Need your thoughts on dermal treatment advertising (ie Botox)

[JustineMumsnet]

Good morning all,
We have a company that wants to advertise their dermal treatment to Mumsnetters - i.e. a Botox-like filler. We have always said no to plastic surgery stuff but judging by the discussions on Talk there are many Mumsnetters who are curious about/ consumers of dermal treatments so some content/info/offers around this type of product may be of interest?
We are not thinking of sponsorship here - but maybe some content, a product test/ webchat/ a few display ads in style and beauty?

Do let us know your thoughts.
Cheers.

@WeepsInPaleDew

Somebody advertised themselves on the Style and Beauty section last night, on the Botox thread.

Somebody called CircleBeauty? Is she one of your possible candidates? Are they going to advertise themselves on the actual threads too, or just in display ads?

Do please report that post to us, won't you, WeepsInPaleDew? We don't allow anyone to advertise within Talk threads - if someone was, they'd be breaking our rules and we'd need to tell them off drop them a line.

The idea of this makes me shudder.

That said, a web chat from someone with expertise who will actually talk honestly about the risks/benefits and does not have a vested interest in selling the treatments, sounds like a good idea.

If you must have adverts (and I appreciate Mumsnet needs advertising to survive), please please hide them in Style and Beauty, so those of us who hate this kind of thing can avoid it.

Thanks

No, I really don't want to see adverts for cosmetic surgery, botox etc on this site.

adverts for dangerous toxins to be injected into the face? Nah

We have always said no to plastic surgery stuff

I would carry on with that if I were you. I don't think it's a good thing to be associated with, personally. I think (like someone said before) that this website should be associated with images and ideas about strong, vocal, intelligent women. Botox etc just seems a bit superficial and not a good fit for the image you might prefer to have.

Please don't do this - by having the adverts and webchats, you would be helping to make this more mainstream. I think it would be a really bad move... and if botox and fillers, why not go the whole hog with plastic surgery? Where is the line?

I'm opposed to plastic surgery, except for strong medical reasons, and support the ban on advertising that.

my children have had orthodontic treatment, something that is freely discussed on mumsnet. While I don't think I would personally opt for botox a discussion on it would be interesting. There are, despite the slide in mumsnet standards, still some very well informed people here who are capable even of giving marketing folk a good questioning .

Botox does have medical uses and it would be interesting to hear from someone who uses it for non-cosmetic purposes.

I speak as the unfortunate mumsnetter who posted the disaster story of botox.
I know lots of people love it and it gives great results for some, but, I do feel the negatives are swept under the carpet. Botox is a poison and therefore is going to make some people really quite unwell, and not enough attention is given to that fact.
A good practitioner may well tell you that the risk is small, they have never had anyone react badly,any mild drooping wears off quickly blah blah blah. But when you are one of the 1% for whom it doesn't work, it's bloody awful, it took months for my face to get back to normal, not to mention the anxiety and flu like symptoms I also had to deal with. I also believe that more people have bad side effects than we know about, largely because they keep quiet about it due to the embarrassment of admitting that they gave it a go.
I really wouldn't want to see the site advertising something that not only perpetuates the 'must be perfect' beauty myth, but also in some cases can cause harm.

If there was a webchat, it might be good to think about how the current webchat guidelines are enforced. On the Q&A for a book called something like "Superwoman"(??) a couple of months ago, some posters were quite emphatic in their criticisms of the book. (They regarded it as being quite retrograde in that it placed the burden of juggling work and home squarely on women, and pushed an unwelcome and oppressive ideal of domestic perfection.) Although the comments didn't amount to personal attack, and weren't aggressive, I recall that an MN person stepped in and reminded posters about courtesy etc. So it felt like a frank discussion wasn't really being nurtured.

Whilst obviously not wanting anyone to be rude or personally aggressive on an advertising webchat, it does seem appropriate, especially with a controversial product like this one, that advertisers accept that by entering the chat arena rather than staying in the banner ads, they are exposing themselves to entirely robust treatment. I know that in the absence of such an understanding of the etiquette I would feel too hamstrung by webchat guidelines to participate at all (not that I'd join in this one anyway I think) -- and if others felt similarly, no proper interrogation of the product would be made.

Yes to an emotibotoxicon

If webchat, then real Drs only, no quacks. Plus a photo.

Not keen on the whole idea, though tbh. Except for the emotibotoxicon. Did I mention that?

There are people out there who do want Botox and do want a reputable Doctor to perform it. If the people advertising are vetted by Mumsnet and not staffed by 19 year old beauty therapists brandishing a needle then it could be a good thing because it might stop some people going to dodgy clinics.

It's very difficult to find a good practitioner any other way than word of mouth and personal experience precisely because of the restrictions on advertising.

I would have no problem with a webchat - by a qualified, impartial medic, rather than a botox-like filler peddler and wouldn't care about ads, since I use adblock on my laptop, anyhow. It's not something I'd want to see product tested, though - where would you stand if things did go wrong, for a start?

'Botox does have medical uses and it would be interesting to hear from someone who uses it for non-cosmetic purposes'

my child has it reguarly for stiff muscles caused by a medical condition. I have to read and sign many forms because its a dangerous toxin and her surgeon is horrified people have this stuff injected into their faces to paralyse their facial muscles.

Web chat would be OK and interesting.

Advertising would be crap. It's buying into the usual misogynist crap that women aren't good enough the way they are and it's very unsupportive, MN is supposed to be here to make our lives easier or something isn't it, not make us feel that everyone else is doing botox so really we're being v. extreme and unreasonable not doing so.

Also I think it might damage MN in the wider media. It makes it looks like just another stupid women's site. Already the media queues up to portray MN as self indulgent rich yummy mummys, it can't stand the fact that women talk intelligently and cogently to each other, it can't stand the fact that Gordon Brown, David Cameron and other men with real power come on here just before elections because mothers' views might actually matter, that's why the rest of the media ignore all the intelligent well-informed comment and concentrate on biscuit obsessions. Well buying into the narrative that hey little Laydees, it doesn't matter how clever and funny and kind you all are, when the chips are down the most important thing about you is how you look, so take a break from analysing society and supporting other women and get some self-hatred down yer neck and get down that clinic.

Just my opinion...

I would just like to add, further to my earlier post, that even with a reputable doctor performing the procedure, fillers/botox do not agree with everyone
Getting your botox done by the best surgeon in the world will not guarantee you will not have side effects. It's a common misconception to believe that if you have a bad reaction it is because it was injected in the wrong place or you had a shonky practitioner.

It's an interesting one. I do think it matters who advertises on your pages and this is the sort of thing I would prefer not to see on Mumsnet.

I agree that a web chat, unbiased approach for information only would be good. I don't really notice adverts either but feel it does go against the ethos as it were. Also, the long term effects of using treatments such as Botox aren't really clear yet and I think it would be best if the idea of promoting it should be shelved for the time being.

That'll be a "no" then

It doesn't sit right with me. One hand is saying "let girls be girls" when the other is saying "Ladies, its not OK to grow old so have your face injected with poison!"

Fine if thats what folk want to do to themselves, but I wouldn't like to see Mumsnet promoting it.

I would appreciate information on it, so it's a Yes from me.

God yes I would test it. Perhaps do a Botox/non fillers can't think of the name/make over tests. See which is best.

How about giving the advertising box a "hide" option? That way those of us who are interested can look into it and those who are not interested can hide the ad.

alouiseleg - how come you're desperate to look for botox peddlers on mn? the info, practioners and qualifications etc are very easy to find if someone has such a need surely? if you're keen to have botox and have the resources to do so it is really not hard to find out how and where. it doesn't really take a parenting website to hold your hand through it does it?

eg. have just put my town name and botox treatments into google. thousands of results in seconds leading to websites with detailed info., practioners names and qualifications and work experience etc etc. how would banner ads on mn be more informative than that?

I already have it but I'm always interested in finding out more.