Feeling a bit defeated

[glasscompletelybroken]

Had issues from the start - 5+ years ago - with DH's ex controlling things here. She started with all kinds of rules about what I could & couldn't do with dsd's and for various reasons we have gone along with it. In the last year or so things seemed to improve for a while but then took a step back with her saying again that I couldn't look after them on my own etc.

Lots of other things have happened in the last 4 or 5 months which sent us off to a solicitor and at the end of several hundred pounds spent she had a letter from DH solicitor which included a paragraph about parental responsibility and how when the girls are here she has no right to dictate what happens.

Now this morning she has called to say dsd2 will be off school tomorrow as has been sick today and exW has to work. She said that dsd2 has asked that either Daddy or nanny look after her and not Glass.

She has just found a clever way to get round the issue by saying it is dsd who wants this, rather than her demanding it. Maybe it is but I think dsd2 is just being manipulated - as we all are.

I know it's a small thing but I feel really down about it. It seems that whatever we do she always has the last word and gets what she wants. Am I really not good enough to look after this child? I'm good enough to clean and cook for her and financially contribute to her life but nothing else.

Just wanted to say all that really - I know there's no real answer when you're dealing with someone so manipulative.

NanaNina is right but it is wrong - for DH's ex it is me caring for the girls that she can;t cope with. In the beginning her rules were very strict - I could cook and clean for them but do absolutely nothing that could constitute caring for them. I was specifically banned from brushing their hair, reading them stories. taking them to the loo, the list is endless.

I just think that the more people that care about you the better and if she could behave like an adult for 5 minutes she might see the harm she is doing to the children she likes to think she is doing the best for.

Yes glass in an ideal world women in these situations would be able to be rational enough and emotionally strong enough to put the needs of the child first, and realise that if the adults can get along, then this is so much better for the children and result in them not feeling divided loyalties etc.

However it isn't an ideal world and all sorts of human emotions are played out in the step parenting issue. I know it must be very frustrating to be banned from personal careof the SC but I think so many posters are complaining of this kind of thing that it means that the bio mother just cannot cope with her ex'sWife or partner caring for the children of her and the bio father who is now is another relationship. Sorry I know this is stating the obvious.

I have in the past been a part of these complex relationships. My DP was SF to my son, I was SM to his kids and my son had contact with his father and P. DP and me had a child between us.
I consider myself to be a very rational, mature person, but it was all a mess really. All the stuff that appears in these threads happened - I was angry with DP for seeing no wrong in his kids, but criticising mine, and I never felt any fondness for his kids. Their mother was provocative and would be over familiar with my DP when she came to drop off the kids and once started a conversation with him (in front of me) about him paying for their children to have private education. One time she arrived early and we were eating and she put her daughter at the table and took half of DPs food on the child's plate. It wasn't that I minded feeding the child, it was just the way she took over that I hated.

I have to say I loathed my son seeing his father and his P. My son told me once that ex's P changed his clothes when he got to their house and changed them back before bringing him back. I thought this was ridiculous but when I complained she got all huffy and said I needed to remember that xxxxx half belonged to his father.

Thank god this is all behind me and my sons have turned out great - afraid I never really had a good r/ship with my SD and nothing has changed now she is grown and has her own kids, my SS is a nice lad and we support him as much as possible.

You are absolutely right glass in what you say in your last para but I think that it must be partof the human condition for many women not to be able to think in this way and their own emotions overwhelm them and take away any rational thought.

unfortunately you are right nana and it happens all the time , i just dont really understand why.
yes i get the hurt in relationships cloud judgements and its always going to sting to see your ex with some else i dont care who you are.
but i want my children to have a good time at there dads, i want them to be able to be free to come and tell me about it. i dont want my behaviour to cause problems in his house and perhaps have a detrimental effect on my children care while there iyswim.
i already have some stored up feeling about the dsc from the exs behaviour. when the door bell goes i get a tightening in my chest and a sense of dread just wondering what is the next thing to be said or done. its so not fair on them they are good and lovely kids.
its like swimming with invisible jelly fish just when you have relaxed wham out come the shocks.
what makes it harder for me to understand is that i was in her exact same position, i was single mother of 3, separated after 10 yrs of marriage so i really struggle to see her point of view or share in her reasoning's for her behaviour .

Glass, I feel for you - defeated is such an understandable emotion and I can relate to it. We have the exact situation with DSS, as DH has been alienated from his child by the ex - I just don't understand it as it hurts the child. In our situation the alienation ramps up when the ex is promoting the current step father (she has been married multiple times since DH) but then she expects DH and I to pick-up the parenting role when it suits her. Sadly the damage she has done with the alienation strategy is deeply rooted and long term.

I used to share your DH's optimistism - always do the right thing was my mantra, and I genuinely believed that a positive approach would have an impact on DSS. He is now a teen and I don't think I can be optimistic anymore - my DH doesn't feel he can influence any part of his life and that is impacting their bond.

The ex has been highly successful in her approach however DSS is missing out on a close bond with a fantastic dad. But hey, the mum gets to feel in complete control and that's what's most important!!

Nana, I hear your comments about nature - but in our society we work to overcome damaging traits and try to promote positive behaviour. Certainly parenting has improved over the last few decades and we now know we shouldn't trample on children's feelings. Years of research is forming the approach to parenting however step parenting is the poor relation in this regard. Society still tolerates mums alienating fathers (it is slowly growing in awareness) and for Glass I think this is the root cause. The mum doesn't not want the DCs to feel comfortable and happy in their dad's home.

Society has to wake up to the fact that some mums (like dads) are toxic. The imbalance I see on MN is staggering. It is quite acceptable for a grown MN'etters to have a toxic mum, loads of threads on how awful parents can be however if the DC's are young the mum is never toxic - just misunderstood! (and surely the step mums deserves the toxic behaviour anyway).

I think society will ultimately change - the amount of step parenting means many children's lives are touched by it - it won't be seen as acceptable to alienate a child from their dad's lives. The definition of a good resident parent will be one who encourages a positive relationship with both parents and partners.

PS Glass, secure parents don't act like the ex..I am the resident parent and I would never dream of imposing rules on my DD's SM..I absolutely want my dd to have a fantastic and wonderful time with her dad and his new family. The emotion I have for this is exactly the same as when she has a school trip. I don't want her pinning for me, I don't want to impose rules on the teachers about what they should do for my dd whilst in their care. I think I would be viewed as a crazy mum for even suggesting it.

I would just say hang on in there. DP has always had his kids half the time since he split up with his ex and I have never understood why his ex always saw their time with him as inferior as if we were just playing at families. Even to the point of her telling SS to state that he had been brought up by a single mother when he was filling in his uni application (he didn't). However, despite the drip, drip of negativity over the years I would say that as the kids have got older they have appreciated all that their dad has done for them and that his consistent loving over the years has paid off. I cannot count the times when he said this over the years and I was never completely convinced that it would be true but am so pleased for him that coping with all the cr*p has been proved worthwhile. In the end you have to live your lives the way you want to.

samwellsbutt - dh is like you and wants the girls to have a nice time at their mums and I always join in with this too - asking if they're had a nice time if they've been somewhere with their mum or done something special - and I am never negative about her in front of them.
smum99 you sound like a perfect ex! But why wouldn't a mum want her children to be having a lovely time wherever they are? I also agree that step-parenting is so common now - almost the norm - and I think that my dsd's will grow up and be in the same situation as me and realise how wrong their mum was.
Libby10 - I am hanging in there because I love my dh and can't imagine life without him. I completely accept that he has kids - as he does with mine. I would never try and affect the relationship my kids have with their dads partner. I just want them all to be happy.

Sum99 - I must take issue with you on your comments "but in our society we work to overcome damaging traits and promote positive behaviour. Certainly parenting has improved over the last few decades and we now know that we shouldn't trample on children's feelings. Years of research is forming the approach to parenting" ...... how on earth can you make such a blanket assertion - where is your evidence for this and exactly what research are you talking about.

I have spent 30 years of my working life working as a social worker and team manager in a LA dealing with child protection, fostering and adoption, amongst other things. I retired in 2004 and worked independently as a social worker and was involved in public law, where parents are fighting over their children in the family courts.

What you say may be true for you but I can assure you that over the last 3 decades, I have dealt with hundreds of situations of abused and neglected children, and this has been going on for long before that.........and even then we only saw the tip of the iceberg, as very often abuse and neglect is hidden from anyone who can help, schools or social services or NSPCC. The parents of these children are almost always victims of abuse and neglect themselves intheir childhoods and know no other way to parent. They very often have very low intelligence, learning disabilities, mental health problems, low self esteem, financial worries, domestic violence etc etc. It is called the "cycle of deprivation" and no-one has ever found a way to break it, even though politicians of various hues have tried without success.

My work in the family courts, brought me into contact with warring parents, and using the children as pawns in the game. Neither side was prepared to give an inch and the whole matter was played out in the court with one parent winning (by have a Residence Order in their favour) and the other parent getting defined contact. The worse thing of all is that these matters drag out over months (sometimes years) and the children know that they are being fought over and this causes them considerable distress.

SO I see your comments as extremely naieve and ill informed, and as you can see have made me annoyed, because I think so many people are unaware of the horror that many children suffer every day of their young lives. I see no change taking place in these dysfunctional families over the next 30 years either, because we live in an unequal society and these children are "born to fail" and then they in turn become parents and neglect and abuse their children in the same way.

Step parenting has it's own problems and causes lots of tensions and rivalry in families, but set against the horror of the abuse/neglect and even death of children at the hands of their parents, it has no comparison.

I think you must live in a different society to the people I have described!

OK rant over and sorry if I've hi-jacked the step parenting thread.

Nana, I'm not going to derail this thread with a debate about parenting over the decades and we certainly can have different views and different experiences. Both maybe valid. That we can agree on.

I think it's more to do with you not being able to provide any evidence for what you say and quoting the research you talked about, than worrying about de-railing the thread. You can always PM me with the details!

NanaNina, I think what Smum99 says is true for most people and while we all know that abuse is going on in our society it is still the case that most children are not abused and that parenting has altered hugely in the past 50 years so that children now have much more of a voice.

I used to work with young people at the end of the road before secure accomodation. They had all been abused and their stories were often horrific. One thing I learnt from that is that there is a vast spectrum of parenting styles that - while they may be very different from mine - are actually fine and will result in normal, well-adjusted, happy adults. This has made me much more open to and tolerant of different approaches.

It is either end of this spectrum that is the problem - abuse and neglect or complete control and smothering. When a mother wants to be in control of every single thing in their childs life it is just another form of abuse.

I believe that my dsd's mum is guilty of this. She tells them they can't get close to me as she has decided I am not suitable, she tells them they have to stay off school as she has decided they are ill. She over-protects from harmless activities that most kids their age love to get involved in, she won't let them walk from the car to the house without a coat on as she has decided they may be cold. The list is endless. They are 11 & 8 and the time is soon coming when she will have to a face a major rebellion as they simply won't tolerate this.

She is unable to cope if she isn't in control of everything.

glass - DH's ex is still as controlling as you describe with their sons, and they are 16 and 12! Other people have been saying for years that they will rebel etc etc etc. In reality it's not turned out this way. DSS1 (16) has either been brainwashed to believe she really is right about everything and so is the best person to make his choices, OR he's become a doormat who will just always defer to control. I can't really work out which.

Oh god - really? I was counting on this big rebellion!

I guess you can probably tell from their personalities though.

Like I say, everybody was saying to us for years that DSS1 would rebel. I knew that he wouldn't (although I guess it's in theory possible that it could happen at some point ). He just doesn't have it in him to rebel. He's not the type. I find it amazing that a mother would want to have a son grow into a man like this. There's 2 possibilities I can see - 1. he will remain, as now, unquestioning of his mother's control, which will mean any future relationships he may embark upon doomed from the start, OR 2. he will substitute his controlling mother with a controlling wife, as he has actually never known anything different to being controlled 100% by a woman.

I think there's some people who will react to years of control by becoming almost reliant upon that control. DSS1 is one of these people I think.

Glass and stopcomplaining wise words.
Less than defeated, I am near to being destroyed.
Every time total despair washes over me, I look at my DD's picture.
I have to live.

I cannot help my DSD.
I have tried for 6 years now.
Her mum has control.

I cannot help DSD, she is slowly being poisoned. It is a death by a thousand cuts.

Ah well, Must'nt grumble....