Tell me about Citizenship GCSE. Which is apparently compulsory at my DD's school. She doesn't want to do it.

[bellinisurge]

As it says in the subject, Citizenship GCSE has now been deemed compulsory at my DD's school. She would prefer to do Triple Science but doesn't want to lose a free space in her GSCE options to do it. She deliberately didn't go to a faith school (despite being in a feeder primary) to avoid having RE GCSE forced on her.
Any suggestions?

If she is more interested in science could she switch to a 14+ STEM based school if there is one in your area.

I think OP's point, Woolf, is that to make room for citizenship as an actual exam subject, something has to be bumped off the list of other choices - so suppose OP's DD had wanted to do history, geography and music, and now finds herself only able to do 2 out of 3. OP knew this would happen with RE at a faith school - that timetabling compulsory RE would lead to less choice in other GCSEs. She didn't realise there would be an equivalent subject at a non-faith school with the knock-on effect of leaving less space in the timetable for a full range of options.

I don't doubt that the material citizenship sets out to cover is interesting and relevant to children growing up - I'm just not sure it's so interesting and relevant that it merits being made compulsory, or that a lot of the same issues couldn't come up in parts of the syllabus in say geography (globalisation) or history (how we came to have a parliamentary system, how that differs, for instance, from the system the US have, or Germany).

It's not the subject itself which is the problem - it's making it compulsory and thus taking away the choice of doing something else which perhaps might be more useful to OP's DD for future career choices, or more interesting to her, or for which she had a real talent.

I might be wrong but I think if this wasn't offered as a GCSE the school would still be required to teach it in some form anyway (possibly under the name of PHSE or something).
Maybe market it as you'll need to learn this important life stuff anyway so you my might as well get a grade at the end of it that you can add to your list of GCSEs.

@Woolff , all good. I do that kind of stuff for a living. But it seems like a waste of a GCSE slot.
Dd told me that if she didn't have friends and didn't otherwise like the school she'd ask me to move her. Yes, I know that's teenage melodrama and I am trying to dial her down. But she has a point. It seems like a waste.

Good point - is this one GCSE out of 8, severely restricting choice, or is it an addition 9th GCSE on the grounds that "we have to teach this stuff anyway, so they might as well get the piece of paper for it"?

@Ilovemaisie , kind what I'm trying to tell her. I got a 4th Alevel - General Studies - in that way. But it doesn't seem appropriate for GCSE to narrow her choices even more than timetabling normally requires

I could see the bonus number if she wasn't academically strong. But she is.

I am going to admit I don't know the syllabus but I am surprised that people seem to be saying that citizenship isn't an important or interesting subject. I would have thought learning how to be a good citizen and how your country works (eg politics etc) is the most important subject a school should teach.
(I don't see why this should be a graded subject though. It's just important life knowledge)

It won't use up a whole slot though. It'll only use up the one hour a week that they'd have to teach it anyway.

(It's very very unusual to find a school which teaches either RE or citizenship GCSE for a full 3 hours a week (or whatever time other subject have.)

All students have to cover citizenship. Support the school. Tell her to suck it up. And stop being a melt

It's not really "additional" if they only offer a total 9 GCSEs. Even if FE choices are based on the top 8.

My DC have to so RE/Citizenship/PHSE and in one case it is all moshed into 1 hour per week, so they are doing 11 GCSE subjects. The other does compulsory RE (and loves it) as one of her 10 and Citizenship/PHSE alternates each week - an hour a fortnight.

Slightly tongue in cheek, but not entirely.

My extended coursework suggestion for citizenship would be "Read Robert Altemeyer's The Authoritarians then look at online discussions like this thread, and see if you can separate posters into those who are instinctively 'authoritarian followers' and those who are instinctively suspicious of authority."

Citizenship and RE are pretty different.

I’ve not taught citizenship for a while; but when I did I found it very fascinating. When I taught it they had to do a research project of their choice about a social matter.

Why AQA GCSE Citizenship Studies?

Students will gain a deeper knowledge of democracy, government and law. They'll learn how to create sustained and reasoned arguments, present their own viewpoints and those of others, and plan practical citizenship action that delivers benefits for society.

They'll also gain the ability to recognise bias, critically evaluate argument, weigh evidence, and look for alternative interpretations and sources of evidence. Higher education and employers value all of these essential skills.

I do get the feeling there are now two groups of people talking past one another on this thread.

The issue is not "is citizenship important and should it be taught?" (answer: fairly unanimous yes), or even "is citizenship GCSE a worthwhile GCSE?" (again, fairly unanimous yes).

The issue is "given that, once you've eaten up a substantial chunk of GCSE time with the rightly compulsory core subjects (maths, science, English, MFL), should citizenship be compulsory even if this means a child may have to give up history, or music, or computer science, or... as a result?"

I'm not surprised she's being awkward if shes anything like the OP. Maybe a please in your next demand/question ffs

Citizenship is a very soft GCSE and a waste of time for an academic child.

It would help if the OP could tell us how many hours per week/fortnight will go on this v normal options subjects.

@CaraDuneRedux

I do get the feeling there are now two groups of people talking past one another on this thread.

The issue is not "is citizenship important and should it be taught?" (answer: fairly unanimous yes), or even "is citizenship GCSE a worthwhile GCSE?" (again, fairly unanimous yes).

The issue is "given that, once you've eaten up a substantial chunk of GCSE time with the rightly compulsory core subjects (maths, science, English, MFL), should citizenship be compulsory even if this means a child may have to give up history, or music, or computer science, or... as a result?"

Precisely right. I think there is almost an exact parallel with PE. It's a fundamentally good idea that all schoolchildren should do some physical exercise every week so it is appropriately a compulsory part of the curriculum. It is also a good that there is a more in depth exam syllabus for those with a particular aptitude and interest in the area to study. But making PE GCSE compulsory would be ridiculous, particularly if it prevented children from taking a subject that was more suited to their interests, abilities and aspirations. I see Citizenship as much the same. Everyone should learn the basics but it isn't necessary for it to be a compulsory examined subject.

My son did Citizenship, and didn't really enjoy it. However, it was an easyish exam, the coursework/group presentations was interesting and he is now quite pleased that he knows something about his legal rights. A bonus was that his school started it in Y9 and they take the exam in Y10 and it was done as an 11th GCSE.

You seem to think your dd is only taking 9 GCSEs - 'though there may be wiggle room for a 10th'. I would suggest getting her wiggling and making sure she takes 10. Then she can use Citizenship as a chance to have a less pressurised lesson during the week, and be confident that it will probably give her a high grade to boost her CV. And she may find it more interesting than she thinks after all . . .

My child went to a school with compulsory RE, the taking up of options is a pain. But it is what it is, and ultimately they can do their best, or tread water if they don't care.

If it's compulsory, it's by definition not a choice. It's not taking an option, a slot, a 'choice' for another GCSE.

It takes time to teach and has to be taught in some form, even if not as a GCSE. So that time would never be allocated to a different subject. Gaining a qualification is at least some recognition in addition to the skills achieved.

You could argue the same about something like English Literature. It's not core, functional English, but most schools teach it alongside Language. It takes up what could be an extra GCSE in another subject and can be aligned with other humanities subjects (which usually aren't all compulsory, even if one has to be selected for the school's results 'bucket') as much as English, but people don't complain or try to remove it.

I doubt the chance exists within the timetable (as in both there won't be enough hours left to cover another GCSE, and there won't be the staffing/rooming to offer something additional at that time) for anything else.

In some schools, as an example, pupils can choose triple science, and because of how it's timetabled, then can't physically then accommodate a language and a technology, forcing two of just one subject type.

If it's compulsory, it's by definition not a choice. It's not taking an option, a slot, a 'choice' for another GCSE.

That's not quite right though is it? Because of English Baccaleurate/Progress 8 etc have requirements. English Lit and Lang get done, generally in 1 GCSE slot as well (though I tend to agree, it does mean everyone does one "humanity").

Citizenship is a perfectly valid GCSE, it's just more of an issue as it is one of 9 rather than one of 10/11/12 (though god knows that would be a lot of pressure). If not taught to GCSE it can be an hour a week/fortnight, not 6 hours a fortnight.

@Ihatemyseleffordoingthis

That's not quite right though is it? Because of English Baccaleurate/Progress 8 etc have requirements. English Lit and Lang get done, generally in 1 GCSE slot as well

Well no, either Lang or Lit can be counted, but pupils are timetabled both both - 'English' is on the timetable as much as a double 'Science' and half as much as 'Maths.' It takes twice as much time, which arguably (although noone really does argue) could be for something a pupil would prefer.

At DD's school, English & Maths get the same time as each other, though more than an 'option' subject.

And that's the point. No one really knows whether the OP's DC is really missing out on a different GCSE by doing Citizenship, as we don't know how much time is being allocated compared with option subjects.