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Here you'll find advice from parents and teachers on special needs education.

Has my child some form of dyslexia ?

46 replies

SailingMum · 04/11/2010 15:07

Hi,
We are getting concerned with my son who is about to turn 7.

He is described as very bright and intelligent, very well spoken with good vocabulary and with an obvious engineering mind. He is also bilingual.

When his teachers first met him, they told us that we were very impressed with him and thought that he would be "cruising ahead at full steam"... However, he struggles with reading and writing.
For instance, sometimes he write words with the letters in the wrong order as such "you" become "uoy" or he can do a full page of maths all correctly added at the exception that he wrote all the numbers the wrong way round .... He cannot instinctly read the letter "b" and "d".

He is a very sensitive boy and starts to understand that his friends are better than him in literacy so it hurts to see him like that.
We do all we can at home to help him but that's clearly not enough.

Are these signs of a form of dyslexia ? I would love to hear from parents sharing similar issues.
Thank you.

OP posts:
dolfrog · 21/12/2011 22:05

Dyslexia is a man made problem about having cognitive difficulties processing a man made communication system, the visual notation of speech, or decoding and recoding the graphic symbols society chooses to represent the sounds of speech.
There are three cognitive subtypes of Developmental Dyslexia, auditory, visual, and attentional. Which means that an auditory processing disorder, a visual processing disorder, an attention disorder, or any combination of the three can cause the dyslexic symptom. And these disabilities or disorder have more serious symptoms an just the dyslexic symptom.
So each dyslexic needs to find out what causes their dyslexia

pinkhousesarebest · 20/01/2012 19:04

Gosh what a helpful thread.
I don't want to hijack either. Suffice to say that after badgering the school for the last few years, and being told my dd is just an average child , get over it, the teacher has now said that she thinks she is dyslexic ( can read well, although sounds had to be really taught intensively when she was little -is now 7 ).

She too is bilingual, will have speech therapy twice a week now. I would just love to know how to fully support her at home (am a primary school teacher).

Her cousin was similarly afflicted. He is now an architect. We can overcome this people!

dolfrog · 21/01/2012 02:16

pinkhousesarebest

Dyslexia is a symptom of one or more underlying cognitive information processing disorders. As you say we dyslexics can be very good a developing our own alternative compensating skills and abilities to work around our deficits/ disorders / disabilities. There are o cures for the underlying causes of the dyslexic symptom, and moist have more serious symptoms than dyslexia.

So you need to identify the cause or causes of the dyslexic symptom, and this will indicate the specific cognitive barriers and suggest the alternative skills and abilities your DD may be able to develop to work around her own disability. Each of the underlying causes presents different cognitive barriers and require different forms of support and alternative skills to be developed. There is no magic pill or program.

You may find these research paper sharing groups of some interest.
Alexia (acquired dyslexia) - library
Developmental Dyslexia - library
Reading: Acquiring and Developing the Skills and Abilities - library
Special Education - library
Speech and Language Pathology - library

pinkhousesarebest · 23/01/2012 21:11

Thank you Dolfrog. I am going to slowly work my way through.

julianneliteracy · 27/01/2012 18:17

hi all - I am a specialist dyslexia teacher and lecturer in London. Alongside my friend Sue Flohr (British Dyslexia Assc. helpline manager) we are running free 15 minute meetings with a dyslexia specialist in Lambeth on Thursday 2/12 - part of the SpLD Trust Empowering parents and Carers project. There are 12 free places (could be creche too...) for interested P & C. If you are local and want free specialist advice check send an email to [email protected]. We ran the first one on Thursday and only 6 parents showed - don't think it was well advertised. Please spread the word to any Londoners who want impartial advice from two old pros.

lincoln4326 · 09/02/2012 11:12

@ ChazsBrilliantAttitude - along with ToebyToe which has had great success, is the Easyread System - www.easyreadsystem.com, which grew out of ToebyToe and takes ToebyToe online.

dolfrog · 09/02/2012 17:22

julianneliteracy

The problem with the BDA is that it can only help dyslexics who can benefit from they Orton Gillingham program which can not help about 60% of dyslexics because the program is based on phonics, and 60% of dyslexic have an auditory processing disorder and are therefore not able to use phonics.
So I hope your own experience is free from the UK dyslexia industry which is purely a marketing operation for the Orton Gillingham program and not in the best interests of true dyslexics, you do not just follow the BDAs limited approach to problems that are dyslexia.

carocaro · 23/02/2012 18:17

So what do you suggest dolfrog? Chucking £800 Easy Read's way?

How is audotory processing order diagnised? DS1 aged 9 had a APD hearing test and full assesment done at Manchester Children's Hospital and no issue was found. But still struggles with phonics.

"So you need to identify the cause or causes of the dyslexic symptom, and this will indicate the specific cognitive barriers and suggest the alternative skills and abilities your DD may be able to develop to work around her own disability" - How do you do this and where do you go and who do you ask to run all the tests needed?

EssentialFattyAcid · 23/02/2012 18:20

I second using Toe by Toe if your child's grasp of phonetics is weak.

EssentialFattyAcid · 23/02/2012 18:20

I think I mean phonics!

EssentialFattyAcid · 23/02/2012 18:22

British Dyslexia is cripplingly expensive - you can buy Toe by Toe for under £30 and do it yourself for 10 minutes a day

carocaro · 23/02/2012 18:27

Sorry clicked send before I had finished.

You saying the BDA just markets one method as if it's a bad thing, does not help people like me who think, "whoa, hold on a mo, where do I go from here" If we are in the UK where else do we go but for the UK dyslexia industry.

I am asking how do you get to your specific diagnosis and build up the steps of help from their? An educational psychologist? A dylexia specialist assesement? A hearing test? A coloured overlay eye test? Reading academic journals?

I wish there was a checklist of action to take and where to go, a lovely flow diagram of what as parents we shoud investigate to get to the bottom of their individual needs. I know one size does not fit all and what works for others might not work for you. What are the steps to take?

As an example my step Dad has MS and the MS society have a booklet that lists the myriad of treatments from the standard to the more abstract, as well as an outline of the three main types of MS. It's like a structure and a check list to the illness. So I mean one like that for dyslexia would be great.

Can you do one dolfrog? You sound like you know what you are doing, but some guidance, other than links to academic journals and slagging off the BDS would really be so helpful for many of us on here.

dolfrog · 24/02/2012 17:19

carocaro

There is a difference MS is a diagnosable medical condition, Dyslexia is a man made problem, language dependent, and the symptom of at least three types of cognitive disabilities.
The UK dyslexia industry is just that an industry making money out of dyslexia, selling remedial programs and diagnostic processes. When our eldest was diagnosed as being dyslexic back in 1997/8 we looked for information etc from the UK dyslexia industry, including the BDA, and as we have discovered in the the years since they came up short, and were only interest if you could benefit from the programs they were providing. They even own and have editorial control of one of the leading dyslexia research journals to influence and skew the presentation of research.

Developmental Dyslexia is what affects most children, and there are three cognitive subtypes auditory, visual, and attentional. Which means that the dyslexic symptom can be caused by an auditory processing disorder, a visual processing disorder, an attention disorder, or any combination of the three. Ideally dyslexia should be assessed by a multi - discipline team, an audiologist to assess for any auditory processing problems, an optometrist to assess for any visual processing problems, and a psychologist to assess for any attention problems. in this respect dyslexia is a screening process for the three types of disability. And each of the cognitive subtypes have their own different sets of symptoms, and the shared symptom of dyslexia.

Going back to reading. Reading is about using a man made communication system the visual notation of speech, and more specifically using the writing system, the set of graphic symbols, and the language how society chooses to use these graphic symbols to represent the sounds of speech. We use an alphabet writing system, the most complex type of writing system, the Latin Alphabet writing system. And we use English which is has the most complex language structure in the Latin Alphabet writing system. Reading, writing, and spelling are about decoding and recoding the graphic symbols which represent the sounds of speech to derive meaning from text.
The purest writing system, logographic writing system have a single word to single graphic correspondence (Chinese, Japanese graphic symbols), where as the more complex alphabet writing systems have multiple graphic symbols (letters) to represent the whole sound of a word. So each language has a subtly different cognitive skill set requirement to perform the task of reading, and it also means that different forms of sensory information processing deficits, disorders can cause the dyslexic symptom.

It has been from Alexia (acquired dyslexia) research that the psycholinguistic models of haw we learn to read have evolved, and this has be supported by the more recent neuroimaging research identifying the areas of brain activity involved in the reading process, and also identifying corresponding areas of inactivity dyslexics experience, and also alternative areas of activity where we run our coping strategies. Unfortunately both the UK government and the BDA have been ignoring this international research for their own internal agenda reasons.

To be able to use phonics it is assumed that you have goo listening and attention skills and abilities. So those who have an auditory processing disorder (APD) (listening disability) or an attention deficit will have problems using phonics. I have APD and due to my APD I have problems processing the gaps between sounds the sounds that make up words, and the sounds between words in rapid speech. So although I understand the concept of phonics I can never use it.

You may find some of the links in my Dyslexia and Reading links list of some interest

EssentialFattyAcid · 24/02/2012 17:55

Dolfrog - what things have helped you with your APD?

dolfrog · 24/02/2012 21:41

EssentialFattyAcid

The only thing that has help me regarding my APD is to have others understand the nature of my communication issues, and for them to provide information in my preferred formats, while avoiding the forms of communication my APD causes me to have problems with.

So more information presented in the form of pictures diagrams charts, and less speech and less text.

EssentialFattyAcid · 25/02/2012 17:36

Thank you dolfrog
Have things got any easier as you got older?

carocaro · 25/02/2012 18:30

Great, I understand what you say and I thank you so much for it. BUT where do I go next? To doctor/teacher and ask for what specific tests/referal to specialist, private or NHS?

Or

Where do I go to find these people who A - know what they are taling about and B -won't rip me off

So

I can get a better understanding of where my son lies within the three outlines you describe above.

Do you see the problem parents are faced with? Again from your reply it is not clear where are who to go to to get to a nub a of a personal diagnosis or benefit from the myriad of choices of help out there.

Where and how, theses are my main questions that I can never seem to get answered from anyone! (PS: not having a go at you dolfrog, just the industry in general!)

dolfrog · 25/02/2012 22:58

EssentialFattyAcid

I think if I had known about my APD much earlier in life I would have probably followed a more informed career path, and not had such a bumpy ride, and always feeling that i was under achieving. And if the awareness levels of APD in the wider population were much higher then I would not have to keep explaining the nature of my issues to everyone in detail, which can become demoralising at times. So hopefully my DS's will benefit from a greater public awareness of APD.

When others understand and are supportive, then living with APD become easier, and i can focus on the things i can do well, and forget about the problems areas for longer lol. On the Adult APD forum, most of the adults have found that they are better able to avoid problem issues, and develop their strengths.

dolfrog · 25/02/2012 23:41

carocaro

When we first started to get support for our DSs who all have APD, we thought the exisiting related support agencies would provide all the support we needed, and would take to cause of APD on board. We were very nieve then, it has been more like running a national revolution movement.

The work of the BDA and most, not all, of the UK dyslexia industry is based around the Orton Gillingham remedial program, which is phonics based. The Orton Gillingham organisation (OG) is where the founders of the BDA went to learn about dyslexia back in the 1960s / 1970s. OG had a marketing make over for its marketing department which became the International Dyslexia Association (IDA). The IDA owns the other main dyslexia research journal. So for them to admit that APD and other auditory issues are a cause of dyslexia is to admit that the OG program not the only type of support program a dyslexic may require.

So back to APD in the UK, the link is to a list of links to the main UK APD information web sites, the APDUK web site has a new domain name and there is a new set o links included in the APDUK links list which includes an IEP guide. APD is not a hearing impairment, and as such is not identified by the standard hearing test. APD is a listening disability or having problems processing what you hear.
You will need the results of a recent hearing test prior to any APD assessment so that any hearing impairment can be calibrated into the APD assessment tests. You will need to begin with your GP, and depending on the rules in your area you may need to see you local ENT audiology consultant for a referral to one of the APD assessment centres. Great Ormond Street Hopsital is the main centre and more are slowly coming on stream. It may help to take a copy of the Medical Research Councils (MRC) 2004 APD pamphlet with you to the referral appointments. (not only do we have to educate the education professionals about APD in some cases we also have to educate the medical professionals)
An APD assessment to MRC guidelines should be a multi - discipline assessment. An audiologist to assess and diagnose the APD issues, a speech and langauge pathologist to assess any speech and language issues caused by the diagnosed APD issues, and a psychologist to assess and advise wit regard to the problems of living with the diagnosed APD issues. Which will then provide a report which can then be take to the schools SENCo, who can then advice the other local support agencies of your DS's support needs.

Adults can be diagnosed at the
National Hospital for Neurology and Neurosurgery
Queen Square London
WC1N 3BG
and there is an adult APD forum the OldAPDs (over 15 years old) and even my own web site which is a bit old now lol, but tries to show how APDs think

dolfrog · 25/02/2012 23:53

carocaro

I forgot about the various issues that can cause the dyslexic symptom.
There is a Diigo links group What Causes Your Dyslexia? (typical APD you have to start at the end and work backwards lol) This includes links to a wide range of research papers and research paper collections covering most issues.

And to add to the list of CiteULike Groups I listed earlier in the thread you could also have a look at
Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD)
Audiology and Auditory Processing Disorder

And there are always the Wikipedia articles Dyslexia and Auditory processing disorder

Issieander · 08/03/2012 21:07

I too am so glad that I have found this thread. Am afraid I don't have any advice to offer at present as am just at the beginning of getting to the bottom of the problems that my DD (7) is having but totally understand how you are feeling. Just don't let it go as I think you will have to fight quite hard for help. Good Luck xx Thanks also to the other people for some good advice. Sorry too for hijacking

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