Stairs with no bannisters or rails? Is this even allowed?

[Olinguita]

Frustrated house hunter in London suburbia here. I've seen a couple of properties on the market in the past few weeks that have staircases with no bannisters or rails. As in, full staircases of 10+ stairs? Is this a thing?
The houses are 1930s and I'm guessing 1970s built. I thought this was against building regulations? How do people live like this?! It's so dangerous!
I mean, if one of these was our dream home I have some budget for light renovations and can pay to re-do a staircase but I'm honestly flabbergasted!

I’m sure it would be picked up in the surveyors report

If you moved into a property and removed the rails no one is going to check this from the H&S dept at the council

More like if you applied for planning permission etc then the council comes and signs the work of etc

It is against building regs and if you're interested in the property I would make that a condition of any offer made.

Either agree a cost to be deducted off the offer made or make it a condition of sale for the vendor to install the necessary rails.

Building regs stipulate the size of spacing between spindles. Safety is obviously paramount.

I've had 2 houses like this. Both built 1930s.

Wasn't a problem at all until had children, when we had spindles and bannisters installled.

Someone to whom I sold a period Cotswold house said they were going to take the banisters and rails out. It was a solid elm staircase, it had been installed by the people before us to replace a ratty old deal staircase.

fourteen foot drop from the top onto a flagstone floor…..

Do building regulations apply to things that were done before the regulations were in force?

Obviously you'd want your house to be safe, especially with children, but I would have thought many older properties wouldn't meet current regulations unless an owner had made the changes.

I've seen Grand Designs type programmes where they've been made to instal bannisters (usually solid glass to preserve the minimalist look) but those are changes/new builds that have to conform.

Do you mean with walls either side (so bannister easily installed) or with a drop? The latter is...wow.

@Flubadubba with a drop! 😬

We also viewed a property that had these bizarre floating stairs (albeit with a rail and spindles) that must have been added sometime in the past 20 years or so that wobbled when we walked on them at the viewing. Rest of the house was in very good condition. It was bizarre, I mean surely having stairs that are actually safe is a big consideration for anyone...

Interesting question. I mean you can Google the building regs obvs but what does it mean in terms of selling the house? When a loft room doesn't meet building regs it can't be described as a bedroom. When a staircase doesn't meet building regs no one's going to describe the house as having no staircase...

I guess the question for you is what do you do about it? I would probably adjust my offer and budget to sort it myself, so I can choose the look and I know it's safe.

Friends of ours have 60s stairs with no handrail or bannister, but the stairs turn 180 degrees on themselves so it's actually not a ridiculous drop. They just lived with them even with babies. They always thought our single, enclosed but steepish flight was more dangerous.

I can't find it now - of course! - but there was a Rightmove link on here a couple of weeks ago, and not only did the house not have bannisters up the stairs, but it also didn't have handrails on either side of the gallleried landing. Sheer madness!

I am sure the various death stairs groups on Facebook would love to see these.

Building regs have been around since the 60's so it's likely that the work was done contrary to BRegs however lots of people do work within their houses that they don't realise requires consent/sign off.
It's very unlikely that an original stair was built without a banister of any kind - although some original ones would no longer meet current regs however It's been a fashionable thing to remove banisters to look 'nice'
Once any structural work is done to the stairs it would mean that they would need to comply with the new regs however lots of people just wing it. Its technically a breech but would only be flagged by building regs if they came to inspect other work like a new roof or extension.
I would ask for the cost of banisters (fitting and materials) to be accommodated in any offer as a sale is a good point to highlight breeches.

Different people have different views on what is safe ……..

If the building inspector is coming to look at a new roof/ extension then thats what he will be looking at. Even if he did spot no banister/ handrail he would heve no power to enforce a new one being fitted. Building regs only apply to new work being done.

buyers of the house might not be keen on no handrails but thats a different story.

Check building regs Document K for details.

I think any alterations that have been done or will be done should comply.

We renovated our 60s town house and replaced the stairs (relaxed them). We have a hand rail from ground to 1st floor but nothing between 1st and 2nd.

Everything passed whatever was needed by the council.

I rented a house when the dc were small (about 15 years ago).
Typical Victorian terrace, stairs up the middle between the 2 reception rooms. The owner (or a previous one) had removed the walls making it vaguely open plan, but only installed a bannister on one side so we couldn't put a stair gate or anything up.

Then 2 year old ds used to love climbing over the edge and dropping from the top

@Diyextension yes true they can't force you to change it if it's just there but if the works in anyway join the breech then they can make you rectify it as part of the new works
So re stairs if it forms part of the escape route etc
However this will often be the only time that people find out that they have houses that have had work done that doesn't meet regs.
Because that is the only time someone comes in and tells them.

My DM's removed her bannister and rails in her 1960's house, many years ago. It was fine and she taught all the GC how to come up and down safely. She only reinstated it when she reached her 80's and needed a bit more safety. It didn't cost much to put back in.

I've found my people. Please check out picture no. 8 - a "drop in" cellar ...?!

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/139309271#/?channel=RES_BUY

Also if you've got some time on your hands check out the virtual tour on this one, look at the staircase, front bedroom - you opens the door, you steps into the void ...

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/86440032#/media?id=media0&ref=photoCollage&channel=RES_BUY

There is actually a trap door. You can see it on the video tour.

We once viewed a house that was built in the 1980’s. It had no handrails or bannister on the stairs which were in the living room.
One slip and you would be a gonner.
As it was in Scotland it had a home report and the surveyor mentioned it having no hand rail.
But nowhere in the report did it say it was a problem and the stairs needed one to comply with anything.

What you see a lot more often is heavily patterned carpets on stairs. We had them here when we moved in. They're a real hazard, esp if you have different height risers or different widths-front-to-back-of the steps in the run (we have both of those too). I spent the first 6 months doing (occasionally spectacular) acrobatics to recover from mis-steps until I gt so used to the whole setup I stepped it right automatically. I always warn visitors about it, and tell them to be very careful. When we recarpet it will be with a plain colour- it's much easier to see where the edges of the treads are.

I saw stairs like this in a house I was looking at on Rightmove the other day and was surprised it was allowed. Also, why? Put me right off. Also, stairs in the living room is an instant no, for me. I don't want all the heat and noise going upstairs.