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Original poster

S-Max, C4 Grand Picasso or something else?

55 replies

Arefrenchcarscrap · 25/01/2015 22:23

We have a 2006 BMW 325i touring. Two kids (2, 4), third on the way. Need a bigger car. May buy new or nearly new, depending on discounts, finance, spec etc.

Required spec:

  • petrol (mileage of only 4k per year, almost all urban)
  • 7-seater with fold flat third row (no room in house to store seats, which I think rules out the Qashqai +2?)
  • reliable
  • decent level of mod cons (BMW is a bit old and was bought second hand, so lack of things like Bluetooth and GPS is a bit annoying, looking forward to having these in the new car)

I have narrowed it down to S-max or a Citroen.

From what I can see, the S-Max is a little bit pricier, has a slightly sparser spec, but at least it isn't French.

Is there anything else out there I should consider?

Am I being silly about the French thing? My mother had some really crap Peugeots...

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Original poster
Arefrenchcarscrap · 27/01/2015 23:26

This is fantastic. Thanks for all your input.

I have decided. French cars are crap after all (sorry Citroen and Peugeot drivers Wink).

The Alhambra does get great reviews but is only available in diesel so doesn't make the shortlist.

I think I may add the Verso to the shortlist.

I suspect the S-max will be the roomiest, nicest to drive, stingiest standard spec and certainly most expensive, while the Kia will be the cheapest and with a surprisingly high spec but flimsy build. Verso somewhere in between? It will be interesting to see how my prejudices are confirmed or overturned.

Does anyone know if the Kia takes three car seats in the second row? I think it has three isofix points, which suggests yes, but can't be sure.

Medoc - S-Max doesn't have sliding doors. Alhambra is what you are after for that.

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Original poster
Arefrenchcarscrap · 27/01/2015 23:32

Just realised the price differential. These are Broadspeed (discount broker) prices for higher spec 1.6 petrol engines:

Kia Carens 2 £16,300 (7 yr warranty)
Toyota Verso Icon £17,500 (5 yr warranty)
For S-Max Titanium £21,400 (? Yr warranty)

Is it as simple as it seems?

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poocatcherchampion · 27/01/2015 23:33

Dont get fooled by 3 isofix - we have that in our insignia - but you can't use them all together. Hmm

Medoc · 28/01/2015 00:38

weird- I thought soup dragon said they did?
I'm sure highest spec SMax has sliders...

Original poster
Arefrenchcarscrap · 28/01/2015 08:23

Thanks poocatcher - will look out for tht on test drive.

Medoc - I have downloaded the s max e brochure and can't see any mention of sliding doors. Is that the ford Galaxy (ie Addison lee cars) you are thinking of?

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imip · 28/01/2015 09:39

I think it's the cmax that has sliding doors...

imip · 28/01/2015 09:42

And yes, smax airbags are not in the last row....

SoupDragon · 28/01/2015 09:45

weird- I thought soup dragon said they did?
I'm sure highest spec SMax has sliders...

Confused
Original poster
Arefrenchcarscrap · 28/01/2015 13:32

Yes - C-Max has sliding doors. Shame, as it is too small.

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Madamecastafiore · 28/01/2015 13:35

You'll find both of those like roller skates after driving a BMW.

Original poster
Arefrenchcarscrap · 28/01/2015 14:18

I am aware of that, Madamecastafiore!

If BMW did an MPV for less than £25k new, I'd buy it like a shot, but we have no appetite (not to mention budget) for an X-5!

While I like our 325i, it was four years old when we got it and is now showing its age. It has a CD changer in the boot. It is costing over £1,000 a year in servicing costs - a few major items seem to be cropping up each year, which is to be expected of any car at 9 years old, I think, German or not.

Though it pains me to admit it, it is time for something cheap to run, practical and reliable.

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Perspective21 · 28/01/2015 14:26

I would recommend my VW Sharan. True seven seater, easy to fold back row. All seats move about easily. Sliding doors, airbags all the way to back row. All mod cons. Was previously BMW X3 driver. Was gutted to sell that on but not big enough for my two teens and a little boy plus an additional needs buggy.

I was slightly dreading making the move but it drives really well. For a really long car, it is exceptionally easy to park, steer, 3point turn etc..

Great build quality. Two years in to ownership by a not especially neat family of 5 plus extra passengers, once it's washed and vacced it still looks great inside.

Perspective21 · 28/01/2015 14:29

We have sat in the X5 several times in showrooms but it just doesn't offer the same level of interior space and boot as the Sharran. If you regularly need a lot of seats, which you do, it's not that great.

My DH works with BMW dealers and as a company BMW aren't really interested in the client base that needs a 7 seater. Sad, but true...

Chippednailvarnish · 28/01/2015 14:31

I had a WV touran, it was crap!

3boys3dogshelp · 28/01/2015 14:39

I have a verso and love it. Would recommend to anyone. It doesn't feel bmw quality but i test drove a kia (4wd) a while ago and was glad to get back to my own car. It doesn't feel too big to drive and park. Great fuel economy. We have had a dog crate, double buggy and bags in the boot to go away for weekends with back row down.
Ours is 8years old now and has been very reliable despite a bit of a hammering! in fact we bought it second hand, as a relatively cheap and practical option. Now i am working again and could afford a better car but i love it and don't want to swap.

Medoc · 28/01/2015 21:31

Ah- CMax?
Soupy- it was way back when it was the ford trial thingy. You had an Smax then, did you? (I thought you owned one, not part of the trial)
Maybe I'm completely misremembering Confused

SoupDragon · 28/01/2015 21:38

I never thought they had sliding doors though. I got one the summer after the trial I think.

Chippednailvarnish · 28/01/2015 21:43

I have a cmax grand with sliding doors, it's good but the middle seat in the middle row is very narrow. You wouldn't be able to get three car seats accross. The boot is on the small side for a car of its size.

happyyonisleepyyoni · 28/01/2015 21:53

We have an SMax and it is a lovely car to drive. Bought nearly new for £10k off list price. Solidly built and drives much better than other MPVs we tried.

KristinaM · 28/01/2015 22:01

I have 3 kids and have been drinking an s max for the last 4 years. I love it .

I do 10,000 miles a year, a mixture of urban, rural and motorway

I like having two back rows for when the kids are in fighting mood .

The back seat are VERY easy to take down and put up, it's just a loop of red ribbon that you pull. Once they are down there is plenty space to buy things from ikea or plants for the garden. Or even transport children and bikes .

AliBingo · 01/02/2015 19:36

Have you looked at VW sharans? The same as a Seat Alhambra but it does come in a 1.4 petrol which is v economical, I think you can pick up nearly new for around £17000. We just ordered a brand new one but the dealer said it was a VW target car and knocked over 20% off the list price.

Original poster
Arefrenchcarscrap · 01/02/2015 20:15

So we test drove the S-Max and the Carens. I don't know why it feels like such a difficult choice, but it does.

S-Max was lovely. They only had a diesel to test. It was a joy to drive and really comfortable. Interior is nice. Smart and reasonable build quality. Not BMW quality, but then it isn't a BMW price.

The Carens was surprisingly nice. We tested the petrol 1.6l Carens 2 (broadly equivalent to S-Max Titanium). It drove really well. A bit short of power but then you would expect that and we aren't buying it for power (the Ford petrol will probably feel about the same, due to the lack of torque, although the Ford petrol engines seem to have higher bhp, which in turn results in higher VED). The interior was well appointed and comfortable. Ride was comparable with the S-Max. Somehow, though, it feels slightly cheaper. Not because of the build quality - the door shutting test was surprisingly positive (much the same feel as the Ford). A few of the reviews have said that it feels slightly less stylish, and I think that is right. They have spent a lot of time and effort on the exterior styling, and the car looks great, but somehow the inside isn;t quite as spot on as the S-Max.

So we have a car that costs £5k less, has a 7-year warranty (Ford has a 3-year warranty) and is ultimately the same but a bit less stylish inside. Yet I still find it difficult to choose. Why?

It would be easier if we couldn't afford the Ford, or had so much cash that we didn't care about the £5k (we'd choose the Ford). Can someone tell me that contemplating buying the Ford is silly and that the £5k difference (plus whatever the S-Max would clock up in maintenance that would be covered under the longer Kia warranty) is better spent on other things for the family.

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Medoc · 02/02/2015 21:42

Well, my BIL's family have 3 Kias between them (all different models) and I don't think they've had any problems whatsoever... so they can obviously offer the 7y warranty without worrying.

£5k is a fairly substantial price difference. COuld you get the ford nearly new? Or is that already nearly-new?

AliBingo · 02/02/2015 21:52

How long are you keeping the car? How would the residual values compare?

Original poster
Arefrenchcarscrap · 02/02/2015 23:45

Thanks Medoc. Reassuring anecdotal evidence on Kias. Price comparison is new vs new. Could go nearly new on Ford, but that makes the warranty comparison even more stark (say 18m vs 7 years!).

Assumption is that we would keep the car for a fairly long time, like 5+ years.

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