Turn beautiful second reception room into mediocre kitchen / diner?

[OrangeCrushes]

We have a great house, but the current kitchen and dining space is really lacking. We are considering converting our beautiful but little-used second reception into a kitchen / diner and making the current kitchen into a kitchen mess overflow/utility (we already have a laundry room).

The issue is that the space is very narrow and we don't want to go through the expense or hassle of an extension or much structural work. The best we could do would probably be a large room with units on two walls and the dining table in the opposite corner.

Really welcome any opinions or advice!!

Diagrams / examples forthcoming!

@LibertyLily

Which reminds me - why would it be a mediocre kitchen/diner?

If you look at my neighbour's kitchen photos you can see why - only two walls of units (which in our case would be disrupted by the door to the loo), and a quite narrow space for a dining table. It wouldn't have much wow factor - but still may be a nicer, large space to cook and socialise.

Ah yes, I'd missed the pics of your neighbour's kitchen.

I see what you mean with regards to the door into the loo, but I'm sure there's a workaround for that. You could still have a lovely looking kitchen - it's all about the style of cabinetry/colour and finishing touches imo.

At our previous house we moved the kitchen from a dark, middle room (which became our dining room as it mattered less to us that the dining room - mainly used at night in our case - was a bit dark) into what had been the tiny dining room and the old living room. We knocked down the wall between and removed a chimney breast as there was already one at the dining end.

This gave us a kitchen that was approx 7.3m/24' long x 5.18m/17' wide narrowing to 3.65m/12'. Our units ran along the long wall with fridge freezer in the recess adjacent to the chimney breast (in which we had a wood burner installed as we were in a rural area with oil heating). At the 5.18m end, opposite the main run of units we had a huge vintage larder and a small run of units where we prepped our DDogs food. The 3.65m end was fairly narrow, but we still managed to fit in an island. Initially we had a table/chairs in front of the wood burner, but eventually we replaced these with a sofa as we had our dining room for formal dining. Everyday meals were eaten at the island.

I'll try to find a pic.

As an aside your kitchen doesn't have a window
All kitchens, as habitable rooms, must have a window

This isn't true. Kitchens are only required to have adequate ventilation, which can be dealt with by an extractor fan.

@LibertyLily would love to see a pic!

Ours is only 11ft4in and my extensive measuring suggests an island is impossible 😐

Im an Architect I assure you It’s a habitable room therefore must have a window

Here you go @OrangeCrushes ....

Please do direct me to this legislation, as it's not something I can find at all.

That's gorgeous!

Three parts ( at least ) of the building regs.
Not all building regs are online and we have to pay for the full docs.

Building control may be happy to advice

if the current side WC and utility are not well built add ons I’d prefer to knock it all out and go for the full width kitchen/diner (I’d go into that conservatory space also and make it proper.

but a compromise could be a u/shaped kitchen but still open plan with dining. Swap util and WC. Existing dining room turns snug/living.

I'm pretty sure if it were illegal to have a windowless kitchen it would be fairly easy to find something about it online? In fact I can only find the opposite 🤷‍♀️

@CellophaneFlower
Apreciate your dilemma
but
I can’t account for your googling I’m afraid. I don’t Google for professional information that could get me sued in my role

Suffice to say it’s like asking me to prove a brick is a brick
For Architects it’s one of the simplest things to understand the requirements of what makes a room a room.

This one is a v good idea

Hello @MissterMummy
we must stop meeting like this 🤣🤣

nice plan again !

haha yeah @DrPrunesqualer I can’t resist scratching a floor plan itch 🤣 OP getting valuable design advice here!

@MissterMummy

That's an interesting idea. I'm not sure how complicated (and expensive) this could make things, but at the moment there are some (formerly exterior) windows in the space we are discussing. The area that you suggested making into the loo is also where an exterior door is located, which is of course a bit strange to double as a bathroom.

Still, it may be worth considering this 🤔

@OrangeCrushes
i tried to update my earlier post but couldn’t change the pic. Just to add I’d have access to the snug from the hall also, see updated sketch

Ah cross post before I saw your update.

blocking up windows is pretty easy, and changing the existing window to a door might require a new lintel depending on the size of the existing window. But yes it all depends on what your budget is etc etc.

i think you’ve got a lovely room there, I reckon you can definitely find a way to make a decent sized kitchen/diner work in it

If it’s a beautiful reception room that you love, could you not make it your main lounge, and turn your current lounge into a dining room instead? Or do you like that room too?

How much do you value the utility room?

The problem with using the backroom as a kitchen is the bathroom straight off it. But there doesn't seem to be a way to avoid this and adding corridors gives you the narrow issue again.

I'm assuming the wall between kitchen and diner is the back wall of the house. What about between kitchen and utility? Could that go to full width?

I'd then perhaps swap kitchen and dining because you could have a good u shape in the dining space and if it's darker then kitchens are easier to light. Have bigger dining area across the kitchen utility with the side door to let more light in.

You then need utility space. I'd steal the bit of your back reception room between the doors (purple). It might not be full utility room, More a fancy built in cupboard than a room.

OP
You might have room for a tiny lobby into the WC on @MissterMummy s plan. The doors would have to open in different directions but it might be worth considering re smells privacy etc

The Standard design of these buildings would have either a window or French doors to the rear at the WC location. So I’d just find the lintel or soldier course and use that to set your door under between WC and living. It’ll save a lot of structural work and money. It will be in the middle.

No dilemma for me... I just find it odd I cannot find ANY information ar all about windowless kitchens not being allowed and countless sources saying they are, with adequate ventilation. Very strange!

Yes I would 100% do it.

What about one line of units and a nice island, then a larger dining table in the conservatory (you could do it in 2 stages if you wanted)? A bit like the pic below- obviously you could have units in a different style.

(If you’re interested the full listing is https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/details/5a35604d-3291-4b7d-815a-38bac93907bb?id=media0)

I have thought of this! But the conservatory is super small and poorly insulated, so probably not feasible for winter meals without significant work or a rebuild

I think this is a great suggestion - with snug accessed from the hall as per second pic!