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Poo, poo everywhere!

48 replies

JakB · 04/05/2005 19:35

DD keeps 'losing' her nappy and emptying its contents and eating and smearing it everywhere. It's just happened again tonight and is becoming a regular occurrence. She's as happy as a pig in shit- literally- but then I am tiring of scrubbing excrement off the carpets/walls etc.
Any solutions?!!!!
ps I AM GETTING LAMINATE FLOORING!

OP posts:
JakB · 06/05/2005 15:14

I'm sorry to be depressing, but I just can't see a day when DD will be cognitively ready to potty train
Am I just being too pessimistic... or realistic?
It's one thing that I find profoundly upsetting, for some reason.

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SleepyJess · 06/05/2005 15:23

JaKB SNAP!! I feel like my whole life will be centred around wrestling with a squirming, huge, person, whilst trying not get covered in sh*t! I just don't know if he'll ever be ready..I mean, if he's happy to eat it, he's obviously going to be more than happy to sit in it!

Dingle · 06/05/2005 15:51

A little glimmer of light today! Even though dd was awake at 5.30 this morning, her sleepsuit was abandoned on the floor, BUT the nappy was still on (back to front!)I don't know how long that will last though.

Also - we had dd's eye check at CDC today. Half way through she lifted her little skirt, held herself and signed "toilet", after a mad dash to the loos, getting a kiddies seat set up, I lifted her onto the toilet, and she sat there quite happily and did a wee!!!

SleepyJess · 06/05/2005 15:54

Wow Dingle! Storied like that give me hope!! How old is your DD.. what is her condition etc?

SJ x

Dingle · 06/05/2005 16:16

She is just 3.5 and has DS. Has been doing a wee 2/3 times most days, but only when you sit her on toilet or potty. She hasn't ever told me that she needs to go before! It might have just been her being nosey and want to get away from the eye test!

She is an early riser and nappy-taker-off-er!!

JakB · 06/05/2005 19:18

That's amazing, Dingle! Very inspirational...
SleepyJess- I feel EXACTLY like that.

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Dingle · 06/05/2005 19:23

Sat her on the potty tonight and she wouldn't/couldn't go! Just put a clean nappy on her and now she's pooed in it! I think we have such a very long way to go still!

Davros · 06/05/2005 19:32

JakB, has anyone ever talked about toilet training with you? I mean supervisor or consultant? Often people think a child isn't capable of getting it, but if you can teach just about everything with ABA then you can teach this and its best to do it while you have a captive team (lock all the doors!). You have to be careful they don't do it because of their own (understandable) feelings about it, even if that's not the reason consciously. I have known of a child on an ABA prog whose supervisor said he was too young (at 4) but I KNOW that it was because she didn't want to do it and she also ruled that she and the team wouldn't change his nappies! I know this through a mole tutor who was quite happy to change his nappies and get on with toilet training but was told NO. When she asked about dirty nappies this cow said just wait for the mother to come home (and he can sit in shite for how ever long and get a sore bum).
Of course there's no point if she's not ready but I'm not sure how you tell with a child with SN, there must be some pointers?

SleepyJess · 06/05/2005 20:41

Davros, what is ABA?

SJ x

Socci · 06/05/2005 20:45

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

SleepyJess · 06/05/2005 21:20

Oh right. Have never heard of it.. who benefits from it, any SN child? And how do you go about getting it? (Am still amazed at all the new things I keep learning.. and DS is nearly 5!!!)

SJ x

pixel · 06/05/2005 22:18

Last year I went to a seminar that was run by the special needs health visitors, all about toilet training. It was all very interesting but when they were talking about dealing with constipation I put my hand up (very bravely I might add-never done that before!) and asked what you do if you have the opposite problem. The answer was "well there's not much you can do".
I talked to them afterwards and they advised waiting until ds's bowel problem was sorted out as it was being investigated at the hospital. After many stressful tests the doctor sent us away with the conclusion that it was 'toddler diarrhoea' and ds would outgrow it. Ok so he's 5 on the 18th May and still got it. When does he stop being a toddler?!
We're going to have a go with the training anyway this summer. He most probably won't 'get it' but at least we will have tried and you never know, he may surprise us!

maddiemo · 07/05/2005 11:13

Pixel Go back to the hospital. We were fobbed off with the 'toddler diarrhoea' diagnosis for our autistic ds. Luckily I had a very on the ball Health Visitor who helped me out and put me in contact with Paul Shattock. In our case it seems that gluten was responsible for ds3 diarrhoea and failure to thrive.
I know that it may not be the case for your son but go back to GP, HV etc and say that you are not happy with this dx.

Back to potty training. A curly key ring with a toilet symbol card is also useful. Attach it to childs clothes . It can be shown each time you take your child to the loo and just say "toilet". The aim is to get to the point where they use the card to request the loo. I have not used this methos but my friend did and found it good.

InternationalGirl · 07/05/2005 12:36

We weren't so sure dd was ready for potty training either but we were!! so last summer we started. It took a lot of perseverance, looking for the 'signs' (i.e. dancing around, crossing her legs or 'screwing up her face' with straining), rushing to the toilet etc. etc. but now she is mostly trained.

We still have the occasional daytime accident - usually with poos - but we are regularly asking her if she needs to go to remind her and give her the opportunity to go. We used lots of 'over the top' praise and rewards (sweets, biscuit, stickers etc) when she did good and quietly got on with cleaning up the mess when not so good - sometimes saying "uh-oh". Spring/summer is the best time because they are not hindered by their clothes and if they're out in the garden much less of a big deal to clean up.

When at home she was in 'big girl' undies and when we went out she was in a pull up. Other thing we did - because she is so visual - is I'd take her to the toilet with me - and without being too graphic, made sure she understood why I was sitting on the toilet. We also went and bought a doll that pees and made it pee on the toilet or the potty - she found that interesting too. Mommy's turn, dolly's turn, T's turn.

The thing we found with DD was that we couldn't fluff around and sort of half-heartedly do it - it was all or nothing and we just had to go for it. It was very messy for a few months but eventually she got it.

Obviously I don't know your DD JakB but if you tried and perservered with training it could really pay off in the long run. It did for us and dd was basically non-verbal when we started.

Whatever you decide good luck.

P.S. look forward to meeting you in Brighton next week

InternationalGirl · 07/05/2005 12:45

Don't know if that was very helpful really but at least others have come through with other ideas of sewing her into her pjs (love that one, conjures up all kinds of ideas - sewing machine or needle and thread?) or taping her into the nappy.

I guess I was just thinking that if you could manage to train her she wouldn't have the opportunity to eat and smear as it would be flushed away...

Davros · 07/05/2005 17:32

Oooh, lots of good advice here! Agree with Maddie about the diarrhoea. THe Paed Gastros at the Royal Free look for constipation when they see diarrhoea as its often a sign as its the stuff that's getting out round the blockage iyswim (ugh!). Their standard treatment is paraffin oil to get it out and then probiotics and a decision about whether gluten/cassein or other things are a problem.
The card on the curly key ring is also a good one and everthing Internationalgirl has said. Our problem with clothes is the opposite now as DS needs clothes he can get off easily to be able to go to the toilet independently so I'm always on the look out for elasticated trousers/shorts (Boden mostly £££!!).

pixel · 07/05/2005 20:36

We did suspect some kind of food intolerance and took matters into our own hands. Ds was on a strict GFCF diet for 9 months last year and it made no difference whatsoever to his health or behaviour.

The hospital left it that as long as he was growing he was ok and that he was discharged unless he got worse and we wanted to take him back. TBH we were quite happy to leave it like that because his condition doesn't seem to be painful. Surely if it was constipation he would show signs of discomfort? He really doesn't and would be the picture of health if it wasn't for the frequent runny (and very smelly)poos.

Going off the subject a bit now but it doesn't make it any more pleasant when he takes his nappy off himself!

maddiemo · 07/05/2005 22:31

Davros Why don't you put him in Adidas etc type jog bottoms and football shorts. Really easy to get off and on. They dry quickly and don't need ironing. I never used to like football clothes and swore my kids would never wear them but now that I have four boys anything that doesn't need ironing is fantastic.

Davros · 08/05/2005 10:43

I try very hard NOT to put DS in sports clothes all the time. I see a lot of older children with ASD who wear horrid trackies all the time and I don't like it (sorry!). He does wear them sometimes but to me it is very important that he has nice clothes at least sometimes, not expensive, just "normal" iyswim. Its a bit of a thing of mine I'm afraid. I also try very hard to make sure his hair looks nice and is cut, no matter how hard it is. I also see some kids with terrible hair that I'm afraid looks uncared for. I know how hard it is, believe me, but DS is strange enough already! Mind you, my idea of normal clothes includes a couple of Sex Pistols t-shirts and a Clash one and a Northern Soul one!!!

JakB · 08/05/2005 18:39

I'm with you there, Davros. DD has an array of fantastic clothes that she covers in food. But I don't care! Thanks for all the great advice. Will discuss toilet training with DD's expert panel- I personally think we're a few years off but I'm not giving up hope

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maddiemo · 08/05/2005 20:56

I know what you mean about sports clothes Davros. They are erm 'chav'. However, I am determined to iron the minimum possible and so nylon it is.

My ds is one of those asd kids with terrible hair. I don't cut it myself but it certainly looks as if I do. It has no partings and is texture and colour of a shredded wheat

Good luck to all the potty trainers.

Davros · 08/05/2005 21:12

With you on the ironing Maddie!
I know a child with "gonk" hair and he has Landau Kleffner syndrome, someone once told me that the hair was an indicator but I have no real idea about this. Have you ever heard this Maddie?

maddiemo · 08/05/2005 21:21

Yes. Have been told that hair type can indicate a syndrome. Ds also has a hypospadias, facial hypoplasia, failure to thrive and is pretty short. We had a chromosome sweep but everything came back neg. I do suspect that he has a syndrome of some sort which overlaps with asd behaviours.
We turned down more invasive testing though as decided it was too traumatic for ds.

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