My son (7) can’t sleep long enough

[Lisyloo725]

Hi there ladies
I know that all parents want their kids to sleep longer, but this isn’t that. He’s almost seven. When he wakes (5:30am) he just comes downstairs and plays Lego or whatever. No bother therefore.
However, big problem is by tea time (5pm) he’s absolutely knackered. He has bags under eyes and the most worrying thing he’s been mentioning of late is that his eye is doing a throbbing thing (y’know - that thing it does when you’re suuuuper tired!).
We go up for bath about 6:15pm normally. They’re having story by 7:00 asleep by 7:10pm.

I feel like we’ve tried everything to help him sleep longer : black out curtains, even a new window (double glazed to minimise bird noises!!), larger portions at tea time, making him have an extra wee at 7:00pm.

Any ideas/help you have are massively appreciated!
X

My 7 year old has just started staying up til 8pm, it was 7.30 a month ago. He usually has 11 hours a night on average hth

What happens if he has an early tea and goes straight to bed? Is it possible he's missing an entire sleep cycle? If he's really tired on a Friday or Saturday I would try putting him to bed at 5.30/6pm and seeing what time he wakes up then. If you've tried the reverse of putting him to bed later and it resulted in his waking earlier then it could be a sleep cycle issue. Does he fall asleep straight away or complain he can't get to sleep? Does he talk about dreams? It's possible to get too much REM sleep which is not restful and results in constant tiredness.

Ok. We need to go hard line - behavioural I think.
Black out blind is EPIC - it’s sooo dark in there. We even put his red dinosaur nightlight on a time switch so it went off at 3am.
He still woke at 5:45.
Not too bad, but not great either.
We’ve now got rid of light and bird song.
Last thing we can think to try, tonight, is taking him for a snoozy-wee now (10pm ish)...
He was an emotional mess tonight at 5:15 eating his tea 😣

@TheTeenageYears he falls asleep within about two minutes of lights out. Reliably.
@Jellybabiesforbreakfast we’ve really tried to get this done at weekends (a nap) but he point blank refuses.

He’s really sweaty now (just taken for that wee) but he’s only in shorty pjs and the heating hasn’t been on today. 10.5 tog duvet.
Wondering if any of that is off recommendations.

We had this when my son was a similar age. It's soo hard! We did similar, black out blinds etc. I also used to wake when he did and if it was before 6am he was sent back to bed. I sometimes stayed with him to reach him to go back to sleep. The main thing that changed for us was the amount of exercise he got. He sleeps brilliantly in term time. Lots of sport/physical exercise and also plenty of mental stimulation. In the holidays it gets worse again but I ensure he's been on a long walk/cycle ride/trampolining session or something each day. He needs to be tired out! He also has a slightly later bedtime now. Good luck.

Poor thing. I’m amazed at some of the later bedtimes as mine (6.5) just cannot seem to stay away past 7pm ish but he does breakfast club then school and teatime club and today also had a sport so it’s a long day. He’s awake at 6 but isn’t allowed to wake us (his little sister does that enough hahah) so he does word searches in his room (got one of those books with about 200!) or plays scrabble on an iPad.

He was an emotional mess tonight at 5:15 eating his tea

Feed him, and get him to bed early - 6:15. Sleep begets sleep so you might find he will sleep longer.

Hi OP. Some of the things that have worked for our DS (also 7) are having classical music playing quietly overnight also, having a humidifier in his room, and year round a 4.5tog feather duvet for some reason! Also, lots of fresh air overnight with a cracked window. And his bedtime is now 8-8.30 so he wakes up about 7.30.

I would enforce that whatever time he wakes in the mornings he stays in bed until a time that you decide. Teach him 7 o’clock or whatever in the clock and he had it stay in bed until then. ( batting needing toilet or emergency) No Lego. No tv. No tablet.
Maybe allowed to read a book.
He should be able to go back to sleep and then you can start putting bedtime back at bit each night.

@Lisyloo725. One thing I try to get my DS to nap when he's reluctant is to tell him he doesn't need to have a nap but he needs to lie quietly in bed and listen to a story for a few minutes. He's usually asleep by the end of the story.

And I'd definitely leave his window open, barring heavy rain. Mine sleeps so much better with an open window.

My 7 year old is exactly the same so I feel your pain.

We have tried everything and have now just accepted that this is the way it is. Later bedtimes consistently resulted in earlier waking for us!

Should add - the only thing we have said is he stays in his room until 6.30/7. He is more than happy with this as he sits and reads until then.

Cheap CD player and investing in unabridged CDs of favourite books can help - so not allowed to play or go downstairs but not expected to lie in the dark and be bored either. I have occasionally removed the bedside lamp when dd was physically forcing herself to stay awake so she could carry on reading.

That duvet is much too thick for a child.

Maybe try a white noise machine.

I would try white noise but also how does he know what time it is in his room? My Ds used to have a digital clock but my goodness it put a lot of light into the room which negates the blackout element of the blind and the curtains.

Of course he is going to get up when he wakes because he gets to play. You need to make it boring for him. He needs to stay in bed until X time. We had this with our children, they were allowed to read in their rooms but nothing else.

Ds2 is 15, still gets out of bed on a weekend like it is a school day, has a light alarm that wakes him softly. On a weekday he has a phone alarm set for 6.20am but that isn't on at the weekend but the light alarm is. He is out of bed before 7am every Saturday and Sunday but he is stealth mode quiet.

Ds1 is also an early riser however he wakes up but turns over and goes back to sleep so he can lie in until 8am ish on a weekend but then is up and in the shower. He is 18.

Have you had eyes tested? Do they have good core strength? Do they walk with an abnormal gait? Can they walk distances without getting tired?

DD was a bit like this as a child, she was up at 5.30 regardless of bedtime but 8.30 worked best for her. She was hyper fit at the time training at a competitive sports club, it made no difference. New school terms, illness, growth spurts, puberty, all provoked earlier bedtimes around 5pm (occasionally earlier). Removing stuff she could do from her room was both ineffective and a bit cruel (ever had to sit in an empty room not sleeping when the rest of the house is asleep).

I was a single mum so she used to come into my room stick a disney movie on and I used to go back to sleep.

She is diagnosed with Hypermobility at 12 which explains the tiredness and early nights..She probably has ADD but was never officially diagnosed and doesn't want to persue it now. The early mornings improved as she hit puberty. Sleep sounds (she doesn't like white noise) are very helpful .

I’d put him to bed at 6:30- not uncommon for young children. School is exhausting as he’s only little. Some children are early risers!

Forget any after school activities and let him enjoy his morning Lego.

My son very similar. For some time it suited us for him to go to bed earlier and wake early (younger sibling with an early bedtime, early starts for work / school). He's now 8 and had started reading most evenings before bed. It's had a massive effect on when he wakes. He's now in bed by 8 but often reads until 9 and is waking at 7 instead.

My 7 and 9 year old go to bed at 8. Prat about a bit and are normally asleep for 9. They're both still asleep now.

You lot are amazing - this is all such great support and things to consider.
Also I don’t feel like I’m doing it wrong. Thank you.
Sorry for short reply I’m at work 🥸