Not impressed with APS (Haringey). Other school recommendations

[Haringeymom]

I went to their open evening this week and it felt rather unwelcoming and chaotic. I got the impression that they thought that they don't need to bother, as they are oversubscribed.

The space felt very cramped and unloved as well.

Any recommendations for other schools in the borough, ideally that are good with SEN?

Open days don't always give the best impression because they are chaotic by nature, with hundreds of adults and their kids squashing along corridors. APS is the best performing school in the area by a country mile and the outcomes of its pupils far greater than at other schools in area. That said, Heartlands does have a good reputation for its SEN provision. Our DD went to Hornsey School for Girls and I wouldn't recommend it.

Have a look at Heartlands. Very well organised.

APS is famous for this. They are incredibly unwelcoming on the open day, esp for SEN kids. My DD has an ECHP and Mr McKenzie said something so awful to me on the open evening 5 years ago I still remember it today. Saying that, I've heard nothing but good things about it once you're in. I think they get such a huge amount of Sen parents coming it's just unsustainable. HHS is great too but you may find the same happens with them, as they are also incredibly popular. There are lots of awful schools that put on a brilliant performance on open evening and I wouldn't judge a school by one. That's my advice.

I'm comparing it to other open evenings I have been on, and this one was worse by a huge margin. Others had more people, but the staff and pupils still managed to be welcoming and open.

APS staff seemed harassed and fed up, but perhaps that is a realistic picture.. You would hope that they would put their best foot forward on the open evening though.

Thank you for the context, I wasn't aware. I didn't even get an opportunity to talk to anyone about anything, let alone SEN: it was too chaotic and staff gave a vibe of very much not being open to conversation.

It is interesting that some of the less popular schools put a lot more effort into their open evenings. I take the point of not judging them by this solely, but the vibe just felt so off.b

My son is in year seven there and I really like it so far. Strong discipline but still warm and seem to know and like the children. Quite old fashioned values which I like- anti smartphone, encouraging of extra curricular and outdoor activities and encouraging parents to let their kids work towards independence. We had a free choice of schools and went for this one out of some very good offerings.

My big son does not have any SEN, though and I think it might not be right for my very introverted littlie who has ADHD, although it does apparently have a fantastic SEN provision. It is early days but I am investigating Laurel Park in Enfield for him.

Depends on the type of SEN but my closest friends with SEN children have been really impressed with Parkview and Greig City (but the behaviour is not as good as APS).

I knew two people that worked at Heartlands and both said that it was not all it was cracked up to be and senior leadership talked the talk without walking the walk. Despite hearing from people on here that it is excellent for SEN, the headteacher was very keen to distance herself from that on the open day and I wonder if they are having the same issue APS did/has: such a great reputation for SEN they are struggling to meet need and so they were trying to distance themselves a bit.

My main driving factors for choosing APS were personal recommendations and liking the values as opposed to the open evening which is slightly hell on wheels as it is rammed (when we went there was monsoon like rain which thinned the herd a bit and I got to speak to some teachers one on one which was great). Open morning better as they leave you in the hands of the kids who are obviously completely unprepared (I.e. not told what to say) and left to show you what you want.

Completely suits me and my family and they clearly are able to work very successfully with SEN but they will not bend the rules for parents who think their children should be the exception (as opposed to genuine need). E.g. my son is adopted and has a dedicated member of staff who looks after all LAC and former LAC kids and form tutors have extra equipment and are on hand to help SEN kids who might struggle with forgetting and losing things. However, there is no point complaining if little Mollie is upset that she has a ten min lunchtime detention for being late to class and it is so terrible she might not have enough time for a leisurely lunch. It will fall on deaf ears. So if that is not your jam then there will be others that are a little less strict but not hugely- all schools in Haringey are strict to some degree as they are so big.

Do you have an EHCP so you can look at anywhere in borough? Or are you restricted by distance? Might help narrow down the options- I visited all Haringey secondaries other than Hornsey, Fortismere and St Thomas More when looking for our son.

Sorry, also to add I found the local Facebook groups amazingly helpful when we were making our decision as I got to talk to parents with kids who were there- an insider view is incredibly useful.

We have kids in APS and couldn’t be happier. The headteacher does put a show on the open evening (perhaps not a good one) but on the day to day most of the staff is very helpful and teachers really care. We had some issues with bullying that were handled very well by the school.
I agree with what someone said about being a bit old fashioned in terms of value - like being super strict with uniforms and phones, but my children love the school and are really thriving there.

In any case your options in the area are Heartlands or Fortsmere.

There are also a couple of autism-focussed schools if that’s helpful (though you need an EHCP, and obviously have to need a relatively high level of support). I mention in case useful. Holmewood is one. I need to google to remember the name of the other - it’s something like Orange Grove.

I remember not even being able to enter a lot of the rooms, The only room we got into was the Turkish language classroom. We had no interest in it but it was nearly empty. It felt like the whole borough was there and it must be so overwhelming for the staff. I would say that if we were doing this again, I would choose APS or HHS.

@Barbadosgirl "I knew two people that worked at Heartlands and both said that it was not all it was cracked up to be and senior leadership talked the talk without walking the walk. Despite hearing from people on here that it is excellent for SEN, the headteacher was very keen to distance herself from that on the open day and I wonder if they are having the same issue APS did/has: such a great reputation for SEN they are struggling to meet need and so they were trying to distance themselves a bit."

I think Ms Roberts can be a bit marmite and some of the staff don't like her, but same goes for Mr McKenzie. Mr Levis is now the Head at HHS anyway. Leadership is not easy and it's easy to criticise but they do genuinely want kids to achieve and believe that all of them can. The hoops they have to jump through to get those kids results is insane and you couldn't pay me any money in the world to be a school leader at the moment.
And yes, that's definitely true re SEN and wanting to shift that reputation. Ms Roberts is incredible and she did a lot for SEN provision in the borough, it's largely thanks to her that The Grove exists. There came a point though where HHS and APS were taking on 20+ EHCP's per year group whilst other schools in the borough had 1-4. It was unsustainable and it's just not possible to give good provision to that many children especially when youre dealing with a huge % of SEN without EHCPs- some of whom should definitely have them and are entering Y7 not being able to read or write. The picture is much more balanced now in the borough, and rightly so. They are both mainstream schools, and it got to the point where people needed to be reminded of that.

@Zhu Holmewood used to be amazing but I've heard absolutely awful things about it since it was bought by Cavendish.

Ah thanks, that is useful to know. I was thinking about this today and wondering if I should give Heartlands a second look for my littlie as it felt like somewhere I wanted to like but didn’t and it may be I might just get a better vibe from the new HT.

Gosh don't have kids in different schools if you don't have to! If your younger is a girl though I would highly recommend Parliament Hill School.

Haringey very much spreads the EHCPs evenly nowadays, so while we do have an EHCP, we may well be allocated our nearest school.

I applied for Holmewood already (it's a separate application as it is an independent school) and they rejected my child, so it is not an option. As it is an independent school we cannot appeal that. I wasn't that impressed with it either, but were considering it due to limited options.

We are looking at the Grove too, but the rumour currently is that they are only taking children with profound learning difficulties as well as autism.

Little one is a boy and as things currently stand I cannot see APS being the best choice for him. They would potentially only be there together for two academic years anyway. I guess much could change in a couple of years anyway.

We do have an EHCP, but given Haringey likes to spread them evenly they may force us into our nearest school. I am still looking though.

I have seen shocking behaviour from Park view and Grieg city kids outside school, which really puts me off. My child is not at all streetwise due to her SEN and would flounder.

Happy to stand corrected but I am not sure you will find many Haringey schools vastly different to Greig/Park view in terms of behaviour but you could try Heartlands. They did have this strict policy of not allowing kids to congregate around Wood Green after school. So they are probably very on it in terms of behaviour. My friend’s little girl goes to Park View and she is the least street wise child you can imagine and absolutely tiny but has found it incredibly nurturing.

If that happens than appeal. We had to appeal and won. It's not that difficult but people will scaremonger you.
I'm surprised you've heard that about the Grove. They are absolutely brilliant for kids with autism and they have a special pathway for GCSEs etc. Have you looked at out of borough schools with ASD units? How severe is your child's autism?

If you are able to look at private, St Margaret’s has a good reputation for autistic girls. It’s not a SEN school, but it’s very small and nurturing, but follows a mainstream syllabus. I’m sad to hear Holmewood isn’t doing so well, as there are so few schools that cater for autistic kids.

@Haringeymom I just saw you have a girl. Please look at Parliament Hill School. Pm me if you want but they are brilliant and worth the journey esp for a sensitive SEN girl.

@Haringeymom my Yr 5 daughter and I just finished a tour of GCA and looking at PV later this week. I found the tour impressive at GCA ( she liked the arts and gym.) she more creative/sporty than academic The school seemed huge but looked modern and well kept with good facilities. The children seemed polite and from and from a diverse background. The gym had a young boy practicing gymnastics (he is also featured on a tv program and felt GCA had had supported him). My daughter seemed impressed.

For Park View @Barbadosgirl agree with your thoughts on PV & SEN, we know a lot of creatives and professionals that have moved into the area and have sent their kids to PV and are happy with that decision. The kids we know at PV are well mannered and polite. A lot of Belmont junior families seemed to be supporting PV with news of a new English teacher from a good Crouch End school moving in. It seems very supportive of children that require additional support but that also are good independent self sufficient learners.

I am torn between Heartlands, GCA and PV for the SEN support. Any honest reviews welcome.

One of my son’s primary school friends goes to GCA and she has SEN- her mum v impressed so far. Similar with PV. Appreciate that is second hand.

Out of the 3 I'd choose HHS or PV depending on the child's personality.

The gym had a young boy practicing gymnastics (he is also featured on a tv program and felt GCA had had supported him).

I'm pretty sure I know who that boy is! Is it a BBC drama he's on?

We live so far away I didn't think it would be worth looking at. Is there catchment that big? It's an easy journey on the overground