Can I ask a stupid question? What's an IGCSE?

[BelleTheBeatnik]

I've only encountered the term on MN, and always assumed it meant you take the exams online instead of as a written exam, because that's the rule when you stick an 'i' infront of any other word! Silly Belle

I've just realised I'm dead wrong. I tried Googling, but it just left me confused - I am the mother of primary school aged DC, and my GCSEs were taken a looong time ago.

So what's the difference between bog-standard GCSEs and IGCSE? No reasons why I want to know, except I'm very curious to know if technology is involved.

IGCSEs aren't any more difficult than GCSEs.

They don't have coursework or controlled assessments so whatever is assessed by those means in GCSEs are done on the actual papers in GCSE.

For example, questions to do with practical aspects of science are in the papers rather than in ISAs or IAAs.

I have a friend who is on the admissions panel of a major London teaching uni and she was saying a lot of applicants for medicine are predicted As and have equally shining CVS full of impressive achievements.

So what does the panel do? They look at the GCSE results and if one candidate has a clean slate of A* iGCSEs and the other has same but for GCSEs ....

I was quoting from an exam board website - seems strange that this hasn't been updated www.edexcel.com/quals/igcse/igcse09/Pages/default.aspx.

Am from a non-grammar area and the only schools that I am aware that offer this locally are independent schools.

Another here who has taught both. Igcse and gcse science are equal difficulty. Tested differently but no less or more difficult. I think some school's pr machines have managed to convince parents that igcse is much harder in attempt to make themselves seem more academic somehow. Actually there are for more skills involved in gcse so when they go fully terminal it may well be the case that the gcse actually will be harder.

Re the medical school comment, I would take this with a pinch of salt, given that my friends DD has 2 offers from medical schools despite the horrific handicap of not only having GCSEs but also from a (whispers) Comp.

just - When you have candidates that are all predicted top A level grades and all the candidates have equally impressive CVs then it has to come down to something as minor as who has the better GCSEs and once again, if every has the top grades then what are you going to do?

Well friends experience suggests what you do not do is say oh candidate x has iGCSEs, whereas candidate Y has GCSEs, so let's make the offer to candidate x

I have taught both. IGCSE courses do have coursework - they are by no means exam only. In my subject (English) the IGCSE we are currently doing is more tedious than GCSE though...

just - My friend is on the admissions panel of the university. Your experience has been different but it doesn't invalidate my point which is based on someone who actually makes the decisions.

Agreed, but I think it is probably quite unusual.

TBH I am very surprised that with 2 candidates of equal academic ability, the panel does not use skills gained outside the class room as a more appropriate decider, such as, volunteering in a care home, or working as a hospital porter.

Bit of a shame that someone who makes important decisions has fallen for the igcse hype though.

Yes, dd is studying for IGCSEs. And yes you can opt for the coursework + exam option.

Here's the High Master of Manchester Grammar in 2009 explaining why MGS switched entirely to IGCSEs:
"The entire GCSE syllabus is rather like getting able students through a combination of dressage and a low hurdle race. You have to explain to them how they put their feet very carefully over low hurdles so they will not irritate the examiner. It's not challenging at all."
Full article here:
www.guardian.co.uk/education/2009/mar/04/private-schools-gcses-manchester-grammarschool
Lights blue touch paper and retires...

Why is no one paying any attention to the bit where I say that ALL the candidates have equally impressive CVs?

And you are right. It is a shame that these highly qualified and intelligent individuals have been suckered into believing that iGCSEs are more demanding

Yes it is a shame PooshTun glad you agree.

web - Methinks you failed to notice that I was being sarcastic.

I was making the point that a highly academic panel of people have decided that in their opinion iGCSEs are more challenging. Yet you are of the opinion that you are right and that these highly qualified individuals are fools for believing the hype.

It's a shame that discussion about anything academic has to come down to point scoring, Tortu you started a downward spiral with talk of twaddle to posters who were just genuinely trying to help!

But tortu has actually taught the iGCSE, herself, but maybe she's not one of the highly qualified individuals,

Oh hang on, surely she must be if she teaches the blessed thing

Also, re manchester grammar school, they seem to be agreeing with tortus remarks re schools wanting to put students in for the exams where they will get the better grades
See this extract from the MGS website

For IGCSE Mathematics, Biology, Chemistry and Physics, the achievements of our candidates continue to be significantly better than performances in the same subjects before our move to IGCSE from home-based GCSEs.
Dr Christopher Ray
25 August 2011

Presumably neither the teachers nor the calibre of the students has changed, the only difference is the exam board.

re iGCSE Christopher Ray, high master of the highly selective £9,000-a-year boys school, said: "The decision is really what challenges the higher ability students we educate. The view within is that the new GCSEs will present even less of a challenge to the more able candidates than at present. They may well provide a very good answer for very many boys and girls, but not for our boys."
Who knows? All I know is that my DS is doing iGCSEs in most subjects and the syllabus is a heck of a lot more interesting than my science O levels were. So I'm happy with them for him.

An explanation for that is suggested here:

"Geoff Lucas, secretary of the Headmasters' and Headmistresses' Conference, which represents 250 leading private schools, said that heads he had spoken to had not said they chose IGCSEs because of the good results.

Asked why the grades were significantly better even than GCSE success rates at independent schools, he said: "There are some possible explanations. One is that (IGCSEs) are easier, but that does not hold water.

"The other is that they are taken by a very selective intake at the moment. I would say that when schools first started using them, they were doing so for bright kids for whom it was felt that GCSEs were not sufficiently challenging.

"Even if that does not explain these grades, if the course is more stimulating and the kids are responding to that, you are going to find more of them doing well. That is a good model for how an exam should work."

Full article here:
www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=6055169

Cross-posted with Honestyisbest - same point.

At the end of the day it doesn't matter whether you or your teacher friend think the iGCSE is the same or easier. What matters is the opinion of the person on the admissions panel.

Yes and in some of the schools where iGCSEs are chosen for sciences/maths etc 30-40% get places at Oxbridge. So I guess the admission panels are not unhappy with iGCSE.

Presumably the admissions panels agree with MGS, as it is the country's 22nd most successful school in terms of proportion of pupils admitted to Oxbridge, according to the 2011 Sutton Trust report, and 7th in terms of proportion admitted to highly selective universities.
Report here:
www.suttontrust.com/research/degree-of-success-university-chances-by-individual-school/