New neighbour wants to own the entry?

[danilyon]

Hi,

A new neighbour bought the house next to us about 3 weeks ago. She knocked and introduced herself and said she wanted to pop around the following week to talk about the back gardens. She came round and spoke about putting a fence in the back garden between our house and hers, which is fine as it's something we've been meaning to do but not had the money for. She also asked about putting a gate on the entryway that runs between our house, which is also fine with us.

She then went on to say that she would sort all of this out and that she would like to legally own the entryway that runs between our houses and that she would maintain the entryway. Our house is a terraced house in a row of 4 and our house and the neighbours are in the middle. Above the entryway is one of her bedrooms and her bathroom I think. The entryway is shared between us both and as far as my hubby and I are aware the boundry line runs straight down the middle of entryway. It is the only access we both have to our back gardens. When she mentioned getting her solicitor to send us the paperwork to have a read through hubby made a few non-commital comments but I think she thinks it's a go from us.

We've had no paperwork from any solicitor as of yet, but after me and hubby have had a chat (obviously couldn't do it whilst she was here), we are wondering why would she want to have ownership of the entryway? Obviously a part of our problem would be if she fell out with us for whatever reason and denied access as it's our only access to the back garden? Also what would happen when we sold our house - we think this could hinder a sale if we agreed and told the new owners that actually the neighbour owns the entryway?

I'm worrying what to say to her now as we are not keen to sign anything to give her the entryway completely. We only use the entryway to take the wheelie bins from the back garden out to the front on collection day anyway so it's not like we have all kinds of people coming round the back to see us etc. Does anyone have any advice on what we could say to her? Obviously we don't want to 'sour' relations with her because we are refusing to give her the entryway legally.

Any advice would help. Thanks! :)

Don't go there. I agree with the other posters. Just say you've had a think about it and decided against it. Don't let her bulldose you into anything. Any decisions should be on your terms and take longer than a day or so. You don't know this woman and the fact that she's doing this after only just moving in suggests that she is very controlling domineering. You may find she's a neighbour from hell and that you bitterly regret falling in with her wishes.
If in a few months or years, you decide to go along with her plan, you will have done so in your own time.

Anyway if you are doing anything that may give her a financial advantage in her home ownership, now or in the future, you need to make sure that you're not out of pocket.

We once owned a terraced house and shared alleyway in similar circumstances. The woman who had put a gate on the alleyway was the only one with a key and we had to ask her to unlock the gate every time we wanted to take things round to our garden. We were too young and naive to insist on having a key.

When we eventually sold our house i don't think the new owners even knew there was a shared alleyway and we forgot to mention it.

I would just say that you had a chat about it with a friend who is a lawyer and they have advised you not to. That way you keep it fairly low-key while referring to an 'expert' and being clear that you don't want to do it.

Just be upfront, make it clear you've had time to think and you'd really prefer not to agree. After all, you've not agreed to it yet (I assume) and therefore you're just letting her know your decision. And do it sooner than later !! Anything like this will cost you a LOT of money if you come to selling your own home, plus how would you ever get your bins out, etc. Absolutely terrible idea and she's quite clearly hoping to railroad you into it, stand your ground but do it now !!

I wouldn't agree. We have exactly the same arrangement at our house: a shared alleyway and we have (flying freehold) bathroom and bedroom over the alley. I cannot see any reason why I would pay to own the alley, unless I wanted to extend or limit access to our neighbours.

I would ask her why she wants to pay money to obtain legal title - her response might be illuminating.

Lipslave - She didn't mention any payment whatsoever, just that papers would come through saying that she would legally own the entryway and if we were happy with the arrangement then if we could sign them.

She's still not been at the house today. Going to have to pop a note through her door to say that we need to speak to her. We will most likely ask her why she would like to own the entryway legally, as it is a strange request.

Do not do it - there is no advantage to you - only disadvantage. On solicitors conveyancing forms you have to declare rights of way over property/shared access etc if you lose the alley it could depress the price of your house and put off buyers. Obviously for her if she gains the alley then it improves the value of her house and she may gate it or be planning to infill or even sell on in a year or so at a profit she could also be able to deny you access. Do not be bullied by any "I thought you agreed, I've had to pay for the solicitors letters" etc - she is being really cheeky.

We had problems selling a house on once because as a favour we had always let the neighbour cut through our garden to get to the main pathway (it was ver rural) as they had very young children and allowed them to put in a gate between our properties so he could have access - this caused no end of problems when selling - would never do anything like this again.

OP, I just meant that it is surely costing her several hundreds of pounds to instruct solicitors to draft the documents, even if she is not paying you directly. Hope you get it all sorted out.

OP don't even speak to her - just put the note through the door saying you don't want to go ahead. She sounds as if she could be a very forceful character and persuade you to agree against your better judgement.

UPDATE

Posted a letter through yesterday afternoon asking her to knock when she's next there.

Got the letter through today from her solicitors saying that (not word for word):

'We understand that in principle you have agreed to give your half of the the throughway to our client and that you will relinquish any rights of way to our client by doing so'

She never said at any point that we would be giving up our rights of way through the passage - the way she put it was that she would prefer to own it and therefore would be the one to maintain it but we could still use it. Surely this contradicts what she has already said to us?

Either way it is definately a big NO from us and hubby and I are prepared in case she decides to kick off in any way. We didn't agree to anything when she asked us, just told her we'd have a chat about it. FIL is a guarentor (sp) and has also advised us against anything happening. It sounds as though she very well could have been planning to fill it in to extend her living room or god knows what. We have not seen her at the house today either so I will write another note to tell her our exact decision, especially as we have received the solicitors letter, but will of course say that she is still welcome to call round if she wants to speak to us about our decision and will reinforce that we are still happy to go halves on the fence out back.

Thank you all once again for all your advice! :)

I assumed it was buying rather than giving, how cheeky is that!

Sorry I meant to put:

FIL is a guarentor on our mortgage

Baby brain!

I would also write to the solicitor saying you have made no such agreement in priniciple and have no intention to do so, and send a copy to the neighbour.

Yes I think it's important to establish RIGHT NOW in writing that the claim

'We understand that in principle you have agreed to give your half of the the throughway to our client and that you will relinquish any rights of way to our client by doing so'

is NOT true.

Spooky. It sounds like my former neighbour has moved next door to you. She's not a posh, sixtysomething blonde who rarely washes her hair and wears the same black leggings every day, is she?

We got a similar solicitor's letter (one of many) over access to our property. The fact that your neighbour has misrepresented the conversation you had rings major bells.

From experience I suspect her solicitor realises she's lying but is putting the best spin on it for her in the hope that you'll agree without question.

You must do what you think best but IME attempting to reason with our neighbour was pointless and encouraged her to make more unreasonable demands.

Put your point again in writing and make it clear that's final. I'd drop the back fence idea but if you really want to go ahead watch it being put up in case there's another "misunderstanding" about what you agreed to.

Check the deeds to see if she's allowed to store stuff in the alley. If not, return anything that appears there. Also any gate, lockable or not.

Not that any of that establishes ownership or special rights, which is what my nutty neighbour thought, but it's just necessary to tell these people to back off.

Mine got very unpleasant before she sodded off for good.

Hope your situation turns out fine. Good luck. Keep us posted.

Mrslevy - She does have blonde hair and I would put her in her late 50's though she could be in early 60's. Not sure about the leggings as I've only seen her three times because she's renting somewhere and coming up to the house to decorate. She does sound spookily similar. Was she a single lady on her own? Our new neighbour has moved up from Surrey where she is currently trying to sell her house. She is quite well spoken too.

As soon as hubby saw the bit about relinquishing all of our rights he was very annoyed as she had not put it like that. May be the case of us sorting our own fence for our side just in case! We are about to sort out the redecoration of our house so we are moving into a rented property about 5 mins away and hubby will be up here every day doing stuff.

Will def have to dig the deeds out and have a look. Be spooky in my new neighbour is your old neighbour!!!

I think doing your own fence is a very good idea, this woman does not sound like someone who you'd want to be "beholden" to, in any way!

The cheek of her!! Relinquish any rights Yea, like F*ck!

How bizzare!

Do not give up any rights whatsoever to this woman! Keep the access and ownership as is even if she was to pay you it would be so little and would be a huge disadvantage if you came to sell. This access is for many things including fire and builders etc and means you can bring things to the back of the house without tramping through which a lot of people love in a house. She sounds high handed to me. I would just say after taking advice you have decided to stay as is as it has worked for you for years. She probably bought teh place with this in mind but she should have checked first!

wow. stunning level of cheek there.

I would steer well clear of that one. I felt quite stressed just reading about it; there is something obviously very wrong with someone who would do this and assume it'd be fine and you'd just go along with what's best for her.

Wtf! Keep your distance

Ha! I knew she was up to no good. So glad you haven't allowed her to ride roughshod over you OP. Bloody cheek trying to get you to give her your land AND right of access without paying a penny too.

I suspect relations may well be frosty for a bit because you've thwarted her plans but all you can do is be smiley and friendly when you see her, even if it's not reciprocated. And yes, I'd get the fence up asap or she'll put hers up a foot onto your land !

I'll PM you her name! You never know, it could be her, it's not a million miles away. Probably not though.

What I learned was that not every nuisance neighbour wears a wife beater t-shirt and has a pit bull. There are loads of outwardly respectable people who are seriously antisocial. It really wrong-foots you.

Don't worry about her. Just be firm and refuse to be pushed about.

I would get a response in writing to the solicitor making it clear that you never agreed to that in principle and are not going to agree. Nip it straight in the bud and explain to your neighbour that you have received advice that it would be detrimental to your property ( don't say the advice is from MN ). That way she can't try and persuade you as you just tell her what you have been advised.

Good luck.