure placed on her by her mum.

Yes, I think so. That's why I am concerned that he is walking way before he can run. I told him today I thought that it would be better if he had to wait years but ended up with a "real" relationship than that she agrees to come back under duress because either he has bought her approval, or it is just to give her mum a rest and/or to escape crying baby etc. he said he agreed but I don't know.

I'm in agreement with op and catsmother, NADM, Kaluki et al.

My sd is 18. My life without her is well, just easier. My son who's 11 asks why she doesn't come anymore (been over a year) and I feel that she too won't just be able to arrive and the red carpet will be unfurled. Ds did want to know if her absence was anything to do with what he'd done. Now, he has OCD and has enough guilt to last anyone a lifetime! There is no way I'll allow her to upset me and him again. She can, must have a relationship with her dad. I don't have 'unconditional love' for her. If anyone else in my life had treated me this way, I'd have turned my back. For good.

Goodness, do you think the OCD etc is related to what happened with step sister?

No, not at all. However, I will not give her the opportunity to ignore his attempts at being friendly. The last time he did, she said not one word, turned away and walked off.