Why can't we talk about ££ without falling out?

[twofishes]

To cut a long story short I have a poor credit history (from way back when before I met him due to failed IVA, debts accrued trying to pay bills etc)he has a good credit rating , has credit but pays off early etc when he can
However this really affects how we deal with ££, we have separate accounts I work part time, him full time..I get Tax Credits in my account.the deal is I pay Childcare, Food , Petrol and 'so called' incidential (clothes, shoes dinner money, school stuff etc )the credit card payments, he pays Mortgage, insurances, council tax and utility bills insurance, gas & elec so we pay out about the same, but he has more ££ left over each month and has managed to accrue about £1.5K in his account ..I always have £0 by end of month but usually manage okay.
However last two months due to extra Childcare costs and Xmas I have been short to pay things so have to 'ask' hime for ££ which always results in a lecture from him about 'chucking money' away and a huge row!!
This month I have listed everything I have paid for (take outs, shoes for kids, xmas shopping etc) I need to ask him for ££ tonight and know it will end in huge row in fact I am actually NERVOUS about bringing the subject up..have even thought about borrowing money from Provident or someone instead of asking him ..how bad is that ?
Anyone else have the same problem or any advice how to deal with it all without arguing each time...my friends say he is a control freak and he is using the ££ to exert some kind of authority over me...I think it is just different ways of looking at ££

[fransmom]

please don't go elsewhere to borrow money, it will only get you deeper in debt. have you thought about going to your local citizens advice bureau to ask for their help? they offer free legal advice too, if you're getting hassle from your creditors and offer advice about bailiffs and what bailiffs can't do. how can you chuck money away when you have to pay for things like you do?

i must admit that ata firs tglance it does seem as though he wants to be holding the purse strings a bit tight. maybe he could pay for the take outs instead and then you wouldn't be without at the end of the month?

[TheIceQueen]

I think I agree with your friend TBH.

DH and I have seperate accounts. We've been married 8yrs and never got round to getting a joint account - then had financial difficulties - but all of it in DH's name - so my Credit History is still ok - if a little "scant", whereas his is still pretty bad.

I get my SMA, Tax Credits, Child Benefit and money from playing the organ at church into my account, he gets his wages into his.

I pay for the shopping, Credit Cards (his too), all Utilities and some of the incidentals. I sometimes have money left over at the end of the month, but not always.

He pays for the mortgage, council tax, Car HP, and various loans. Generally he doesn't have much left at the end of each month - but that depends on how much his bonus for the month was - so sometimes he's got quite a bit left (never enough for £1.5k though - his OD will be the last thing to be paid off). He does pay out more than me - but that's because his income is greater.

HOWEVER, if either of us is particularly short we always ask each other, and unless the person who is being asked is also short - then the answer is always "YES".

I think perhaps you do need to sit down with him (not when you're about to ask for money - a totally different time) and explain to him how you feel.

[fransmom]

ps and how can clothes be incidental? would he rather the children walk around with threadbare ones on? how on earth can he manage to accrue that much? does he give you anything towards childcare?

someone that xp knows has suggested to him that csa will want to take 20% of his earnings for maintenance if our daughter, would your p/h think of it like that maybe?
good luck sweetheart x

[TheIceQueen]

well - clothes don't need buying that often - and you can always buy cheap ones....

I have to say I'm genuinely shocked by how much some people spend on clothes each month - and it's not even like many of them are buying "ethically" so increasing the cost that way!

[twofishes]

Have 3 kids under 5yrs so always seems to be baby clothes or something needed the only thing I but new is shoes (and I get staff discount anyway)the last lot of clothes for DS2 (11months) were off Ebay and hand me down, DS1's school coat and last lot of jumpers were hand me downs too..DD's is off Ebay (there seems to be more for girls than boys on there)
I think if I am honest I feel I try really hard to save money and I am the one always saying 'no put that back etc ' to the kids but then he'll come home from work with the latest bike magazine having had lunch out because he can afford to ..and then when I am short ( like this month with buying Xmas presents and 'paying back' the money I 'borrowed' off him last month)I get the whole lecture and tutting then I explode and HUGE ROW ensues!!!..

[twofishes]

sorry am getting worked up already!! see what I mean I'll be on the ceiling by the time he comes home!!

[DanJARMouse]

im more at the fact he makes you pay him back - he sounds a real tight arse

[TheIceQueen]

oh - DH and I pay each other back......but then I guess it's a 2 way thing as he often borrows off me too.

[dragonstitcher]

I know what you mean. I have a bad credit history thanks to x-h. He got us into a tonne of debt and hid it from me. After we split, he disappeared leaving me to face up to the mortgage co. The house was repossessed and I was forced to make myself bankrupt. I have been solvent for many years now but I am not allowed to go overdrawn with my bank. DH and I have separate bank accounts, he has an overdraft.

I work part time. My wages, child tax credit and child benefit go into my bank. I pay for food, gas, electric, phone bill, TV license and water rates as well as school stuff, clothes, shoes, birthdays and christmas. I too have no money left over.

DH has gone well into his overdraft. He insists on buying things for his grownup sons who earn far more than we do. And then he expects me to pay for things because he does not want to damage his OD anymore. When I tell him I can't afford it, he gets shirty and complains that I am supposed to be helping him out!!!! How does he conveniently forget how much I contribute already!

Sorry for hijacking. It helps to know that I'm not alone in this, I hope it helps you too.

[titchy]

I think making a list of everything you have spent on this month is a great idea (do you want to share with us?). Put the ball straight back in his court and say Ok so where do you suggest I cut back?

[twofishes]

thanks it does DragonStitcher..just really bugs me cos it overshadows everything else when if we could talk about it calmly then it wouldn't be such a problem, feel like we are two separate people living in the same house sometimes!!
His ex left him in debt which was only paid off finally last year (inc the loan for their wedding!!)I feel I contribute a hell of a lot but am made to feel like a drain on HIS finances sometimes yet here I am with cutting my own hair, wearing ancient clothes hardly ever go out and he has an expensive hobbie because he needs to 'unwind' after work grrrrrrr!!!

[twofishes]

here goes my list for this 'month' in the actual list have included more detail like dates spent and what exactly on food wise etc :

Childcare Costs 26/11 to 7/12 £292
Owed money to DH from last month £126.00
Credit Cards (minimum and lump payments)£200
Kids Shoes x 3 £26.00
Amazon , woolies, Ebay for Xmas stuff £137.00
Food (have actually listed separate trips etc for what etc but total is) £196.00
Petrol £55.00
School Dinners £21.00
School Stuff (raffle, football Club, Xmas fair) £28.00
Take Out & Wine x 2 (with dates!) £30

Total £1120.00
Total Income with Tax Credits, Wage & Child Benefit £1120
Need to pay til 21st £290 Childcare (extra due to overtime) plus food shopping for 2 weeks (usually about £70)
which is what I need to 'borrow' from DH ..with overtime being paid next month can pay back (in theory!)
My point is if he helped out with Xmas presents, shoes and I didn't have to pay him back from last month..I'd have pretty much enough money for this month if I did budget food shopping! (hope my maths works out!)

[smithfield]

Sounds like his punishing you for baggage he's still carryong from the ex!.
Sorry probably doesnt help, but I do think he is being unreasonable.
Is he reasonable in other areas of the relationship, or is this the only real sticking point?

[millie865]

I know everyone organises money differently but it always surprises me that in a partnership each partner can end up with a different amount of money to spend on themselves at the end of the month.

Can you draw up a (realistic) budget showing all the outgoings you are both responsible for and how much money you each have coming in, then divide up who is responsible for what so you both have roughly the same amount left over each month? I know he is working full time and earning more than you working part-time, but presumably you are working part time becuase of childcare so should not be penalised for that.

[smithfield]

sorry just reading your list- so how much does he pay out monthly?

[twofishes]

This is the only sticking point really he is fairly laid back about everything else, is pretty hands on with kids when he gets home..
Also when he lost his job (by having huge falling out with his boss!) last Xmas I really supported him and borrowed ££ from my parents to cover and did all the sorting out so he didn't feel under pressure.
He see it that he works full time and therefore he should be allowed more ££ as his reward(he also 'underestimates' how much he has all the time) , he thinks I could also work full time but apart from the fact I wouldn't want my kids in full time childcare the cost would cancel out the extra money from working!
Mille..I don't think he would sit down and work that out as he wouldn't like me to know how much he has to spend each month ( he must spend at least £30 on magazines a month)

[twofishes]

Smithfield he pays out:

£615 Mortgage
£35 Car Insurance
£40 Mobile phone (his)
Elec & gas Direct Debit £60
Buildings/Home insurance £25
£126 Loan
£30 Life insurances
£45 SKY
£25 on Bus to work & shared petrol
Total £1001
Income £1300 (basic without bonus or overtime)

[smithfield]

So firstly- everythig he pays for a fairly static amounts- ie they dont change depending on needs. So he is able to budget easier than you, as no suprises.
Secondly he has 'at least' 300 surplus a month

This is not equal and is therefore incredibly unfair on you. Sorry I dont buy the full time excuse. 'YOU' work full time, paid woerk o/s home and Unpaid inside the home.
I think the whole financial balance (or inbalance more to the point) should be addressed. Currently its just not equal is it.

[smithfield]

*are fairly static amounts

[twofishes]

Think you're right Smithfield, after Xmas we need to sit down and go through it all and work out what is fairer, I don't mind struggling if he is too!but he isn't he is sat on a pile of money that makes him feel secure (that excess ££ in his account could go into our savings accounts for holidays and stuff!)..just got to get tonight over & done with !!

[smithfield]

To be fair- I think if he has been stung by his ex this may be part of it but- You shouldn't be punished for ex's conduct should you. And looking at the finances I think you are doing a great job!

[twofishes]

Thanks Smithfield its good to get an unbiased point of view on it all ...and thanks to everyone else for replying too

[warthog]

doesn't seem very fair to me. really you should pool your resourses, pay bills out of joint account. whatever is leftover, share it.

you work full time too.

[millie865]

I agree with what everyone else has said about you working full time too. Just because some of your work isn't paid doesn't mean its not work or isn't a major contribution to the family. Supposing you were at home full time, would that mean you shouldn't have any money for yourself?!

I know this might not work because your DP and you have different attitudes to money but what DH and I do is pay everything into a joint account then work out how much should be left after essentials and savings and split that equally. That amount goes into our own personal accounts and we can do what we like with it. What that generally means is that I spend more month to month (buy more clothes, have more expensive haircuts etc) and DH saves more to buy big 'boys toys'. And I work part time and pay far less than DH into the pot.

Reading this back it sounds a bit over complicated, but it works for us and saves disagreements about personal spending. But it probably only works if you can sit down and work out a budget for everything else (food, kids clothes as well as fixed outgoings) and stick to it.

[CarGirl]

I am you should be jointly deciding on what to spend your collective earnings on.