The 11+ / private schools application experience in North London

[Lindalove]

I don’t post often, but I wanted to share our experience of supporting our son, who goes to a state primary, through the independent / 11+ grammar route in North London over the last year, in case it’s helpful to other families considering this path. I would have appreciated this post two years ago anyway?!

It’s obviously a privileged position to even be able to explore private schools. We have one child, which makes it just about manageable for us. But what surprised me most, and isn’t discussed as often, is how demanding, expensive and emotionally intense the process can be well before any offer is made! For context, our son attends a relatively gentrified, Ofsted Outstanding state primary in North London. In Years 5–6 he has been consistently assessed as “above expectations” across subjects. He’s bright and curious, though not a standout academic.

He used Atom Learning for nearly two years and had two tutors (maths and English) who came weekly in Year 5. Both tutors felt he was a reasonable candidate for the schools below; Latymer was mainly for experience/practice. In the run-up to exams, he generally scored Strong or Master on Atom islands and achieved around 105–110 on Atom SAS mocks (slightly above average — noting that Atom’s average reflects the cohort using the platform rather than all children nationally).

Costs (before fees)

• Atom Learning: ~£60–£70 per month plus extras like puzzles and creative comprehension downloads
• Tutors: £55–£65 per hour (per subject)
• Additional books
• Application fees: ~£180–£200 per school or for in-school mocks

This did affect how we spent elsewhere, though that was our choice, just laying out the costs.

So the grammar/ indie schools we applied to were as follows and our final outcomes:

Latymer Grammar School A very popular option locally, with a MASSIVE number of applicants for relatively few places. The assessments include written maths, English and VR, with a strong emphasis on speed, particularly in VR. We found that Atom alone was not sufficient preparation, and that the overall level required is extremely high. Our son’s mock results were around 60% in maths and 75% in English.
Assessment day (my son’s score): minus 4/10 Son intensely disliked this. Large numbers of children in big halls, which he found quite intimidating. Communication felt limited, and the experience was stressful for him. This may suit children who are very VERY academically strong and comfortable in highly pressured environments. For others, it’s worth thinking carefully about whether it’s the right fit. Our son didn’t get to the second stage.

Highgate School: Also highly competitive and very popular, with many applicants from paid primary prep schools drilled for entrance exams unlike state school kids. The assessment included written maths, English (comprehension and creative writing) and NVR, followed by interviews for shortlisted candidates.
Assessment day rating: 8/10. Well organised, with friendly staff and smaller groups, which felt more supportive.* *Challenging, but felt fair and well run. A positive experience overall, worth it as a 'stretch' option for my son. He was then asked back for an interview and activity day at second stage, which was also well run - he had fun soldering and doing team games. He wasn’t offered a final place however (I think 700 kids went for 80 places).

Forest School: A lengthy assessment day (around four hours) covering a wide range of skills: maths, comprehension, VR, NVR, written English, a collaborative task and an individual interview. Assessment day rating: 9/10 Long but warm and well structured. Breaks and group activities helped children manage the day. Overall this was* *academic, but with a clear emphasis on balance and rounded development. They do the interview on the day which suggests they are at least interested in the child, not just their results. He also applied for a drama scholarship and found both the initial assessment and the second stage assessment fun and engaging. In the end he didn’t get a drama scholarship but DID get offered a place which he is taking up! YAY!! About 400-500 kids went for I think around 120-140 places.

North Bridge House (Canonbury): A smaller intake and a noticeably calmer atmosphere. Says it's non selective, but assessment included Maths, English and NVR Quest exams plus a small group interview. Assessment day rating: 9/10. Friendly and reassuring, with a strong focus on pastoral care. A follow-up taster day helped our son feel comfortable in the environment. He was later invited back for a drama scholarship day. Overall, this felt like a good fit for a bright, motivated child who might benefit from a smaller, less pressurised setting. My son also applied for a drama scholarship and found the drama assessment fun. He didn’t get a drama scholarship but was offered a place but in the end we went for Forest.

So - would we do this differently? I asked my son if he would do it again BEFORE he got any offers and he said yes as he thought it had helped him overall as a person. We agreed however that we'd have skipped the grammar and probably have asked my son to apply to another indie however. North London indies are competitive but the Latymer/ grammar experience is off the scale and not in a good way.

However - both the 11+ and independent entrance routes increasingly seem designed for children who have been intensively prepared from a very young age. That isn’t the reality for many state-school families, even those in strong schools. I’ve also noticed that platforms like Atom are now suggesting short, regular practice from as early as Year 3 in preparation for 11+, which can start to feel like an arms race rather than a measured approach to learning. Latymer’s position is particularly complex. As a grammar school, its purpose is to offer academic opportunities regardless of background. While huge congratulations to the children who secure places — they’ve clearly worked very hard — it’s difficult not to question how accessible the process truly is for families without the means to invest heavily in preparation.

Lastly, as this was our first rodeo, we also didn't realise how hard as a family we would find it to set him doing a load of extra study - not just to always arrange and support it (weekends get restricted, fast), but the worry in case he'd done all this extra study and didn't get any indie or grammar offers, and whether this would affect his view on the benefits of working extra hard. The emotional toll is not small on anyone!! In the end his hard work paid off, but I didn’t sleep that well for about 6 months…

Hope this might be helpful to people about to plan for next year! :) Please share your experiences if any of this chimes...

Hello, thank you for posting this! I’ve been thinking about grammar applications for my DS (who is only year 3!) and this has been very helpful. Really hard to get honest opinions as many people will say they didn’t tutor at all/not much is needed, and others will say that you need to go hard for years (looks like closer to the truth! The emotional toll on child and family is something I’m very conscious of.

If anyone else reading this wants to share how it was for them I think I and other parents would find it massively helpful.

Big congrats to you and your son OP!

the grammar places are really tough - it can take quite a bit of maturity and determination on the part of the child to ensure they don’t get questions wrong. Which is what is needed to pass - pretty much no silly mistakes.. though it’s not all wasted having a good foundation in KS2 is a good place to be to start secondary school without any attainment gaps. We did small group (child 1) and online tutoring (child2 Covid) which wasn’t as expensive.

Name changed. My experience is of a mix of grammar and top public school
applications. As a parent and tutor I would say do a mix of the different apps plus written past papers like the ISEB tests. I would only tutor for English and Maths. English is basically being able to read and understand a text particularly language (explain quotes, language techniques and analyse effects). Maths: get them doing the Maths Challenge and other practice papers and they should be scoring well on that from early on. I cover the top public schools for applications. Once the ISEB score is over 120 it’s about the interview all the way; you just have to encourage the child to be confident, interested and say something really positive about the school. It is absolutely gruelling for parents and students alike, but worth it when they get in! Also don’t give up on the waiting list; they move a lot over the two year period to entry.

My DD received a offer from City, Highgate and Jags! We never had a tutor and never did practice before Year 6! She did 3 months prep in ATOM for the formats. She wasnt in prep school, she was in all through independent school.

Most parents focus heavily on extra maths and English tutoring, but I chose to prioritise instrument lessons and sports instead. I truly believe these activities helped her develop better focus and balance in her studies. She went into the exam feeling calm and relaxed, because our daily life was never centred around these tests-of course we would have been happy if she had passed, but we wouldn’t have been upset if she hadn’t.

My DD simply loves reading, and apart from that we didn’t do anything extraordinary. Please don’t feel disheartened- And I truly believe that if you did all the preparation you possibly could and your child still didn’t get in, it may simply mean that the school wasn’t the right fit-because even if he had been accepted, your DC might have needed extra support there to keep up.

I also asked the admissions of Highgate, and they said that students usually come about 50/50 from state and independent schools. So there are many children who attend state schools and still gain places. In fact, most of the students who receive bursaries come from state schools anyway.

What matters most isn’t choosing the school at the top of the league tables, but finding the school that truly suits your child.

You are clearly caring, involved parents, and I’m sure you will find the right place for him. And most importantly, don’t forget to congratulate your child so he never feel like they have failed. 🙏🏻🫶🏻

@Lindalove really very helpful indeed. I knew it was competitive but seems crazy. We are in Yr 5 of a mixed ability indie so wanted to try out the more competitive ones over the 11 plus. I have no tutor but was going to just try ATOM alone and look for a tutor nearer the exam. I really dont want to push so hard as to leave my children struggling if they get in anywhere.

Side note : the new head at Forest School is excellent from my personal experience so I believe you have made a great choice.

A long post written by chatgpt.

Sounds like an ad for Atom.

Thanks - we’re not disheartened at all as Highgate wasn’t his first choice. It’s a lovely school but we actually preferred Forest overall! Well done for your child’s offers, sounds like they are very bright.

haha!! If I was a bot I wouldn’t have complained about Atom suggesting you use their platform from Year 3…..

Thank you for your post - it’s always so interesting to hear of others’ experiences as one thing I didn’t realise was how lonely the process can be, as prep schools quite rightly prefer parents not to discuss too much as it does affect the children - it really is very hard to say things in a way that doesn’t imply there are better or worse schools, which will affect the kids even if they seem even keeled.

maybe another point I’ll put here is how much a no from a school (even if you realise it was a stretch, or it wasn’t quite right for your child) can affect emotions. It’s very hard to hear that someone somewhere doesn’t feel your child is right for them. You fundamentally believe your child is wonderful (and they are!) and it can be disheartening to realise not everyone out there feels the same…

Thanks Minorie! I would say I think Atom is great as a base for learning, and the ‘progress tracker’ prediction was right for his target schools except for Latymer. I got very annoyed at the SAS scoring however as Atom suggest higher than I think is necessary for schools - most preps use Atom so if your child is getting above 100 you’re at average for many prep kids.

There seems to be expectation children all hit a score of 120 plus which is panic inducing - not all kids can be in the top 10% as well… otherwise they’d not be a top 10%!

I would recommend getting a tutor in to assess your child though to help gauge which schools to apply for. We knew that the very elite schools might be a stretch so didn’t bother. We especially found the tutors helpful to hone technique and timing, especially as each school has a specific assessment process you need to prep for.

If helpful - my DC is at an academic prep. The work ramped up in Y5, with homework on Atom as well as weekly (term time) English writing exercises at weekend (eg a descriptive piece, complete a story). paper practice during holidays with set weeks off for a break.

we didn’t do extra tutoring or interview prep, but in hindsight extra interview work would have helped, as it is daunting for some 10year olds to shine in front of a stranger in a strange setting. For my DC in particular he found group exercises difficult as he felt more shy in front of peers than a teacher who can draw out the best from him.

he didn’t get through to St Paul’s, and had offers from all schools that had one on one interviews, and no offers from schools that had group interviews.

I agree with so much of what you’ve written about the prepping intensity OP. We ended up deciding that it was going to be too much for our dc to go to one of the N London schools and dc then went outside London to St Chris in Hertfordshire.

People do use our school as a backup if they don’t get one of the N London schools but ironically the GCSE results there are actually better than at some of the more hothouse schools locally.

My dc is very happy and we are really happy with our choice.

I should have added the St Chris entry process - non selective but they say students need to be at least average for cohort academically to get in. There is a VR and NVR test and an interview with the Head. Art scholarship and academic scholarship on offer. Much more chilled process than most of the N London schools.

Why do people think just because others know how to use bullet points and headings, things are written by chatgpt? It's a special kind of illiteracy to not be able to recognise human writing. I didn't think it looked like that OP. Thanks for all the info.

We had similar experience with my older daughter. She was at a prep and while they gave us an atom membership as part of the overall fees they didn't pay for the bit that told you the scores, so we had to pay for another one and then they didn't link up the data of the two profiles, which was annoying. We also had to pay for timed practice papers for the Consortium exams for three weekends before the final exams as they didn't actually take them through exactly what the exam would look and play like online. For instance our daughter could do the comprehension easily in terms of knowing the answer but needed practice on the computer, the text being on the left with numbered paragraphs and an in-screen scrolling system, and questions on the right. She needed practice in exam technique and knowing which things you could return to by looking at where there were back buttons and where there weren't.

Also in the consortium exams there are some questions at the end IIRC which are like a massive puzzle, finding different elements in different texts with maths ans VR and NVR all included and they don't expect you to get it all, sort of like a timed escape room puzzle. They look at the way you approach it. DD needed help understanding the nature of that because she was worried that she couldn't simply answer it and ran out of time.

The extra practice papers were like £300!!! Thank you prep school, you had one job. The clue is in your name.

We had one tutor from year 5 onwards for maths only.

Also the prep school was incredibly precious about simply telling us the scores of their last few years. For example from our school 6 people went to godolphin and latimer over the last 3 years, this is their average score. To help us see the actual requirement for each school. The part that drove me crackers was that all the schools collude in this idea that it's quite random who gets in,
"oh it's all on the interview", when there is a very predictable pecking order of scores so everyone knows the ranking, St Paul's girls wants a score of x then Frances Holland wants a score of y and, say, Fulham blah blah wants a score of z...

All I wanted was an honest and accurate sense of what those scores were so I could prepare my daughter for the range of schools in which she would be most academically suited. Yes I know she will need to do the interview as well but there is in fact a cutoff point of scores which is different for each school, and the range of schools caters for everyone, so there is in practice a ranking.

Agree very much on this. There was some discussion amongst parents at our state primary but not a lot, as only a few were applying - happily they all got places other first choice schools though. It is lonely and also it seems normal for children to apply to 3,4 or even 5 schools! It’s a LOT!

I also agree about the emotions - I think I’ve found it useful as it’s given me a much better steer on where my son is, who he is, and what’s likely best for him. It’s worth remembering that the indie schools are often looking for a cultural fit too - at Forest they clearly want children who will use all their amazing facilities and clubs, who get excited about trying things and learning for example.

Thank you for this, it’s an interesting read.

I’m in catchment for DAO, QE Boys and Latymer and DS is working at the correct level but it just seems like such a lottery due to the sheer number of applicants.

It’s definitely an arms race at DS’ prep. Parents say they aren’t tutoring or using atom but the kids themselves tell you they are!

I tell myself it’s the right school for the child and that will vary, but also that there is more than one school that will suit my child. It would be very rare that only one school would suit them and the rest would be awful.

@Lindalove thanks for such a generous post. I am thinking of doing the same for SW London. We did both selective state & private 11+ from a good state school and now we're through it (with better results than expected) it was quite a good experience.

The challenge from state is the loneliness and the lack of confidence in the process/outcome, especially how your kid is performing relative to what the schools normally require. I assumed preps were great for that as it's what you are paying for!

But from our state cohort, the kids got a lot of offers from a wide range of schools - much more than expected. So I would say to fellow state parents to hold your nerve, it's not as bad as it seems. Near us Alleyns and Emanuel that i know of have state % offer targets too which help negate the prep advantage.

Many parents would appreciate that post I'm sure.

I think there are generally fewer applications now as more families are moving out of London, but the competitive schools are still competitive...

I got the impression that our state school had provided him with the foundations but he did need that extra tutoring to help him consolidate and build on his maths, plus help to really apply and strengthen everything he had learnt in english. Building technique and confidence to take exams was also critical.

There is no way we could have afforded primary private school so we always knew it would be a bit of a risk to then make the leap to selective private school, but it is good to know it can be done!!

It’s worth remembering for Latymer grammar school (have to move into catchment by January to be eligible for a place) that children from anywhere in the country can take the exam and that many will use their 11+ exams as a free mock for a school they actually want this reason. The schools know this and it costs them a fortune (£40k is a figure I’ve heard) to run and mark the exams, so the process will only ever be a conveyor belt one. It means in practice that while there may be thousands of children there, around half or more may not actually want for a place.

if parents are considering taking those exams I’d say buy some mock papers for them (yes they’re expensive, but they give you the actual format of the exams and parents will often re sell them after) and get your child to sit an exam in the actual school where you’re applying to. Susan daughtrey etc run mocks at Latymer, so you have an experience of being in one of the rooms used.

We were also advised to pay to sit mock exam (we did two) at Sutton grammar school too, as a large volume of children sit the exam, so they have that experience of queuing with a few hundred children, getting a candidate number, leaving their parents, exam etiquette etc.

What happens usually though is that a lot of children end up very bunched together around the pass level. Schools then have more “technically strong enough” candidates than places, and that’s where the interview/activity day actually decides things. They’re looking for who will function in lessons: answering when picked on, coping with mistakes, not shutting down in a group task. Teachers talk to each other afterwards, it isn’t just a polite tour.
I’ve seen this from the other side and a few people in my year were brilliant on papers but didn’t get offers from certain schools, and others with similar scores did, and the difference everyone noticed was how they handled the group tasks and conversations with staff. The exam gets you onto the shortlist, but it doesn’t rank everyone cleanly once they’re all in the same band.

We actually went through a very similar journey. We just swapped NBH for Belmont Mill Hill.

I totally agree with your observations. From how early preparations need to start (year 3 feels quite early), to how tasking it is as a family.

Something I thought it was useful was to set things as having options beyond the comprehensive. If there was no offer, then it just meant there were less options available, instead of making it the sole goal.

In the end, I’m glad he got an offer to join Forest as well.

Thank you for the information - super helpful. We are still quite early (year 2) but dreading the process when the time comes.

No worries. In the end it’s been worth it and my son got a place at his favourite school, so we can’t complain. On reflection we’d not bother with the grammar school entry if we were doing this again, as it is so ultra competitive, it was the worst experience of the whole process, with such low odds to get a free school space.

We found we really wobbled about the whole thing at that point (September is Latymer exam time) but then the independent school assessments from Nov- Dec were much more relaxed in comparison.

This is a really good point as fundamentally it’s about whether your child if a good cultural fit for the school at least for independents, how many places are available, and what the competing peer group is like in any year. Add to that that kids have off days - our son loses resilience when hungry for example - and it’s clear there’s a big chunk of luck involved too.