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to feel ashamed and disgusted? Should I be showing compassion?(Long - sorry)

526 replies

BabylonPI · 13/09/2012 22:24

OK,

my DSis and I haven't seen eye to eye for quite some time - the last time I visited her house was in September 2009 when dd2 was a month old. Since then, I've given birth to DS1 - she didn't know I was pregnant with him as I asked people not to tell her. I didn't want her to know. The last time I had any contact with her was in August 2011 when she ruined my DD2s birthday party by starting a massive row with my inlaws Sad

DSis has 4 DCs, and I love them dearly. I have maintained contact with them even though I haven't had any contact with her.

At the beginning of the summer hols, DSis was admitted to hospital with some unknown illness. My parents begged me to make contact with her, and I did - for them, not for me or for her, but for my parents.

She was discharged from hospital (without a diagnosis) and we met for the first time in 12 months at my parents house. She met my DS for the first time and it was fine.

On Monday this week I took a trip up to her house as it was her DC3s birthday on Tuesday and I wanted to make sure the card and gift was on time. DSis was not expecting me and immediately upon entering her home I felt very uncomfortable - nothing I could put my finger on but very uncomfy.

Her DCs 3&4 told me upon my arrival that I shouldn't use the downstairs loo as mummy has been sick in there and it smells. DC4 also said that Daddy was still at work and he wasn't coming back.

Alarm bells started to ring, and I just felt that she wasn't herself. I thought she had been drinking, but talked myself out of that as I know how ill she has been. DCs asked if me and my DCs could stay for tea - DSis said we must and she would go and fetch takeaway. At this, I said we simply couldn't and had to get home.

I left after approx 45 mins.

On the way home, I called my parents and started off a whole chain of events which I'm devastated by.

I told parents that if I didn't know better I would say she was drunk - parents didn't believe me, so took a trip up to her house unannounced. The shit really hit the fan.
DSis denied drinking, but her whole attitude and demeanour gave her away. She attacked her DH, our parents and all in front of her 4 DCS who were screaming at their GPs to leave as they were making everything worse Sad

It gets worse.

On wednesday, I got a call from DM to say I needed to pick her up ASAP and get to DSis' house.
On arriving there, we find, DSis sat in a heap on the floor covered in her own vomit. The living room floor covered in vomit with the youngest DCs playing in it and the family dog eating it

She was so out of it - sat there in just a bra, completely oblivious to her surroundings. This was at 5pm.
She had collected her children from school in the car in this state (but dressed) just over an hour before. Eldest DC had called her Dad to say they desperately so needed help as mummy was so ill. Daddy called GP and so on and so forth....

Dsis is fighting drunk. DCs are witnessing everything (and it was obvious by their reactions that they've witnessed it before).

Because of her recent stay in hospital, her DH and my DM thought it best to take her back to hospital - she is denying all the time that she has had a drink.

At 10pm last night, she was still twice over the legal drink drive limit - she wasn't fit to be seen by the MH crisis scene until after 2am.

She was vile to the hospital staff, DH, DM - everyone really.

It then all came out. She has been drinking in secret for YEARS. She has conditioned her DCs to say NOTHING by thereatening them with Social Services and telling them they would be taken away.
She has had numerous bumps in her car, and has been breathalysed on one occassion that we are aware of (obviously clear on this occasion). Her DCs finally admitted that mummy often mounts the kerb when driving and they have been covering up for her.

She also has major issues with dependency on painkillers. Again, she has denied this vehemently.

She was sent home from hospital soon after 5am today. She has a crisis team in place who will visit her daily at home. She is on a detox as she is severely alcohol dependent.

She missed her DC4s first day at school and her DC1s first day at Secondary school due to her drinking.

When she arrived home, her first concern was that she didn't want to see her MIL, and after that I received a call to ask if I had seen her iPad as she couldn't remember what she had done with it.

I dropped EVRYTHING last night to go to her and her DCs, and her major concern is updating her facebook status :(

I am disgusted, angry and ashamed of her. Right now I don't want to know her. I am livid that she has risked her children's lives and the lives of others by driving drunk on a daily basis for god knows how long.

I will do anything to make sure the DCs are safe, but I'm not sure I can see her without without giving her a good hard slap Angry

Is this wrong? Should I be supporting her unconditionally?
AIBU for being this disgusted with her?
Where do I go from here?

She has some deep rooted issues which she had told everyone she was addressing and was getting counselling for - this was also a lie.

I'm gutted Sad

Sorry, I did say it was long.

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RuleBritannia · 14/09/2012 09:46

This is just an idea but could your sister's credit cards, debit cards and cash be removed from her so that she can't go out and buy alcoholic drink. Someone else (her DH perhaps on Saturdays) could do the shopping and be refunded by the husband.

I don't mind if anyone doesn't agree with me but a lot of money would be saved by the sound of things.

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BabylonPI · 14/09/2012 09:51

Thank you all for sharing your experiences with me, it is so comforting to get any kind of an insight into the why's and wherefores of what is happening.

A lot of people at the moment are saying that they knew it, they had a gut feeling, and worst of all, I told you so.

I am just replying right now with: thanks for your input, it's really not very helpful right now.

Later today, we are holding a "meeting". There will be me and my DH, our parents, DBro, her MIL, her DH and our Aunty.

Dsis will be present but it has already been made clear that decisions will be made with her best interest, whether or not she agrees with them. I have said it may be easier for her and for us if she isn't there, but she wants to know what is being said about her.

It is unclear yet whether a social worker will be there, however it is likely that there is going to be a CP conference very soon where all 4 DCs will likely become subject to a protection plan (not the at risk register anymore).

If we can have a plan in place before this, and SS are happy with it, then hopefully that will make it easier all round.

Our primary focus is the children. They will remain our focus and in good time we will arrange for the children to receive counselling. Especially the eldest. She is just 11, and it seems she has been parenting the younger 3 when dads been at work, maybe for as long as the last 2 years - could be even longer Sad

Please keep holding my hand. I'm feeling wobbly myself this morning. DBro called me in tears - he has also had no contact with Dsis for a long time. He too is gutted. He wants to help and the one thing we all do agree unanimously is that we will offer unwavering support to the DCs for as long as we need to.

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donnie · 14/09/2012 09:52

I don't think YABU. It is a dreadful situation with no quick fixes, sadly. You are rightly there for her children and they will need you a great deal but your dsis is going to have to have major intervention if her addiction is to be addressed in any meaningful, effective way. I agree with llkjj - you can't help her but you can make a big difference in teh dc's lives. Good luck.

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BabylonPI · 14/09/2012 09:56

Hi bossy, I did get some sleep - not loads, but enough.

Short term I could take all 4 DCs - I've already secured provisional school places for the 3 primary age DCs.

Her DH has had an awful lot of time off work already, and although he is a partner, and effectively his own boss, we are all too aware that partnerships can be dissolved. Sad. That would be catastrophic.

WRT shopping, her DH has already sorted for it to be done online. He has taken her cash and cards from her, and her car keys. She is not in walking distance of a shop - but we're not daft - if she wants a drink she will try anything.

That is something we will work hard to manage as best as we can.

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RuleBritannia · 14/09/2012 09:56

I'm glad that things are going forward for you all. I do hope that there is a satisfactory outcome for the children. It's good that there are so many in the family who are concerned with their welfare and I'm sure they feel comfortable with you because they know who you are and why you will be at the meeting.

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TheEnthusiasticTroll · 14/09/2012 10:02

good luck with the meeting later. asking her GP for a residential rehab may be usefull.

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MrDobalina · 14/09/2012 10:10

Her DH has had an awful lot of time off work already, and although he is a partner, and effectively his own boss, we are all too aware that partnerships can be dissolved. . That would be catastrophic

its already catastrophic

WRT shopping, her DH has already sorted for it to be done online. He has taken her cash and cards from her, and her car keys. She is not in walking distance of a shop - but we're not daft - if she wants a drink she will try anything

do not baby her or try to manage her behaviour to this extent. She is an adult. She is not recovering whilst you are with holding access to money etc. she has to manage her own behaviour or you are no further forward.

You need to find out about 'enabling' being 'co-dependant' and most importantly 'detaching'

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Solo · 14/09/2012 10:33

Hi Babylon I have been reading your thread and been quite upset for all of your family.
I have limited experience of alcoholism, but I just wanted to say that taking away your sisters cards will not necessarily stop her from buying. My exh2 willingly gave me all his cards, cheque book etc and they were locked away by me. He just phoned the banks/cc companies etc and ordered replacements and continued spending on them. His addiction was shopping and yes, it ruined us as a couple.

I do hope that things improve all round soon.

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CrunchyFrog · 14/09/2012 10:40

I can only sympathise, and echo what MrDobalina said - you can't control her, if she's going to choose to drink, then she has to accept that there are consequences. If she's going to choose to recover, then she has to be allowed to do that.

My DSis is an alcoholic and drug user. There is nothing we can do, pure nothing. DM enables constantly. The MH team will not tackle her "illness" until she's off the drink, but offered her day hospital, which she would not go to.

So she's on a mass of anti-ds and anti-ps, unsupervised by any medic, scrounging from friends and family, living in a shit pit and living such a risky life. Thankfully no kids yet. It's very hard to deal with.

You are doing a good thing, being there for the kids. I wish you strength!

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saffronwblue · 14/09/2012 10:47

Handholding Babylon. You are a wonderful aunt . This will help the DCs; when they look back on the madness they will also remember the people who were consistent and loving.
What a mess- poor everyone.

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BabylonPI · 14/09/2012 10:49

We don't want to baby her, but short term we think it is important to aid the detox and cut off her alcohol supply. She is being given a daily dose of Librium I think to help with detoxing.

I don't know what the effects will be if she drinks while taking Librium.

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mymar · 14/09/2012 10:50

I can 100% sympathise with your situation. I have been there with my Dsis and her 4 DCs. I have felt all the emotions and ups and downs of dealing with a drunk and the emotional and physical side of the effect on her DC's. Unfortunately my Dsis was also deaf and incapable of dealing with everyday things thrown at her. The first time my Dsis was admitted to hospital with severe stomach pains and being unable to eat, i refused to go and see her because her DD(aged 14 when assaulted) was due in court to give evidence on that day against a man who had sexually assaulted her in her mums house and her DD was angry with her mum for being ill due to drinking, my Dsis was supposed to go to court with her and give evidence. Unfortunately my Dsis died 3 days later unexpectedly. My Dn and myself never got the chance to see her again. I have been riddled with guilt that I ignored my Dsis in the last few months of her life and will have to live with that forever. My Dsis had only been seriously drinking for 18 months. She was also a single mum.

Please help your Dsis and her children, I am now still dealing with the heartache and upset that my Dn's are now still going through 2 yrs later. My Dsis was 48 and her DD's were 14, 16, 19, 22 when she died.
There was only me and my Dsis (no parents or grandparents)

A couple of practical things that you may be able to help with that I used.

I arranged to take my Dsis and children out for the day to get her to interact with her DCs and to show her DC's that their mum was there for them. You could arrange to take your Dsis out for the day and get her DH to spend time with her DCs. Spend time with her and explain how her drinking is affecting everyone without sounding like a lecture. Say how much you love her but that she needs to know what damage she is doing to her DC's.

I had my Dsis and DC's stay at my house where Alcohol was not allowed (even though she would arrive absolutely drunk!) I would ask her if she had brought drink and then check her bags in case she had hidden any. This was all done with the idea that we would have fun together like we used to and then the kids could play with my DC and be able to relax. It is one of the memories that keeps me together somedays.

I never got to say goodbye or to tell my Dsis how much I love her, please help her.

Your sister is worth fighting for as are her DCs.

If you want to PM me feel free.

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bringbacksideburns · 14/09/2012 11:08

Of course YANBU.

All your feelings are completely understandable. She could have killed her kids driving. Priority here is the children.

Her husband and all the rest of the family need to now work out the best way to help the children who have already been through far too much. I think they've seen enough and do not need to live with her unless she has been sober for months, at the very least.

When you have the meeting you are allowed to be angry with her. You are allowed to tell her she was more or less naked, covered in her own vomit, in front of her children. She needs to be shocked. No more pussy footing around.

I am still trying to get over my anger towards a family member of my Dh's, who we ended up having to visit in the Intensive Care unit, at the same time as my FIL was dying, in the same hospital. Luckily the children she put through shit, despite her own very happy upbringing, have come out the other side and are wonderful and she seems to have turned the corner and has been sober for a few years now.

I wish you lots of strength through this. It is horrible, i know.

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DunkyWhorey · 14/09/2012 11:13

The 7 day detox she's doing is probably a course of Librium. It allows you to go cold turkey without side effects - its a bit like Valium - GP will prescribe it if someone wants to give up but is drinking over a certain amount a week in terms of units which is described as "dependent" levels.

If you are further on in the addiction process and can't do a 7 day home detox then you need a residential one, that's the bottle or two of Vodka a day for the past 10 years type people...Librium wouldn't cut it for them.

They are probably (crisis team) delivering them daily so she doesn't misuse them, because she obviously has a history of misusing over the counter stuff etc.

Its hard being a mum, as you know. Some cope better than others. Part of her recovery really is her wanting to stop drinking at dangerious levels or dependant levels - for some, abstinence is the only way, others can learn to drink "sensibly" again.

I go through stages of alcohol dependency, not in a physical sense, but psychologically - me and my husband both go through these stages where we know we are drinking too much and we cut back, have a month off, "dry July" etc, sometimes we have a month where we only drink "out the house" so we'll have one at the pub or a barbecue if out but not buy any for home, that kind of thing. Its our way of not sinking into the full on addictive type of drinking. I still drink too much occasoinally; its usually my vanity and exercise/weight loss efforts that stop me doing it too much. Its tricky if alcohol (well for me its Wine, I can happily leave anything else) is your vice; it can be so damaging, if you consider a woman isn't supposed to drink more than 2-3 units a day max - well that's a 250ml glass of Shiraz. HOW FRUSTRATING!!! Grin - so its inevitible that people will drink over the recommended amounts but its scary to think it doubles your risk of breast cancer, for instance. And it's expensive.

Try not to judge her too much, but it has to come from her to an extent - she probably needs to deal with her MH issues which are possibly what turned her to "self medicate" in the first place. Get yourself to Al Anon and take it from there. She might not want to do AA - Alcoholics Anonymous - it doesn't suit everyone. The NHS are good, they have good guidance for people who are worried they are drinking too much and their info isn't "you have to stop forever" which I think for some people puts them off. I know AA don't tell people to stop forever but there is a bit of that about it, even if it isn't their official line...

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Arithmeticulous · 14/09/2012 11:31

If she's on Librium then she will still look/act drunk - the feelings/actions appear to be the same (IME, my relative slurs speech, staggers around and acts inappropriately on Librium, she might as well be drunk)

Has anyone suggested Antabuse so she can't drink?

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SpicyPear · 14/09/2012 11:36

I'm so sorry Babylon to read what you are going through. I have seen on other threads how supportive you have been of others and the practical things you have managed to put in place for your DSis and her DCs in such a short space of time is incredible.

My maternal DGM was an alcoholic and so I have experienced my DM's struggles as the child of an alcoholic. You are absolutely right to focus on supporting the DCs and trying to give them structure and, eventually, the psychological tools to deal with you DSis's illness.

As a person with a healthy relationship with alcohol, it is almost impossible to understand why your DSis has not had her wake up call and why she won't get better for her kids. We, relatives of alcoholics, just have to learn to accept that the disease does not work like that. Whilst in the grip of it she will continue to lie and lie and lie and behave in a way that you find despicable, because she is utterly controlled by her addiction.

It is so important for you and your family that you do not mentally take responsibility for 'fixing' her. By all means take responsibility for protecting her children and be there practically when she wants help, but it's vital for your wellbeing that you accept as soon as possible that there is nothing you can do to make her get better if she does not want to. Even if you cut off her supply, she will not be recovering in any true sense, just a dry drunk. Forgive me if I've misunderstood your posts, but it seems she is still in denial and therefore has a tremendous way to go before recovery. I only say this because I think it would have helped my DM if she'd understood this early on. For your family this week is a major crisis point, but if your DSis is deep enough in her illness it will not necessarily be so for her.

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PerryCombover · 14/09/2012 12:32

Also I know that this might be obvious but....

Try to be inclusive and very gentle in decision making processes
It will take time for your sister to come to terms with having alcohol rated issues. It might take much longer before she is able to allow her mind to process the damage she has done. Then to face that in sobriety.

Intervention type meetings of the type you are suggesting with your family can sometimes be very harmful to recovery.
Please speak to a substance misuse counsellor to get advice before holding the meeting.

By all means make sensible decisions to help look after the children but be very careful of having a gathering that could be heated/angry/accusatory at a time when your sister is in the early stages of drying out.

This will be so difficult for you all but try to be gentle and neutral until she is strong enough to go into a programme. Once that happens she will face up to all that she has done and again she will need neutrality and support. Facts when required but not anger blame punishment fury bewilderment.

You can tell her it made you angry sad whatever when required
I'm sorry it will be very very hard for you all but worth it.

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ImNotCrazyMyMotherHadMeTested · 14/09/2012 14:18

Hi Babylon, I haven't got any practical advice to offer but just wanted to offer support and a story of hope - I've an uncle who drank (including drink driving) for years, broke up his family, BUT once he hit his own rock bottom he took charge of his own recovery, is remarried, friends with his ex and has good relationships with his (now adult) children, and has been sober for over a decade.

I hope this happens for your sister but in the meantime her DH and DC's are incredibly lucky to have you and your family, and I hope you are able to look after each other as well as her.

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BabylonPI · 14/09/2012 15:01

Thank you a million times and more for your posts and PMs - there are lots of them, and I feel very humbled by some of the things which have been shared.

I've had a bit if a meltdown this afternoon and I've cried and cried for the sister I used to have. I know she can be her again, but probably not in the near future Sad

It all seems very futile right now.

My DH will be home very soon and tonight I am taking some time out for my family. DH has been away all week, and I just want to catch up with him and spend some time hugging my DCs close.

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mistlethrush · 14/09/2012 15:04

When's the meeting Babylon? And have you got someone who can look after your DCs whilst you go?

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BabylonPI · 14/09/2012 15:09

Forgot to add, Dsis is still in total denial.

Her biggest concern remains the whereabouts of her iPad and updating Facebook Sad

Because of this, her crisis intervention team have asked us to wait until Monday at the earliest before attempting any kind of planning meeting.

Her DH will ensure the welfare of the DCs over the weekend, and we shall take it from there.

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BabylonPI · 14/09/2012 15:10

I have a fantastic support network for me and my DCs - there are 2 of their god mothers within 5 mins walk/drive who will squabble over my DCs!! I'm very lucky in that respect.

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Dawndonna · 14/09/2012 15:11

As I said before, I think the ipad/facebook thing is a place for her to hide.
Being in denial is also about hiding, it is very scary to face up to and deal with an addiction, and in many cases the addiction is so very strong and the person isn't.
For now though, make sure you look after yourself and get some rest.
Good luck.

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Hullygully · 14/09/2012 15:12

Babylon, I feel for you.

My dad was an alcoholic and I am the oldest of four, I was around 11 when it got really bad. I would have given ANYTHING for responsible adults to step in, acknowledge what was happening, and bloody well help us.

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Hullygully · 14/09/2012 15:14

Oh, and I'm afraid I don't give a fuck about your sister. If someone wants to kill themselves, let them, just don't let them take everyoen else down the toilet with them...

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