How to know whether electrics need to be updated in a house when buying?

[CatAndHisKit]

I'm thinking of offering on an 80s house which hasn't been updated for many years (vendors are DC of an elderly man who lived there), looks like it has original electrics. They are saying rewiring isn't needed - but how do I know it's the case?

Would a basic survey advise on this (homebuyers') or would it need to be a structural survey? House is solid and a semi and no neighbours in the estate has changed roofs, it was built solidly - so I'm not keen on paying for full structural.

Is there a way to tell anyway? The board with switches looks old and has fewer switches than my current (but much bigger) house - I think about 4 switches. Sockets look ok with those brass fittings.

If it does need a rewire, is it a hugely expensive job, and can it be dome without stripping all the walls?

@murbblurb

Surveyors don't do electrics, you ( not the vendors) need to get an e I c r done. As piglet John says, the wiring is probably fine. Replacing fuses with a modern breaker box is a matter of a few hundred quid if that. I live in a house with 80s wiring , had the fuse box replaced a couple of years ago when other work was done.

Sorry if silly question but as is the benefit of a new breaker box if wiring stays the same?

Thank you all, lots of useful info! Good to know that the wiring is not unsafe - that's the main thing. I saw quite a few sockets - it's the two of us who will be living there so I don't think we;ll need extra sockets like a large familiy would.

Kitchen does have all the appliances, machines, oven etc.
And thanks for the link Silkiescat.

Would any electrician do the ELCR test - and would they always be honest as opposed to saying it needs rewiring so that they can get the job? Sorry if this is cybical but I came across that with plumbers, for sure. Though probably the official report is a documant where they must state facts only.

3.5K is totally unaffordable to me, UserOne - it's a lot of money for a small 3 bed which needs alo other jobs doing!
Vendors are really not going to discount - market is overactive in the city.
But it's a realistic option to me as I got outbid several times on newly renovated Victorian terraces (which still may haev hidden / subsequent issues in a couple of years, they all have chimneys which often leak it would appear) - this is the most modern i've looked at being 80s, so not really an 'old house' - hence I thought it's potentially less problematic even though old-fashioned.

*what is the benefit (first sentence)

*document (argh)

I got an electrician who was on the list of who does EICR tests on the link I gave and also Trustmark registered, he was fine but I had another in the past did work fine but no paperwork. The EICR does highlight anything not up to the latest regulations and most houses will fail it as the regulations change but it puts how they fail to meet regulations into categories. Can't remember the exact definitions but its like urgent and dangerous now, urgent and could be dangerous in future, nice to have.

thanks cat, very useful!

@catandhiskit Good question. Fuses and circuit breakers do the same job , cut the current if there is an overload. Fuse needs replacing whereas a breaker can be reset. Residual current device ( different and separate) should cut the current quickly enough to save a person from shock. Actual benefits of breakers Vs fuses - hmmm...

Wiring in a 1980s house should be fine if nothing stupid has been done or no actual damage. I found an example of stupidity - enclosed light fitting with 100w bulb in. Fried wiring above it.

Disclaimer - I am an internet random. I got my e I c r done by someone qualified. Fear not.

But if the survey reveals a property is not legally compliant - they will withdraw or make a condition.

Nonsense!

We had out house rewired in 2019 and it doesn't conform to current regs -we've just remortgaged. When we bought it, it hadn't been rewired or updated since the 70s, we still got a mortgage.

@Jarstastic

Surveyors don’t do electrics. They will recommend an ECR.

I think electrics from the 80s are likely fine.

Given the cost of the ECR, personally instead I’d just get a modern fuse board put in when I moved in for not much more money. that would highlight any issues.

I’ve just had a modern fuse box put in a property which was probably last rewired in the 80s. I didn’t have any issues with the old fuse wire box but I need to sell it and apparently buyers do.

The electrician has just sent through the invoice and an ECR. the latter contains the wording that the electrics are in a reasonable condition and the modern fuse box has brought up to current legislation. No recommendation to rewire.

Jarstatic how much did it cost to install the modern box? Was it easy or involved damaging the plaster etc around it? And did you mean buyers need it for mortgage specificaly?

murbblurb, I just meant, why not leave the old system if no rewire was done - does a modern box somehow upgrade/ majes safer the whole system?

Lots of houses were built or had work done under older regs and are fine.

A basic mortgage survey can take 2 minutes and can involve just a quick glance in most rooms and a comparison of houses in that street to estimate its value.

They may not look in each room, check damp levels, electric or check plumbing. You get what you pay for. If you want more in-depth check you need to consider paying for specific checks.

@CatAndHisKit
I had a new box fitted recently and it cost £350.
I researched it beforehand and the costs ranged from £300-£500
There was minimal damage to the plaster but the electrician actually fixed it.

@CatAndHisKit

Jarstatic how much did it cost to install the modern box? Was it easy or involved damaging the plaster etc around it? And did you mean buyers need it for mortgage specificaly?

It cost £450, all in. Probably on the higher end as it's a central London price. However, I have know the electrician for years and he is very trustworthy so I did not bother getting other quotes.

He popped in to measure the old box first. I don't think he damaged any plaster. The new box looks slightly bigger though.

I don't think the buyer needed it for their mortgage. Their mortgage valuer spent very little time in the property. The buyer said the property needed rewiring and they wanted a discount but when I asked to see the text, it was just usual expected caveats. The sale fell through for other reasons but I thought I'd minimise the possibility of it happening again.

My understanding is when a new fuse box is put in if there are any issues the switches will trip highlighting any issues, but the electrician also tested all sorts of stuff.

@CatAndHisKit

Jarstatic how much did it cost to install the modern box? Was it easy or involved damaging the plaster etc around it? And did you mean buyers need it for mortgage specificaly?

The issue is the removal of the old fuse board, but if it's under the stairs or in a utility room or such it doesn't make much difference. Ours is currently being redone and will be £500 but we are upgrading from the current one due to a new extension - the last one is only 2 years old and was £350

80's house will likely be fine, any bodges/bad work aside.

If you have a new CU fitted, all the circuits, and the earthing connections that are connected to it, must be tested and up to standard. This may mean repairing or replacing old wiring or fittings; or disconnecting them until they have been rectified.

So unless everything is tested and inspected before fitting the CU, you will not know in advance what the total cost will be.

if you have not had RCDs before, you may find that some of your old circuits (especially outdoor ones) and your old cooker or washer cause trips and need to be fixed.

Does a breaker box upgrade/make safe the whole system? Not really, but as piglet John says the associated testing as part of the install should spot any problems.

In our case when the plugs used to melt onto the sockets...!!...then had a full rewire !!

If you're looking at a house built before mid80s ask to see the fusebox and look at the dirtiness/age/yellowing of the power sockets.

Cosy thatr's the thing - I 've seen it and looks very old with dark glass and only a few switches.

Little, dot and Jar thanks - not expensive then! That's the way forward then. I don't think there were bodge jobs as the sone of the old man who lived there is a builder, so I'm sure he would not allow anything unsafe to be done.

earsup haha! you aer brave - didn't you also get frequent trippng etc?

I don't think there were bodge jobs as the sone of the old man who lived there is a builder, so I'm sure he would not allow anything unsafe to be done.

No offence to builders but some of the worst bodges I have seen were people in the trades who felt they knew enough about electricity to give it a go, but didn't know enough to do it safely.

Plastic fittings can go yellow with cigarette smoke. This does not indicate a fault.

However overheating (often caused by a badly wired plug) may leave a brown mark round one or more of the pin holes.

In the 1980's MK sockets were very popular and high quality. If cheap brands were used the switches are more likely to be worn out.

Crabtree and MEM sockets were less common domestically but very good.

i live in a relatively new house, buillt in 2009. Have never had electrics tested or fusebox looked at. Understand recommendation is an inspection every 10 years. Electrician said my box shouid be safe but would fail a test as as it doesn’t meet new requirements.
Any thoughts? Soon need to get it updated?

"Not to current requirements" is not a fail. It is an observation,

The classifications which require remedial action are C1 and C2

C1 – Danger present. Risk of injury. Immediate remedial action required.
C2 – Potentially dangerous – urgent remedial action required.
C3 – Improvement recommended.
FI – Further investigation required without delay