"boomer" thread

[Maireas]

You've hidden this evening's offensive, ageist thread, stereotyping "boomers". Will this be deleted? Can we have a robust response to ageism on MN?

I went to university under Margaret Thatcher and never had to pay a penny. Is the student loan situation then somehow my fault? Is the fact that my daughter will finish university full of debt my fault because I didn't?

But students at the time did protest about proposals for loans. Students at the time were extremely unlikely to vote for the Cinservatives.

*Conservatives

But students at the time did protest about proposals for loans. Students at the time were extremely unlikely to vote for the Cinservatives.

This .

Exactly.

And throughout this thread "boomer" has been used in a derogatory way. I'd like to see it acknowledged by MNHQ as offensive terminology. There's a difference between referring to those of the baby boomer generation and the pejorative use of the word "boomer" as an insult.

In my experience references like "old bag" and "old hag" are swiftly deleted when reported.

Yes, I know. I wasn't a student then, but I was one of the protestors. I was also arrested in Blackpool in 1986 (claim to fame) for protesting against the Thatcher govt.

It's quite possible to benefit from something someone did (my free university) and be against other things.

And my Thatcher free uni, and my dad's council house haven't precluded either of us being members of the Labour Party since 1984 in my case, and lord knows when in his. Though Tony Blair being the one who cemented the student loan thing (in his "anybody who wants to go to university should be able to irrespective of income") has, imo, done far more damage than good. But again, that's another thread.

*Yes, I know. I wasn't a student then, but I was one of the protestors. I was also arrested in Blackpool in 1986 (claim to fame) for protesting against the Thatcher govt.

It's quite possible to benefit from something someone did (my free university) and be against other things.*

Absolutely. In fact, from what I recall, there were constant protests throughout the 80s against the government despite most of those protesters probably being of the baby boomer generation. You don't see protests so much now.

Remember the Poll Tax and how collectively we destroyed that and by extension brought down Thatcher? We didn't do that by blaming older people. We stood side by side with them, marching and protesting and refusing to pay.

I remember that well, @IClaudine .
I was at Trafalgar Square protesting when it turned into a riot!

Me too! Got out of there very quickly when it started turning nasty! Was a great day, though. So many people.

I suppose all those Miners families on strike for months and months in South Wales ( and in the NE but I have no personal experience ) were headed up by these feckless boomers.

Honestly Just writing this is making me upset. I remember the hardship and how hard people tried to affect change.

But this isn't a race to the bottom of how hard it was. Just that most people operate on a personal level. And that these stupid data stereotypes are so ridiculous.

It was - all kinds of people. Like on the anti apartheid marches, the anti nuclear ones, the march for jobs, etc etc. Always a real mix of ages and backgrounds.

Actually not upset. It's making my blood boil.

@sunglassesonthetable - I remember going to fundraisers for the miners. That was a long and bitter dispute.

Yes, I remember food collections. I am from South Wales. Some communities have never fully recovered from what happened and have huge problems. It is so sad.

Boomers. Having it easy.

www.theguardian.com/politics/guardianwitness-blog/2015/mar/05/miners-strike-30-years-on-i-fought-not-just-for-my-pit-but-for-the-community

Yes, I remember food collections. I am from South Wales. Some communities have never fully recovered from what happened and have huge problems. It is so sad.

I bet people don't sling round the 'boomer' pejorative in the Valleys.

You know, at all the people who've ripped them off and didn't do anything about all the "foreseeable. "

It's a very rarified concept actually.

I'm not technically a "Boomer" but I just don't actually know younger people who think like some of the posters on this thread.

As if we're all stereotypes acting out the data.

Just like all the stereotypes of millennials spending all their money on avo and flat whites or feckless immigrants are causing all our problems.

@TheLongGloriesOfTheWinterMoon no I don't think it's ok to use insulting and reductive language about old people, or indeed any group of people. Offensive language and personal insults are of course not ok. I'm sorry that this happened on the other thread - I didn't see it and it has now been taken down, so I'm not sure what else you want done about it. MN is a public forum and people have opinions, which they are entitled to express in a respectful way. Of course not everyone is respectful- but a few bad apples should not be reason to stifle debate.

Regarding your dad - again, I haven't seen the thread you refer to so can't comment on individual responses but no, he should not be insulted for having a house, using the bus or going swimming. However these things do neatly demonstrate the sorts of overarching issues that many people (young and old) have with todays society, for example:

• bus services have been cut to the bone, making them unreliable, infrequent, crowded and expensive
• many public places like swimming pools have been closed due to lack of funding - meaning the ones that still exist are further away, crowded and expensive
• there is a lack of affordable houses due to decades of poor policy planning, meaning that young people and especially young families are paying a greater proportion of their income to live in increasingly inadequate accommodation, often rented

None of this is your father's fault directly, but the result of decades of policy decisions that he may or may not have contributed to via his political votes. Statistically, people of his generation are more likely to have voted for parties who have implemented these policies. This is at the root of a lot of the resentment and real anger that younger generations feel. We have much less than previous generations, and it costs us a lot more. It is not ageist to say this - it is a fact. (It is also a fact that younger people have not done enough in the more recent years to counter this because they have not turned out to vote in high enough numbers. For that the blame lies with us.)

For what it's worth, I believe the resentment could be relieved by a genuinely supportive approach from older generations. Unfortunately I don't see that very often on here. Eg recently I have seen young families struggling with increased mortgage costs told by older people that they "over-leveraged" themselves (when they had no choice because houses are so expensive), young mums contemplating giving up work because they can't afford bills on top of childcare being told they shouldn't have had kids that they couldn't afford and/or are entitled for asking relatives to help bridge the gap (failing to acknowledge the extortionate cost of childcare, COL and lack of wage growth). This dismissive approach only feeds into the stereotypes of old people that you hate and breeds resentment on both sides.

I don't see older people being dismissive of concerns regularly, @traytablestowed , although I'm not saying it doesn't happen. Many of us on here are supporting adult DC.
This thread wasn't in response to anyone wanting to discuss generational challenges, or what's best for society as a whole. It was about offensive and derogatory language, aimed at a certain demographic group. Generalising and stereotyping in the most unpleasant way. That's what we objected to.

This dismissive approach only feeds into the stereotypes of old people that you hate and breeds resentment on both sides.

You should take MN and probably most of SM with a massive pinch of salt.

It is not REAL LIFE.

I don't know how old you are re growing up with internet but please, some posts on MN ?

There are also racists, people who abhor kids, conspiracy theorists, misogyny, idiots and trolls all over the place. Please get a sense of perspective.

This whole thread was literally created off the back of posts on MN...

I support my older DC in every way possible.

We all are dealing with CoL, poor Public Services and housing issues. All of us.

But I'm not going sit by and watch sweeping ageist stereotypes because someone got butt hurt by some comments on the internet.

Or have complicated relationships with their own family, that they are projecting onto every other inter generational relationship.

Oh, the ageist threads aren't deleted. They're not even hidden in plain sight.

Try the swimming pool one from Saturday. The OP of that one thinks older men shouldn't swim when there are young children in the pool as they are paedophiles. She also is very offensively vocal on the elderly being allowed to own homes.

Try the winter fuel allowance ones

Try the "why should I wear a mask to save old people" ones

Try any Style and Beauty thread mentioning Fat Face.

Try any thread mentioning "neighbour", "woman in cafe" or "woman on train" in the title.

Even if it's not the OP (though it usually is) the ageism will be all over the thread.

And again, we could all begin a sentence with "statistically".

Statistically, as a university graduate who didn't pay to go, who owns a mortgage free house, I should vote Conservative. I don't.

Statistically, everyone born in the "boomer" years is better off than others. Except you can't quite have "statistically" and "everyone" in the same sentence.

I've never had a thread about my father on MN. It's an anecdote. But unlike many on here, I do recognise that anecdote rarely equals data. (My cousin rents out a house. He now refuses to rent to families as a family of 5 never once paid the full month's rent and threw a brick through his window with a note attached: "we'll go quietly if you stop trying to get the rent off us". Do I think all families of 5 are like that? Nope. Because actually, they aren't. Again, anecdote)

I'm pleased you agree that cheap, offensive and insulting language used towards older people is wrong though. I think ultimately we are on the same side.

But I'm not going to sit back and let the common or garden Mumsnetter abuse an entire generation. HQ have said I don't have to. They won't stop the abuse for us, but have given us permission to do it ourselves.

This whole thread was literally created off the back of posts on MN...

Yep. And here we are.

I think there’s an assumption that the over 60s are all middle class by some on this thread.