Vague survey - what would count as a rating 3?

[Nomorediy]

Sequel to my last post on my buyers' survey.

I would like to know what issues you have had with houses - buying or selling - that come under category 3 (urgent, requires immediate attention) in a survey.

To recap: my first time buyers have had a survey done that is vague and unusual. It gives a long list of things that seem to fall into category 2 - require attention but are not serious or urgent.

They seem to have taken fright at the fact that this is not a fully renovated property or a new build, but a 200 year old grade 2 listed cottage that requires constant upkeep. They have sent a list of survey findings that apparently I must do something about.

I did all the jobs I could do without planning permission already. Outstanding things are to retile part of the roof - it isn't leaking or damaged - and to rewire in one area that is safe but not compliant with 2022 building regs.

I gave the buyers a 15k discount so they could pay for the above on their own and take the time to obtain listed building consents. My house was listed at 600k. A fully renovated house of this size in the same area would be listed at 650k.

Are any of the below things from their survey category 3? Separately, are any my issue?

Roof slopes should be upgraded
Loft should be better ventilated
In future, some timbers may need to be replaced
Repoint chimney
Improve some rainwater fittings
Repoint front elevation 'in due course'
Replace some internal doors
Obtain quotation to have basement tanked (although this was done two years ago with full guarantee and indemnity)
Upgrade electrical system
Fit more smoke alarms
Replace older radiators
Additional drainage to rear patio area.

Please help me with how best to communicate to buyers that this is general stuff that comes with buying a house. The agent and I are tearing our hair out.

Thank you!

I am sorely tempted to say give them a week to put up or shut up. But I suppose I am paying the agent to negotiate for me. I’m not sure how long my sellers will hang on for. The place I’m buying is 300 metres from an outstanding secondary school and chain free. I have a 9 year old. The future utility of this house is bigger than giving these mercenaries a discount. I think perhaps first time buyers realize they can ruin people’s lives.

Honestly all of it is your problem if your buyers won't buy without it being done. It doesn't matter what convention is at this stage.
Your question is basically how can you convince someone to buy something they are not keen to do, and I think ultimately your agent is the one with the expertise there.
I would prepare yourself to have to put it back on the market..

The survey says it’s tired inside, and needs renovation outside. Your FTB are probably thinking that is too much work and / or too expensive for the hassle they will face getting the work done.
You joked about taking 6 months to get permission to repoint the chimney. If your FTB know this, they won’t be laughing.

Get your agent on it. Can you dangle a further discount? If you can’t then it’s back on the market, but looking at the big picture, a discount would be better than back on the market, facing the same survey issues if you get another buyer, losing that next house etc etc.

Update: the buyers have now isolated their concern about their survey to wanting a contractor to state whether or not the flat roof on the kitchen extension needs replacing.

It does not need replacing. Their surveyor recommended a different type of roof for better drainage, in his opinion, to be installed sometime in the future.

I am happy to offer a discount but not for this as it’s rather questionable.

This flat roof is felt covered and showing no signs of wear and tear, according to the survey.

My roofer said replacing the roof is not a good idea as the work may cause structural shifts to the original building. He strongly advised continuing to preserve the original covering then replacing it like for like when necessary.

I have the roofs checked regularly - every time my roofer clears the gutters. Sometimes he replaces a loose or cracked tile. One fascia is a bit worn.

These buyers aren’t being mercenaries I think. But they seem to be overly fixated on the roof and what any future costs related to the roof might be.

The agent has made every rational response possible.

What could reassure them? I’ve asked my roofer to visit and produce a schedule of costs for any upcoming work that may need doing. He says it’s unlikely to be very long or amount to much.

Improvements to the inside and outside of the house would raise the value of the house. It was sold as requiring redecoration in some areas, e.g, it needs new internal doors. We have also given a £15k discount already.

I agree relisting would be annoying but I think I’d prefer to pay for upgrades myself and then market the home as having had improvements carried out since it first went on the market.

In the worst case, these buyers could get me to pay for them to do these improvements then flip the house.

So I’m veering between offering to price up a schedule of minor roof upgrades that could be required in the next couple of years and offer that as a discount, or take it off the market, do every minor job possible, redecorate in the most stagey way and relist it for 50k more.

@Nomorediy “or take it off the market, do every minor job possible, redecorate in the most stagey way and relist it for 50k more.”

What age/condition are the bathroom and kitchen?
A lick of paint can be done in a week, but it’s not going to add £50k to the value, otherwise you’d have done it already. How many offers did you have? That will give you an indication of how desirable your house is, minor repairs executed or not.
I’d go with plan ‘A’, get a quick estimate off your roofer to repoint the chimney, repair the guttering/downpipes, add ventilation, paint the facials. No need to mention dependents on planning permission. Also get him to mention the felt on the flat roof does not need replacing.
Sounds like less than £10k of work, but offer £10k discount to close the deal.

I will get a quote for whatever actually needs doing to the roof and the contractor to confirm the survey finding that no part of either roof is damaged.

It’s probably 2k max of work needed for the roof. The price has been discounted by £15k already.

There is some internal decor one could do, eg replacing tatty internal doors and skirting, but house was sold as seen.

No structural issues identified in the buyers’ survey which said it was appropriate for purchase at this price.

I hope that once I confirm the flat roof is a non issue we can move ahead.

I am concerned that if I offer a discount for this one non-issue that opens me up to being asked for more and where does this end.

The house I hope to buy also has a host of level 2 survey issues like a non functioning bathroom with no extraction, aged fences, some broken downpipes, a rotting fascia and some cracked external render. I’ve not quibbled these survey findings because they were visible when I offered and I got a discount. As with my house there were no hidden structural problems uncovered in the survey.

Thank you, belatedly.

I think this is a case of inexperienced buyers.

I went back to my buyers and said they’re welcome to have a drone roof inspection, it would need to be paid for so it’s not inflated quotes and whatever the result of it the price of the house is staying the same.

I have given them two weeks to either agree to this or go away. Them: we’re happy to proceed as soon as we know what the cost of all the repairs will be. Me: you have two weeks. If my purchase collapses because my sellers can’t wait - they are over-extended BTL owners selling a job lot of houses asap - this is academic.

Their survey was the absolute boilerplate ‘the house is structurally sound but because it’s very old you will ideally check these eleventy billion things before exchange.’

Yes but here in the real world.

I have the roof checked annually when I clear the gutters. This is how you own a historic property responsibly. I want to sell it, if I do, to buyers who understand how you must continually invest in homes like this and unless they are structurally unsound you’ll not lose money from doing so.

And how are the negotiations going?

Thanks for asking.

How long’s a piece of string right? 😆

They asked for a full roof inspection addressing all 50,000 minor suggestions and CYA phrases in theit vague survey.

I’ve booked my own roofer/builder to do whatever version of checks on the house he sees as appropriate.

I’ve said look if anything broke after the offer (in Dec after they first viewed in August!) or really wouldn’t have been visible at the time of the offer, that’s maintenance I should’ve done on my home and will do now and will pay for now. I have a little pot of money for such things that come up after the winter. It was sold as seen so if since then we’ve lost a tile or a soffit has rotted in the Feb floods, I’ll handle it. Probably for less than £1k.

They said this wasn’t enough and also want to ‘assess the cost’ of subjective future upgrades like replacing a non damaged flat roof and improving loft ventilation before ‘they can proceed.’ They are I think harping on about these because these jobs, which are preferences only, would be expensive.

They need as you’ve I think said @HellsBalls some kind of deal - financially or psychologically - to get this over the finish line.

What do you advise here?

My solicitor warned not to give anything at all without the express condition it is the full and final, cos it may will lead to being asked for more checks and concessions until I can’t afford my own move. I made my purchase offer on the basis of my sale offer.

I sensibly waited a few weeks til after their survey. They didn’t mention it at all for two months. Their mortgage surveyor unusually came in the house and was here for 90 minutes. Not a peep out of their lender either.

Sorry such a long reply. This is really helping me to process it all.

Stop pandering to them so much, they’re never going to be satisfied. Why have you got a builder to do an inspection? If they want further inspections then they should organise and pay for it.

In your shoes I’d be picking up the phone to the estate agent right now and telling them to put it back on the market.

I think I agree with @Doris86 . If they really wanted it you’d have come to an agreement by now.

I agree with you all about not negotiating.

We have had the roof inspected by two companies - the buyers paid for this - and there's just nothing wrong with it. It is not damp, damaged, sagging or causing rot. It is probably advisable to renew some mortar pointing in coming years. That is amazing for such an old house.

The buyers apparently want to think this over. I have given them a week and then will re-list. The agent is on board and says the extremely reassuring roof surveys the buyers have paid for will add value. This agent has a monopoly on listed cottages in this conservation area, and says if these buyers do not buy this house now, they will not deal with them again.

Before I wallow in hubris, though, is there anything I've missed?

TKVM to all for the wonderful advice.