Am I being a mug - supporting him when he won't support me?

[Amykins35]

Hi, it's my first time here. Haven't got anyone to discuss this with and would appreciate some perspectives. It's complicated, but will try not to make it too long though you're welcome to ask anything you feel I've missed.
DP and I have been together for 4 years. I had a 2.5 year old when we met, we now have a 14 month old together. We were planning to move in together when I was pregnant as that's when our contracts on respective properties ran out. However, some extra debts from his marriage came to light and we couldn't afford to do so. When his contract ran out he moved into a room in a friends house which he doesn't pay for. He comes to visit for tea on work nights then sleeps at his friends, on nights off (generally 3 per week) he eats and sleeps here. He doesn't pay anything towards rent, food or bills here though he does pay maintenance towards our baby - though that's partly to reduce the CSA payment for his children from his marriage I suspect. All his money (around 40k salary) is going into paying off his debts.
He says that if he's being honest it'll be at least another 1.5/2 years before he can afford to move in with us. He would then like us to have another baby. I said that I wouldn't like a baby if I couldn't stay home with them for at least the first three years (personal preference) and he said that in that case we wouldn't be able to have another one as 'his wages wouldn't be enough to support us.' At the moment I do and pay for everything and think I'm being a mug for effectively supporting him to clear his debts when he isn't willing to support me in the future. Having another child isn't essential for me but it irritates me that I have far less money than 40k p/a yet it's ok for me to support him but he wouldn't do it for me.
Also, it's gone from having a baby together in a loving committed relationship where we were moving in together to him not living with us until our child is potentially almost 3.5 years old. Not to mention the fact this isn't good for either child, it means I do absolutely everything for them. I work from home and am also studying for a degree. Next year is my final year when I'll be doing my dissertation which is obviously a huge piece of work. Another student that's doing it this year said she's been in the library 4 days per week from 10am-11pm since September and still not finished. Youngest DD is difficult at night - she will only sleep if latched on so doing my university work is proving impossible. When I told DP how much work is involved next year he said he'd 'tell his mum to get DVD player fired up to entertain DD.' I just felt like screaming at him that it isn't his mums responsibility to have our DD (never mind the fact she never has, never offered and lives 1.5 hours away) that if he lived with us then he could do what normal partners do and help with the kids at night so I can work then. He's just done some work based exams which he got to study for every night interruption free as I have the kids yet I feel I could well fail the degree which I've invested my savings in and that is essential for my future career and for me to be able to provide for the kids. Not only that but if we reach the day where he moves in then things won't get easier for me as he won't know what to do with the kids/they'll want me.
I'm aware I'm ranting now so I'll stop there! Am I wrong to be feeling utterly pissed off at the situation?

[pinkyredrose]

Stop making excuses for him OP.

[ike1]

I'd take the extra tax credits I would be entitled to without him, get a reliable sitter and do the necessary col work. Get rid ffs.

[TheDoctrineOfSnatch]

This is how I'd expect it to work, logically:

He makes arrangements with the banks etc that he owes money to for a reasonable level of repayments that enable him to go on meeting everyday expenses. Whether this is a formal IVA or some other arrangements.

He moves in and sees his DD growing up

He and you have equal amounts of free time

He gives you extra support during your degree as this will improve the financial situation.

I don't know why you think his arguments are logical.

[TheDoctrineOfSnatch]

...and even if they were, would "logic" really outweigh supporting your family practically and emotionally, if not financially.

[tribpot]

I'd imagine your dd2 won't settle in the house because she knows you're there and would rather be with you, i.e. a competent parent, rather than one who doesn't even seem to know how to babysit, never mind parent.

The debt mountain is a blessing in disguise - otherwise he would be living with you and bleeding you dry already.

It is very, very common for people to run up debts again when they've paid them off, if they haven't addressed the underlying behaviour that got them into trouble. He lives in an unrealistic bubble where basically everyone is paying for him. This is not likely to be creating an environment where he learns to manage money properly ('properly' here meaning meeting his obligations whilst still breaking even, rather than hoarding all his money for himself).

Although the estrangement with your family has nothing to do with him, I don't think it's helping you because you don't have people in your corner in real life, saying 'what the FUCK is this guy on?'.

Walking around with the baby crying right next to where you are is a deliberately passive-aggressive act designed to upset both you and her. Seriously, this guy has no clue. I wouldn't let him look after my cat.

[KatieMiddleton]

Get a lodger for company and income. Get one keen to help out with the kids so you can study.

Get rid of cock lodger. Be happy.

[Amykins35]

She won't settle if I'm in the house (though personally I don't think he tries too hard) but even if I go to the library to work then he takes DD walking/driving or texts lots which makes me think she's unhappy then I can't concentrate.
This past week the kids and I have been ill and it's hit home how on my own I am. He's had a cold (kids and I have had norovirus so much worse) and has stayed at his friends rather than here when I really could've done with help at nights. He said he didn't want to stay here and wake us more...
I'm still suffering as is youngest DD, I went to drop something off to him at work today and he asked if I'd had a good morning. I said 'not really, DD is poorly and whingey and I've been sick 5 times.' Five mins later he text asking if I was horny...! I just wonder what planet he's on sometimes, I really do.

[tribpot]

Btw I don't think it's a coincidence that the part of family life he chooses to participate in is the public-facing aspect, paid for out of your pocket.

[meddie]

I could spend ages trying to persuade you to see what an arsehole this man is, but I think deep down you know he is a waste of space and are hoping that someone here can give you answers to make him better, We cant sorry.
The fact that you told him you were sick and he texts you. 'are you horny'. speaks absolute volumes for how little consideration he has for you. That just made my skin crawl.

[expatinscotland]

Amy, he's a waste of space.

[Amykins35]

Tribpot - that and the part in front of his family and friends.

[Amykins35]

I've been thinking I must be wrong to be resentful though as his parents seem to think its fine and that he's a hero for working so hard. (Which he doesn't, but either way it makes no difference to us as we don't see the money from it!)

[expatinscotland]

He's a cocklodger, Amy. He is working hard for himself, not you and his child.

[moonabove]

Amykins, you need to give yourself permission to leave this awful idiot. I can feel the life draining out of me just reading about him so god knows what it's like living it.

[meddie]

He's done a right one on you hasn't he. You say you've been together 4 years and have a toddler. yet when you were due to move in he suddenly finds debts that prevent him? How come it took him 2 years to discover these?
You are getting absolutely nothing out of this relationship. He doesnt help with the kids, freeloads food of you. And though it might only be a meal a few nights a week, add up what it costs you extra to have him there. Does he use your soaps. toilet paper, towels and stuff you have to wash because he's there?
It might not cost extra rent to have him there, but your household expenses will be higher, and all he contributes is minimum csa for his baby? So he can pay less for his other children. The CSA probably doesnt even cover what he is costing you, never mind the upkeep of his child.

[delilahlilah]

You're missing the point - you said earlier 'rent is the same' regardless of his presence - this applies to most of the bills aside from 25% discount you currently get for council tax, and food obviously would be more. I don't mean to be harsh but he isn't living with you because he doesn't want to. He wants his single life as well. I don't believe he is rent free at his friend's house, he's feeding you a line. I am at a loss to see why you would want him to move in....

[dopeysheep]

So friends 'assume' you guys are living together, but you say he isn't hiding it. Well he is hiding it by omission. He doesn't want them to know because it paints him as a tool. Correctly.

If you don't want to put yourself first nothing people on here can say will make you, sadly. But imagine if it was your DD in a few years time being treated this way, would you be happy about it?

[RandomMess]

You asked if you are being a mug.

Yes you are.

[Catkinsthecatinthehat]

Amy, it would be useful to consider what you would do in his position.

If you were in deep debt and someone told you that you could clear that money in two years, but you'd have to live apart from your precious baby and not see it grow up, or you could live a proper family life, but pay the debt off off in four or five years, what would you do?

Would you actually give a toss about the mere length of the repayment period as long as you had your child? I don't think so. His 'logic' isn't logical at all. Please please make sure you use the money you fritter on him (on £40k a year!) to pay for childcare while you study, pass that degree, and build a future for yourself.

[cjel]

As I've read more of this Vicky Pollard came to mind 'yeh but no but yeh but no but' You are telling us reasons that make no sense and I think you know that yourself He is on planet DP and knows no other.

[dopeysheep]

And yes, pacing near you with a crying baby when you are supposed to studying is a cunt's trick.

[EggyFucker]

Amy, are you listening at all ?

You say you are new to MN

let me tell you that a unanimous "get rid of the bastard" thread is virtually unheard of

do you think all these women are stupid, and don't get what a misunderstood soul your twat of a boyfriend is ?

if you had a friend in the same situation...what would you advise her?

[Snuppeline]

I can't believe he has suddenly found debts after 2 years with you either. The source of the debts seem odd too. If his wife stopped paying mortgage for a few months surely she is liable for it too and is contributing towards it? And if it was only a few months the debt should be thousands not tens-of-thousands as it can only be if be is needing his full 40k salary to pay it off. He is lying. Either the debt is from mortgage errars AND somewhere else or he is lying. I can't understand either how, if his x-wife can't be trusted to pay mortgage he hasn't enforced sale of the house to settle the mortgage. Something is very very wrong here. Your explanations do sadly sound as defense of him and is a pain to read.

My advise would be for you to work to establish a new routine for your dd so that she settles easier. With that should come longer evenings in which you can study. I did a degree while dd was very young and I had to work out a routine so I had the evening free. Nursing to sleep needs to stop if it prevents you getting a couple of hours work done. Getting work done also means getting rid of distractions. Such as the waste of space you have in your life. Having him over 3 times a week is most likely 3 nights where you don't get work done because you are entertaining him? Get those nights back and use them to better yourself. You won't miss this man and neither will your dd's.

[Snazzynewyear]

"He is more into the relationship than I am - he relies on me for everything (not just money!!) texts all day, constantly declares love etc. "

So in return for the minimal effort of sending texts (which he has the leisure to do!) and saying the right words, he gets 'everything' done for him. This needs to stop now. Whatever you do for him - you mentioned 'dropping something off at work', for example - don't. Tell him you are too busy looking after the kids and studying. No more cooking or whatever else. No more money - in fact tell him you need him to contribute to your household expenses if he is going to stay several nights a week. I predict you will soon see very clearly that he is in this for purely selfish reasons and as soon as you are less accommodating, he will have 'doubts'.

[McPheetStink]

he relies on me for everything (not just money!!) texts all day, constantly declares love etc.

My cocklodger used to do exactly the same. Manboys at their best!