Any chance MN HQ could ban posters who consistently speculate regarding trolls...

[hmc]

It's getting really boring when a number of posters repeatedly keep dissecting threads and questioning how genuine the OP is, often leaving a lot of ill feeling in their wake. Seen a lot of it around lately - it is becoming an epidemic!

The MN policy on trolls says:
"we would rather Mumsnet erred on the side of giving folks the benefit of the doubt and risked being made to look a bit foolish than pounce on someone who turns out to be genuinely in need of help. We hope you agree"

So perhaps MN HQ would consider banishing the repeat offenders to some poisonous cesspit of malice? They wouldn't be missed.

well yes scaredoflove, you've got an excellent point there. People never dare to say troll on the sensitive threads, I suppose.

thumbwitch I haven't reported to mn no. Does it make much of a difference?

TBH Anyfulekno, I don't know - but if you have suspicions, and someone else has the same suspicions, MNHQ might do something about it, like banning the troll if it turns out that they are one.

i think it was nasty to call the op(bf on the bus thread) a troll, maybe cos I know her in rl.

aw hey, 2shoes - it was nasty anyway. I don't know her in RL but have known her pretty much since she joined and it was just horrible. She has enough to deal with in RL, without people doubting her on here, doesn't she.

totally agree, have seen the threads in question. Ref the bus one, that really annoyed me as I've met the OP as have several other of the posters on that thread and yet some silly bitches still shout troll. Am getting fed up with all this and am thinking of getting a real life.

good idea. Three strikes and you're out

Hello. Thanks for all your thoughts on this.

We absolutely agree that trollhunting and, actually, any shouts of "Troll!" on a thread are not helpful to anyone.

As we say in our Talk Guidelines, we'd rather you didn't trollhunt because "if you're wrong, you could cause untold hurt; if you're right, you'll merely be giving a troll just the kind of attention they're after."

Instead, please report any concerns you have about possible trolling to us at MNHQ - and we'll take a look. We promise that we do look at and act on every Report we receive, although sometimes we have to ferret about behind the scenes for a while first.

Similarly, if you notice anyone trollhunting on the boards, do let us know. And, if we think it's appropriate, we'll drop them a quiet line to ask them to respect our guidelines.

You can read more about our guidelines on Trolls and Troublemakers here

if people didn't engage though then there would be little impact to shouting "groll".

As I saw it the bf on the bus post turned into a ridiculous bicker-fest between two posters, whose main aim seemed to be to see who could insult the other the most. There was fault on both sides.

And just because people have met someone in rl doesn't mean they can't troll on the internet. Not that I'm saying that poster is a troll or not, but having met someone in rl isn't a guarantee of their genuine status.

People met cvq in rl, and well we all know how that turned out.

imo sometimes there is no need to shout troll and sometimes there is. On the whole mn hq are powerless to do anything, because often these posters aren't prolific under numerous names, they join a site and troll there under one identity, but if they have no form then mn hq have nothing to go on in terms of knowing whether they're genuine or not.

Dizzymare for instance had been reported numerous times, and mn hq were still unable to do anything. It was only once someone had the nerve to post her suspicions on the boards that people backed away from her, and only months down the line that she was confirmed as a troll. And it was posters who did that, not mn hq.

It's unfair to suggest someone should be banned from mn simply for disbelieving a story.

With regard to the bus thread, I, at the beginning, agreed it sounded a little far fetched. It's easy to get on the defence and claim people are being 'nasty' when you know a story to be true. But for outsiders, who don't know the poster in rl, and don't have a memory/knowledge of her life, it did seem like a potential fabrication.

Obviously it wasn't, and that thread in particular became a point scoring piece of nonsense between two posters, but I see fault on both sides.

IMO, a mistake was made with disbelieving the story, but I see the justification and so should other reasonable people. Equally, it was wrong to resort to name calling and slating someones opinion because you claim to know the post to be true.

Doesn't make one any better than the other, IMO.

Disagreeing with the validity of a story doesn't make one a 'troll hunter'. Not when there is arguably genuine validity for the disbelief.

there is a difference in saying you don't belive something and being nasty
the bus thread was nasty.

HelenMumsnet, the way I understood it is when the dizzymare thing kicked off (and afaik we still have no idea as to whether she was a troll or not ) she had plans in place made via MN to meet another poster, another young mum. I think because of the troll hunters, that person didn't meet her. If MN had had a quiet word and banned her, and her threads had been free of trollhunters then that person would have had no reason not to meet her as planned.
I know the official line will be "follow MN meet up guidance & be careful" but i think we have a right to know who is being treated with suspicion and who isn't.

Well, what is troll hunting anyway though? It seems you can't even put a without someone accusing you of it.

I got wrongly accused of troll hunting recently when I didn't believe what someone was saying. But it that doesn't mean you're accusing them of trolling, you're saying you think they're just talking bollocks / embellishing details for effect which is something entirely different.

Exactly pennies.

If you feel that someone is lying/embellishing a story, it should be okay to say without being accused of troll hunting.

I didn't believe the bus thread at first, seemed like an unlikely story AND it wasn't the first time from that one poster. As the thread progressed, and she explained in better detail what actually happened, I realised I was probably wrong.

But that thread did get a bit nasty, though like I said before I blame both parties involved. Some unneccesary point scoring and insults bring thrown needlessly. The 'defender' could have simply said - I know her in rl, she is telling the truth - rather than slinging mud.

Telling lies doesn't make one a troll, nor does being a regular poster mean every post you make is necessarily to be instantly believed. This is an online, anonymous forum and as such, anyone could be anyone.

Well at least I now know what a troll is. Been trying to work that one out for months. Never occurred to me to check the netiquette. I just thought they lived under bridges and frightened the billy goats gruff.......

Nearly asked once in talk but some of you out there really scare me!!!! Been coming to mumsnet since I was PG but it's taken to DS being nearly four months before I plucked up the courage to join. Had to get past the crying everyday stage first because I figured that if anyone said anything nasty it'd be the last straw. Now I only cry once a week so I thought I'd give it a go.

oh dear BB, hope you're feeling better
part of the problem is that opinion's divided - some would argue it's someone who is living out an entire new persona in order to stir up trouble, others would say it;s anyone who ever posts a trouble-stirring thread, others would say it's anyone who has ever lied.

I am now of the opinion that if people want to be taken for a ride by trolls then thats up to them. Leave em be to waste their own time and emotional energy. I don't even bother reporting any more as I feel there is very little that mnhq can do.

why comne on here and still have a pop at the op of the other thread.
although I know meeting someone in rl does not mean they arn't a troll. the op of that thread is not a troll........
end of.

stealth dizzymare was outed on another forum iirc when someone spotted that the pictures of her twins had been lifted from the internet.

I do agree though re if a poster were just quietly banned then rl meetups would potentially go ahead, and more to the point, there would be frantic threads wanting to know where she was/if she was ok/if she had harmed herself (she had threatened to do so hadn't she?)

And as it was, while mn hq might have been looking into it, it was said at the time that they had to give the benefit as there really was no way of knowing one way or the other, and all the threads were deleted, so not only did we have no idea but we weren't allowed to discuss it, while all the dizzymare threads had been left.

"It's unfair to suggest someone should be banned from mn simply for disbelieving a story"

But DSM, nobody's suggesting that, are they? The most that's been suggested is that people who continually call 'troll' are reported and banned.

As you said yourself, there's a difference between calling troll and saying that you think part of a story is embellished. The latter isn't against MN guidelines. The former is.

And that's the issue here. All the people here who are saying they will continue trollhunting (which has been said on many threads of this nature) are saying explicitly that they have no intention of following MN rules.

I realise this is a very loosely moderated forum. But really, if anyone can tell me why explicitly and repeatedly ignoring forum guidelines shouldn't be a banning offence, I'd love to hear why.

If you disagree with the guidelines, argue the case. But until your convincing arguments sway MNHQ into changing their guidelines, stick to the damn guidelines.

'As we say in our Talk Guidelines, we'd rather you didn't trollhunt because "if you're wrong, you could cause untold hurt; if you're right, you'll merely be giving a troll just the kind of attention they're after'

But that's not necessarily the case, with all due respect.

Often when confronted like DM was on that thread, the troll disappears. And posters who were heavily involved often thank the person who told them to watch out.

I never say anything any more though, only if it's patently a load of crap and no one will get hurt.