why would school rather label my child 'bad' or 'product of dysfunctional family' than aspergers? am v angry

[dollydanderfluffofwillowbottom]

ds1 (7) hasnt been doing well behaviour-wise at school for over a year now, i suggested adhd and depending on the teacher/day of the week/whether or not they felt like it school has disagreed or agreed with me several times.

this week he has spent 2 days in isolation, one day at home and 2 days in trouble. so i decided to take up my friends mums offer of an assessment (she has worked with sen kids for a long time and really knows her stuff).

she ruled out adhd within 5 minutes of seeing him, but says she is convinced it is aspergers syndrome, which i think is very positive as it is fairly mild and from the way she was talking once some strategies are in place at school he will do much better. his behaviour tends to get worse when he is stressed which she said fits in with aspergers. having done a bit of reading on it (not a huge amount yet) i am also convinced, everything just clicks.

so i went to a meeting at school today, very pleased that we may be able to get something sorted. 'i dont think its aspergers' his teacher said. despite not having a tenth of the training of my friend, and depsite the fact she has never taught a child with aspergers, the idea is kicked under the table. and we go back to 'well you and your ex dont get on well do you'

i am so angry! this could have been so positive, and although they said they would try the strategies we suggest, if they wont believe the way he is thinking, i dont see how it will help. i have had to grit my teeth a few times when he has been told he has been bad as it is clear something is not right and this is more than just naughtiness, but school would rather blame me and ex than look in to possibilities like this

i have applied for a statement from the lea myself, as the way things are going he is going to be expelled, but the ed psych refused to come out saying she saw him last year and cant add anything to what she said then (she agrees it is down to dsyfunctional family). my friend says we should get the national autistic society involved, and i am very happy that i have a professional on my side who is willing to fight for my ds

not sure if this was a rant or a request for advice, but have had such an up and down week, i feel the positive stuff has just been ignored and we are back to square one. WHY THE %$&* WONT THEY EVEN BLOODY CONSIDER IT???

None of us are experts in diagnosing and this is left to the professionals. That is why I said you really need to get a proper diagnosis.

dolly, I agree that you probably won't get formal help from school without an official diagnosis, but in the meantime I suggest you get your friend to help you put in place some strategies that will help him.

As someone else on this thread said, if you suspect he has Asperger's, then start to parent him as an Asperger's child and see if that helps.

i think i agree with those of you who have said schools either have an open or closed mind about these things, and i am just so annoyed that they wont consider it.

thanks for coming back nothercules, she has done assessments to help get statements before, but she did say i need to get him properly assessed. however i need to get something sorted before he is expelled from school, and i dont think we can wait the 26 weeks (excluding school holidays of course) that it will take to get a statement.

while i realise that my friend is not a doctor, she is very experienced, can prove her qualifications and knows a hell of a lot more about it than anyone at school (no one at school has ever mentioned aspergers, and i think if they knew anything about it they couldnt fail to notice the traits in my ds). so i find it insulting that they can dismiss the idea so easily and wont even speak to her to find out more. i think that is ridiculous, i doubt they will do anything to find out stuff themselves.

we will compile a list of strategies for them to see if it helps, but i think the best strategy is to find a school that cares. i am genuinely upset about this, they have said all along they want to help and i believed them, but if it was true they would listen to what i had to say and try anything. nothing i mentioned would have cost anything other than time.

am a bit confused over amys comment about school saying problems at school are due to problems at home so he is less likely to get a statement - i thought statement give school extra money so they are a good thing. does that mean schools dont want kids to be statemented? i really dont know anything about it, other than he has been on school action plus for about a year and other than the ed psy coming and saying she cant do anything nothing has happened

Hi dolly, my DS is out of school atm due to severe anxiety etc. it was originally said to us last year that he was HFA/AS but now they have changed their minds, they are saying "autistic traits but not enough to dx"
They have written twice to the headmistress of DS school telling them the problems that he has and she has ignored them.
Even with the professionals involved they dont always listen unfortunately.

Hi.
sorry if I offended you! I didn't mean to even mild aspergers is goign to have amajor affct on your ds at times.

A bright child who's complaining they're bored, could the school give him work that challenges him a bit more, if he's got something to focus and concentrate on then would that improve his behaviour?

The breakdown of your relationship with your ex will obviously have impacted greatly on him, and that his behaviour is worse when your ex is acting up is surely only to be expected.

IF your on the list to see a psych, then thats good they can and in most cases are very helpful and instrumental in the diagnosis process, Its a shame your Ed psychs not more willing to reconsider her opinion, the school would listen to her!

I'm sure your friend wil be able to offer you a lot of very helpful advice, and its a shame her opinion can't be taken more seriously, BUT at the end of the day, working with SN kids doens't qualify you to make a diagnosis, your a lot more familar what the signs and symptons of various conditions. I have a degree in psychology, I specialised in development and langugae aquisition, my youngest sons autistic, I can spot ASD and AS traits at 20 paces, but I can't make a dx, I can only exspress my opinions and suggest people press for intervention and assistance through the 'proper' channels which are, unfrotunatley stretched at best in almost all areas.

Nothing frustrates me more then hearing of children who need help and aren't able to access it because of professionals shying away from 'lables' and the shocking lack of support in schools.

Again, I hope I haven't offended you! I really don't want to, its a impossible to put a tone to posts try and imagine a calm voice from a smiling face!

Can only add that you need to see your GP and get referred to CDC and/or Developmental Paediatrician. I would also strongly recommend ringing the National Autistic Society helpline BEFORE the parents' evening. My view of the school not being able to diagnose is that they can't say its NOT X or Y, rather than expecting them to say it is iyswim.

lol emma, i thought i had offended you! i didnt mean to make it sound like aspergers was mild, just that i know my ds doesnt suffer too badly all the time, atm things are stressful and he is getting in trouble lots.

they definately need to sort out what he is doing in class, boredom is a major problem and i have a few suggestions from the stuff i have read today.

jenk, do you think your son is better off at home? taking him out of school is something i have considered as it just seems to be destroying his self confidence, but i know if i take him out the social problems he has probably wont get any better. however he did have a few weeks at home last year and academically i think he did far better, he learned in his own way and was so much more enthusiastic about the stuff he was learning than what he does at school. youre damned if you do and youre damned if you dont!

i will call the nas davros, i think basically school have no right to comment at all as they clearly dont know what they are talking about.

it does appear from these posts that i shouldnt have been so shocked about them turning down help tho, it seems fairly normal unfortunately. i still dont understand how it helps anyone to bury your head in the sand and if they are willing to try things i suggest i think its odd they wont try things a professional suggests. those of you who said she cant dx are right i know, but if you offered someone advice and they told you they werent interested, im sure you would think it was a bit odd

anyway logging off for the night, thanks all - you have saved dps ears from a lot of ranting today :)

Yes DS is definately better at home, however he is very intense and im finding him hard to deal with at times.
It takes a lot of commitment and i cant do a lot of things that i could before as he wont go out often, but having said that its worth it to know that he feels secure and isnt doing the things that he was last year eg, self harming

Dolly - my comment about the school blaming you for ds problems was in response to what you wrote in your first post about them saying it was down to the relationship between you and your ex. Its not that schools don't want children to get statements its just that if the teachers/head at this school have made up their minds that your ds problems are due to stuff at home and not to any disability/condition he might have then it won't help you with getting the LEA to assess your son. From reading this board it seems that it is notoriously difficult to get LEAs to agree to do a statutory assessment at all let alone to get a statement at the end of it. I'm not trying to put you off as its definately worth the effort I just wanted to warn you that the school's negative attitude won't be helpful in getting your son a statement.

Hi dolly, it sounds all too familar to me what your saying. My ds has now been diagnoise with ASD. Trust your insticts! It has take two long years to finally get the correct diagnoisis.

I had a school that didn't listen and it ended up a battle ground with school. If you haven't got a good supported school forget it, you are wasting your time in my opinion.

I really did try but even with statement they didn't make any difference. He was excluded far too much. The school didn't even take the advice of behaviour support. I formed good relationships with the LEA and they even said it wasn't working. I moved schools it was the best thing I done. DS is not perfect but they are understanding, and he is less anxious there and therefore not so stressed.

You soon realise that schools are not able to diagnoise and some are not that understaning of SEN. But there some schools that are great with SEN. This makes a BIG DIFFERENCE to the child and family. Hope this help Dolly, ive been there and come through there is light at the end of the tunnel! larsxx

Dolly, I just wanted to add that I wasted far too much time and energy on a school that really didn't want my son there. You also wait ages for any kind of help and support with waiting lists.

I would speak to your GP and see if you can get him referred ASAP, can you go private as this may speed things up for you? Education pshy I found a bit of a waste of time really, there are no doubt some good ones but my ds did see a few but not much help I'm afraid. Try to see an expert in the field. Good luck keep us posted larsxx

have just had a call from school asking if i will take him home at lunchtimes but leave him in school the rest of the day. i replied i may as well keep him out of school altogether (it would take 40 mins of the 1 hr lunch time to drive home and back). they dont want me to take him out of school so he is staying there for now. i feel they want to keep him for the good bits ie the sats test he will be doing shortly where he will give the school a massive boost but dont want to deal with the bits that are hard work.

when i had him at home last year it was quite intense but i knew i only had him for a few weeks, i think i would probably relax a bit if he was home full time. as i have ds3 at home all the time it wouldnt make a huge amount of difference to what i could and couldnt do. i hate not knowing how he is all day, especially having now read so many tales of people who were badly bullied because no one knew what the problem was. are you involved with local groups jenk? i have read that AS kids often find it easier to make friends with other AS kids and was wondering about how you go about socialising (if at all) if they are not in school

thanks for explaining amy, im a bit new to this (not sure why, we have been on schools sen list for a fair while now, you would think they would explain something).

i am going to look round other schools this week with dp. i think i am fighting a losing battle tbh. will give them some suggestions today and speak with his teacher more at parents evening tomorrow, but teacher on the phone just now was adamant that they all knew about AS, when its fairly clear they dont. if they admitted they hadnt a clue it would be better

thanks for all support

I had that with ds old school - SENCO was only too pleased to tell me how experienced she was blah blah blah and yet the strategies she used not only didn't help ds but made things so bad that he became an urgent case and was referred here, there and everywhere by both the school and me. The good thing that came out of it all was that he got his statement relatively quickly and painlessly and also we had so many professionals involved that we were soon 'cleared' of being crap parents and therefore to blame for his behaviour.

His new school are excellent and I know that they would do a better job without a statement than ds old school could/would do with both a statement and a dx. Moving schools is a hassle but in our case it was definately worth it. Good luck with it all. Those few months were absolutely the most stressful and upsetting of my life.

Hi Dolly, just read your update and this too happened to me I'm afraid, ds was part time for a year. Once he was statmented I thought he would be back quickly but even then it was up to lunch time even though they had the funding fulltime.

DS'S new school he is fulltime, which is a great relief. Go round to look at other schools and be honest about what has happened. You will get the feel of the school and their reaction to you. BTW my ds has made friend with anothr child who has SEN and this has made a difference with his friendships. So see how good the sschool are with specal needs it they don't have many they made be not that good.

Why are they saying only up to lunch time? larsxx

Loobie took her autistic boy and home schooled him for a few months beofre putting him into a school with proper resoruces (can't remember if it was a special school, or another mainstream school with a unit attached).

I know he has blossomed since - but it took a while to get him back to where he was bofre the other school "damaged" him.

If their lack of open-mindedness is "damaging" him, then I ouwld withdraw him sooner rather than later and not give them time to expell him.

Escpially if you say that there are other school locally which might be more sympathetic.

Prettybird, I really know what you mean about 'damaging the child'. I think this happened to my ds. In my experience once the school go down this road of excluding, that further exclusions and part times schooling follows.

Don't waste time Dolly with a unsupportive school, this wont help your ds or you and maybe your ds is already picking up on the bad feeling of the school. larsxx

I would back up what Bakajimjams ahs said and recommend contacting BIBIC \link{http://www.bibic.org.uk/here}; my son attends and it is very helpful indeed. They have fed back to the teachers at ds's school.

We have also had trouble getting the school to do anything much about DS1's As; he has jhad a dx, lost it and is being seen again with view to a new dx (lost because we moved across Country boundaries). Ds1's behaviour has also led at his last school to him being classed as a troublemaker, fortunately he isn't as bad now. Interventions have helped.

I agree that you need a professional DX, but at the same time your friend has an MA in Autistic Studies so they should be willing to work with her a the situation can't be nice for them either.

Do call the NAS, that was thing that got things moving for us, that and BIBC>

best wishes

X

Bad lnl

\link{http://www.bibic.org.uk/\BIBIC}

How are things Dolly? larsxx

am very touched you remembered me lars! :)

well, he has been banned from after school club unless the senco or head teacher are there (which is never). not sure why, other than schools excuse 'for his own good and the safety of other children' which i would understand except he wasnt naughty at after school club, he hasnt been banned from breakfast club and the teacher who runs them both deals with him extremely well and says she doesnt have any problems with him. so am not best pleased.

and on my way in today i bumped into ds2s friend and his mum, she asked for my phone no cos her ds is leaving and wants to keep in touch with ds2. he is leaving cos he has been bullied for a long time and the parents dont care she said. after i walked away it occured to me that maybe school should have dealt with it, even if the parents dont care. i am so angry on her behalf, he is such a lovely boy. i am appalled and now also worried about ds2 as i know her little boy has stuck up for him on several occasions. there is something very wrong with the school i think, just need to get dp to tell me when he is free so we can look elsewhere.

i had parents evening last night, i asked his teacher if she would fill in an incident form if there was a problem with ds1 during school. she said she already did so i asked to see it. she waved it in front of me so i knew it existed, but then said i couldnt see it just then as she would have to ask the head first. she said she was worried it would upset me. im sure it will but probably not for the reasons she means. xp had apparently suggested moving ds up a year to help with the boredom of work below his level, she said she would talk to head and it might be a good idea. funnily enough, when i mentioned it several months ago there was no way they could do it, it was against their policy, blah blah blah.

i think i have reached the point where i no longer care whether they listen or not. he can stay there if things are ok, it might only take one bad day for me to pull him (and possibly his brother now i know about the bullying) out of school til i find something betetr. i feel utterly exhausted all the time.

i have received an info pack from the national autistic society which is very good, it arrived today so havent read it properly but it seems promising.

thanks again for all support :)

Dolly, yes it is very exhusting dealing with a school that doesn't listen to you. I've been there and was totally run down with the lack of support I was shown.

It's really important to look round at other schools and ask about the exclusion policy , gives you some idea how understanding they are.I had almost gave up and was told by the LEA all schools are different. It is important to be honest with a new school, so they know what to expect.
My ds's new school have been great and he has been included rather then excluded, made a huge difference. The last school were awful and had no idea I'm afraid, even the governors were unsupported and treated him as just naughty even though he was statemented and knew certain things were difficult for him.

Your ds must be feeling so isolated and this must be having an affect i.e the club situation.
It's like they are condemming him before anything as happened. Dolly keep us posted, really feel for you. larsxx

dont know if i was just lucky, but i suspected for years that my son was different in some way.(nothing specific, just very eccentric and although he reached all his milestones he was not like other kids if that makes sense) I spoke to a neighbour who had an autistic child and she gave me the phone number of her childs Ed Psych. He came to my house and assessed my son without any need for referals. It made everything less stressful and quicker. It transpired that my son is borderline aspergers which i suspected for a long time. Funnily enough, because he achieves well at school nobody has picked up on it at all. It is only close family and friends who notice the little things that he says or does. Do you know any parents locally who have used an Ed Psych who could maybe just give you the phone number and you could phone direct to get the ball rolling?