For jimjams - re M and T groups

[eidsvold]

very competitive... when at 8 months dd could not sit unsupported - they were horrified... oh she is how old and she is not sitting by herself. Needless to say I just said no not yet - no reason. Another mother was moaning about the fact that her daughter prefers to bum shuffle around the room and shows no sign of wanting to walk ( 2-3 mths older than dd) We are just glad for our little worm who wriggles around the place - very fast may I add. Now that dd is sitting very nicely and playing with toys etc they are all oooohhhhh isn't she sitting so well - I can't believe it, in very patronising tones.

Then we have statements like - I would rather die/starve etc than put my child in a nursery. Or I had a little part time job when my first daughter was born....

As you know with summer things close down and as I am going back to work dd will not be going back to M and B group. A couple of mums decided to hold some sessions in the holidays as they could not last 6 weeks without m and t. We were blatantly not invited to be part of it. The woman took out the form where one wrote their name on the ones they wanted to attend and offered to hold one at their house. I was the last in the row of chairs. The form went the opposite direction to me and when it came back to the woman who was sitting right next to me - she moaned about the fact that everyone wanted to attend a group but very few wanted to host it and then folded up the form and put it in her bag. I figured - oh well I was quite happy to host a session but not now. Felt very funny about it at first and then realised we had so much on over the summer that it did not matter anyway.

We live in quite a 'posh' area - hate to use that term and most mothers are in their designer wear and drive the latest BMW/Merc 4x4, lots of children in their little designer clothes. That doesn't bothre me but the snobbery and patronising attitudes that come with it do - not just to me but to a couple of other mothers as well. And no I do not have the desinger clothes/nor does dd and I do not have the latest 4x4.

The same group of mothers attend a group on another day that we can't always attend as dd has clinic and when we turned up the other day - one mother said - Oh you are coming to this group now are you??!?! Sorry can't capture the tone but very unwelcoming to say the least.

I am looking forward to going back to work where I can deal with people who live in the 'real' world.

I know cirencester quite well Caroline. My nan used to live there, mys aunt lives there now, and I had some friends who lived just outside. Haven't been there for ages though.

Now I'm going to sound crazy- but also know Hackney a bit- my Uncle lives there (although different side of family than aunt in cirencester!)

Some years ago I found M&T-type experiences a good way to judge my ideas/fears about my son's development and it really showed just how different he was. I didn't have a problem with cliquey or snobby mums, but I often felt that we didn't fit in (and we didn't!). I then started going to a "special" playgroup and found it an absolute godsend, we no longer stood out. Even though we live in (oh dear) London, our community is quite close and we're known and welcome in lots of local places, such as cafes, hairdressers, M&S store etc and we have good and kind neighbours. We are also part of another community which is the local ASD/SEN community which is extremely supportive and co-operative. I have found plenty of people in the SEN world who are extremely competitive but they don't mix with the rest of us which is their choice but I think they miss out. Sorry to drone on, this is about M&T groups in case anyone's got to here and forgotten!

I'm a big one for support groups Davros. Other SN mum's keep me sane. I really couldn;t cope without them. What are the SN competitive ones like? I dread to think. lol. "I wiped up more poo than you today?" "What your son got 5 bruises from headbanging- mine got 6" Any hint of competitiveness left me when ds1's problems became apparent.

We joined a gym today. I'm taking ds2 swimming tomorrow. I'm hoping to sign up to some toddler stuff with him- he spends too long round auti kids at the moment- and can do some very good auti impressions I have to admit I have avoided anything structured like that with him. That standing out, and the developmental gap described by davros has been too fresh in my mind from ds1. Now I'm sure that he's ok I'm feeling brave enough to join in. It'll be a bit strange to be in the totally normal world again. I've avoided it for the last year and a bit. Well I'm rambling. Bed time. Wish me luck!

Oh fio they live just outside rochester and it seems nice. Not far from Dartford - up the A2. Can ask dh later as he has lived in other areas of Kent and I have just visited. He might be able to provide a more balanced idea.

I am not concerned about dd standing out in M & T groups. I am a novelty being the only 'foreigner' in the group. I have not really had any staring - that is at clinic when I have to strip dd for weighing and she has this massive zipper scar down the middle of her chest... as they tend to get us to undress them in threes iykwim, other mothers are surprised and often I catch their eyes as they are staring at dd's chest and they look away embarrassed. Like lou said earlier I am more than happy to talk about dd's situation but no one seems brave enough to ask.

Quite a contrast to a number of people at work ( where I am returning) who want to know more about Down's syndrome and her heart condition in order to be better informed and I think understand where I am coming from too I guess. I think it really does come down to the people themselves.

We have a number of activities for our parental support groups coming up so it will be interesting to see how that strikes us.

Jimjams, I definitely avoided being in situations, especially play etc with "NT" kids because of my own feelings rather than anything else but that has just got so much better over the years. Now and then I feel vulnerable like everyone, so would still avoid it at times and prefer to go to playgrounds etc with a friend or hubbie. Do think you are right to get your child as much exposure as possible to NTs, especially if he's a good copier. I think one of the problems is that play is very hard for many auti kids, mine very much so, therefore play places can be harder than other situations and I prefer to take him shopping or for a milkshake etc. Me and my hubbie joke about "mine screeched twice today and yours only did it once" but I suppose the competitiveness comes more in things like how good a statement you get, getting hold of good therapists/people to work with your child, paying over the odds to get them, getting access to other services and not wanting others to take up any space, not sharing your experience with other parents to try to save them making mistakes if poss. IMHO the parents who keep good stuff to themselves don't benefit in the end as they miss out totally on the network and sharing of resources/info but also the support.

How bizarre- davros- not wanting to share the information! Strange people. All out statements are shit down here So no competition really

DS1 just ignores NT kids. We used to go to a great monkey music group when we lived in Bromley. He had been going since he was 6 months so he knew what was expected of him. Trying to join clubs with him now is a no-no really. He doesn't have enough language and no-one understands what he says. We had a few disasters about the 2 and a half age and I just gave up. Just stick to free play stuff. He gets enough NT exposure at nursery and I figure that's probably enough for him to cope with. i take him shopping and stuff as well! He seems to prefer that really. Being around NT kids for too long does my head in anyway to be honest (I think becuase the gap seems soooooo huge at the moment).

It really is only now that I feel brave enough to expose myself to the NT world again with ds2. And only becuase I am absolutely certain he isn't auti. I tentatively mixed with NT kids at 11 months then had a major panic attack as I found some were pointing! (Ds2 started at 12 months and 1 week) So after that I hid again for a while. I do think he isn't getting enough NT exposure! He must think most children are a strange breed. Mind you I could be eating my words in a few weeks if I find out it's still a mine can say such and such, and knows however many shapes and can count to three world out there.

Davros- the other thing I really REALLY hate is when NT mothers think they know it all! For example if you say something like- "oh I need to to keep an eye on him as he has no road sense at all"- and they say "oh that's not autism that's just boys". Agggghhhhh Well I must just be a totally loolabell paranoid mother then.

What - there are groups nationwide of M2Ts?

What - there are groups nationwide of M2Ts?

I hate it when that happens

Small world, jimjams - let me know if you're ever visiting Ciren then!

I had one similar to that davros (although not at a mother and baby group)- although mine was - oh she has a tube ( ng one) MY baby had that as they had trouble feeding. Did not feel like explaining that the exertion of feeding could lead to heart failure.

I can't imagine what these mothers would have been like had I taken dd to that group prior to surgery - all bloated, blotchy, with an ng tube. I am sure they would have been horrified!!!

aww that'll be nice eidsvold.

We've been having a moan in a similar vein in behaviour and development!

bet your glad it was your last eh? Who wants to be belittled every time they try to socialise with their daughter. So glad your little one is going to be included in the annual review. Is she going to be in their mag then?

not sure fio - just got an email today saying what pics they needed while the woman wrote the copy - I had sent our story to her ( one I had to write for another mag)

You would not believe this - I got a phone call to let me know where they are meeting this Thursday and to invite me along to morning tea!?!?!?!