Best schools near Finsbury Park / Highbury & Islington - advice please

[JRD]

Hi everyone,

My partner and I are planning on moving to Finsbury Park / Highbury & Islington area soon and raising a family there. I'm currently struggling to decide exactly where because we want to maximise our chances of getting kids into a good school and the catchment areas are sometimes so small - it seems you need to be within a 5 minute walk to have a good chance of getting in. We're open to either state or private but would ideally like to be within a 15 min walk of both school and train/tube station. I've looked at the school websites and Ofsted ratings etc but can't seem to find many recent parent reviews on forums etc to whittle things down further.

Does anyone have any experience of schools like the below?

• Ambler Primary School
• Gillespie Primary School
• St John Highbury Value (although we'd prefer non-religious)
• Cannonbury
• William Tyndale
• St Paul's Steiner
• The Children's House School
• The Gower

Particularly interested to hear where pupils from these schools go on to for secondary / if they do above average at 11+ etc. Also if there are any other sites / forums you'd recommend exploring.

Any advice much appreciated!

Thanks,

I'm in Islington, though not near any of those schools. A close family member went to Canonbury and it seems to be very good. Ofsted seems to rate all of the ones near us as either good or outstanding but I'm also curious to know what forums / sites we should be looking at to gather more info

It difficult to say because the standards have dropped since covid. I would say Tyndale, St Joan of Arc (not mentioned but in the same area) and St Johns. I wouldn't say it be difficult to get into either Joan of arc or St Johns unless you are already a church goer. Tyndale has a small catchment - if you move to Finsbury Park, it not likely you will get a place.

Tyndale and Gillespie very popular; minuscule catchments. Very pushy parents and very competitive.

Ambler, Canonbury, St John's and Joan of arc all good schools without putting the children on a treadmill. The latter two do a LOT of religion.

Private:
The Steiner is awful and the parents are insane. Children’s house and Gower are good.

Secondaries:
Clever or religious children go to SMMA. Girls who prefer single sex go to Highbury Fields which is ofsted outstanding. The rest go to Highbury grove. All three are pretty strict.

This is really helpful, thanks. We’re not keen on too much religion so that’s good to know. I’ve also read the threads on The Gower School and see that, even in recent years, that’s one that seems to work for some but not for others.

Schools like Ambler and Gillespie are closest to where we’d be looking. Does anyone have a view on what optionality leavers from those schools typically have? Helpful to know re the nearby state secondaries but what about other options? Eg, if they apply to private secondaries or even grammar schools, do they typically receive offers - or would that be considered unusual?

Forget about catchment for primary schools. Move to where the secondary school is you want.

Interesting, I haven't received this advice before. Usual advice I've received has been to stay close to the primary on the basis kids can't travel solo at that age, whereas they can get themselves to secondary using public transport. Has your experience been different?

Ambler and Gillespie both very popular and I know parents are very happy at both of them. Maybe slightly different vibes. Gillespie as a single form school has a tiny catchment surrounded by expensive houses so it is more "middle class" whatever that means and less diverse. That said, both schools are more "middle class" in comparison to the surrounding secondary schools for example. Gillespie is probably slightly more laid back (call teachers by their first names, etc.) But both are excellent choices, and people feel lucky to get into either.

What do you mean about school leavers? At all these schools most kids are going to the local state schools like Highbury Grove, Stoke Newington School, Highbury Fields, etc. Lots of kids study for/are tutored and take the tests and many do get into popular secondaries like SMMA (though there are only 18 places for test takers and you don't have to live in Islington to take it, so slim chances.) Maybe a handful will go to DAO or Latymer. Getting into grammar schools is hardly unusual, but given how insanely difficult it is for any kid to get into one in London, it's not really the "norm." I can think of only a few kids who have gone private -- not that plenty couldn't have gotten in, it's just not the general culture/vibe of the community who send their kids to Gillespie and Ambler, not to mention the cost.

Remember state schools do not prepare you at all for grammar tests (which do not match the state curriculum), so admission to them is reflective of the parents/tutoring, etc., not of the school. Obviously a good education helps, but no London state primary (as far as I know) can take credit for kids getting into grammar schools (or take the blame if they don't.)

Well reality is most primary schools are decent in London. And catchment areas for excellent state secondary schools are tiny.
you plan to move to an area where a) there aren’t selective state schools b) there is huge disparity in the ethnicity,
class and wealth of families. All of which factor in to the culture and experience in schools. As is true in the area I live
so if I were moving no, pre school age kids I’d be looking at secondary schools first.

Thank you, really encouraging to hear about Ambler and Gillespie.

We're new to all of this so appreciate this may be a basic question but, generally speaking, what determines whether you can get into schools like those? Where does the luck part come in? Is it just living within the catchment area (which I understand can vary year to year) and getting your child's name down on a list early enough? E.g. if you lived within a 5 minute walk of the school, would you imagine you're pretty sure to get in? Or are there are other hurdles which are similarly important?

As for what I meant about school leavers - I'd read about some people planning to send their kids to schools like Ambler / Gillespie with the intention of then sending them on to one of the North London private schools for secondary (Highgate, etc), which have a more manageable 'commute' once kids are in their teens, so I was curious to hear thoughts on feasibility of that. Sounds like the reason that's less common is one of parent choice rather than child ability/education then?

Which schools do you mean in terms of getting in? State primary schools are done almost entirely by distance with a few exceptions (siblings etc). No putting name down except the form everyone fills out.

For London grammar schools it’s basically a test and they all differ so it’s paying attention to dates to sign up, etc and then battling the thousands of others for a place. For DAO you have to live or go to school in Islington.

For private secondary it really and truly does not matter what primary school you go to if you are going state. Of course you want to go to a good one for a solid education. I imagine the schools you’re looking at are about the same as all great primary schools with a fairy wealthy intake in terms of the numbers of kids they send to private schools. No London state primary is sending huge amounts of kids to private school that I know of - not because they can’t get in but because it’s wildly expensive! Each will have its own admissions requirements that you will have to look up but it has nothing to do with your state primary.

Maybe this is different for private primary but others can speak to that …

So in short yes it’s absolutely feasible but not common!

Look at the secondary options first. Unless you can afford private secondary school then you need to live close to the school you would like for secondary, think they have smaller catchments. Mary Mags has a tiny catchment for example.

St Paul’s Steiner goes up to 14 I think.

Super helpful, thanks for your thoughts @rizzomaisel !

As said, I'm new to this but I'm surprised it's so uncommon for people to do state primary and private secondary if it's fairly realistic (academically) to make the transfer from one to the other, especially in areas like Finsbury Park / other parts of North London which appear to be relatively affluent (although appreciate this is of course not the norm generally)

Maybe it will become more common but it’s not now - not unheard of or surprising but not common. Most people I think can afford the expensive house or private education - if they can afford both they’ve probably got their kids in private school from the start. Also London state schools are better than you’d think - people are pretty happy with the local secondaries and they send lots of kids to excellent universities (Oxbridge, etc.) It’s also a mixed, progressive area and many parents I suspect aren’t huge advocates of private school ideologically, but that’s just a guess.

I think most children attend state secondary schools. A minority will attend Dame Alice Owen, Latimer, St Michaels and Henrietta Barnet. The primary schools will not prepare for this. Although you did get children from state school attending private schools most will attend from the start. If you want your child to attend private school, it might be worth reconsidering your location.

If you have girls you could also consider Cavendish prep in Camden - they have a school bus that runs to Highbury New Park and Blackstock Road, so there is quite a large intake from that area.

It’s not totally uncommon for kids to move from state primary to private secondary, however to get into one of the selective North London private secondaries e.g Highgate, they will need to do the 11+ exam and interview process. Kids at private prep schools will be prepared for this exam as part of their schooling, kids at state primaries will not, so you would need to provide tutoring.

Thanks @SuperSloth , I figured that might be the case. Do you have any view on whether state+tutoring gives kids a similarly good chance of getting into one of those selective private secondaries as going to a private primary? Appreciate difficult to say but would be curious to hear any experiences of people who’ve tried the former route. I guess if it’s not totally uncommon then it must be realistic if you plan for it (and not the case that people who do succeed with that route have just gotten “lucky”).

I'd say it depends entirely on the child. What are your children like? Would they take well to outside tutoring or would it become a constant battle? Are they not just great at school but also quick-thinking on tests (intelligence does not necessarily mean brilliant at these kinds of tests -- it's worth looking up now what the admissions tests are like.) Are they anxious and would find the tests confidence-destroying or would they like the challenge? If you have doubts, then that's why a lot of people put their kids in early all-through schools, as it's easier to get in at the start than at 11 plus.
Going to a prep school does not guarantee admission either, and I know a couple of kids who have switched from private to state at secondary because the local secondary had stronger results than the not-great private secondaries they had gotten into. If you look at leaver destinations at a school like Cavendish, you will see a fair few kids go to the local (excellent) secondaries.
You really cannot know in advance unless it's obvious your child is a total superstar -- that's why people hedge their bets at the start and just stick them in Highgate at 7 when it's not as hard to get in.
Luck, I think, has little to do with it. If you're anxious and can afford it, just do private school. We've had such excellent experiences with state schools that I personally think it's a bit mad unless money is no object at all.

@JRD Worth looking at locrating website if you haven't already. It breaks down destination schools. You have to pay, its about £8 a month but can pay for one month and take info as needed. As most said, most kids go to state secondaries but there is a slight difference from primary to primary.

I would agree with moving close to secondary schools you're interested in if you don't want to.move again.
There are a lot less children for school places than there were a few years ago. Islington have already closed 2 primaries with another 2 at risk (not ones you mention)-this may impact on the Highbury and Finsbury Park primaries.
However, as a PP said most primaries in London are good. If you wanted to stick with state schools Tufnell Park area puts you nearer some decent state secondary options across the border in Camden too as well as good primaries.
There does seem you be better options for girls at secondary.
A friend of DD was hugely tutored and didn't get into any of the selective state options for secondary. It is very competitive.

Dame Alice Owen’s have an Islington catchment

Agree about thinking about your secondary school if you’re moving anyway. Generally the primary schools are fine. I also agree that not many people seem to send their kids to private secondary from schools like Ambler, even when they’ve been privately educated themselves. I know some people from the local area who moved to be in the catchment of APS and Fortismere. Some families tutored their kids to get a place at DAO

We're currently in William Tyndale and it's a great school. Great mix of parents and children, at least in our class. The Head teacher changed and the new one is very hands on. Management is good at dealing with issues.
Loads of school trips in comparison to other schools in the area.
Swimming lessons in year 4. Children do lots of gardening, great choice of after school clubs from sports to coding, languages, even Little Angel theatre Puppet making.
Teachers are great, not much movement. Teaching is good and kids are performing well. Lots of booster classes for those who find reading/writing/maths challenging.
Every year we have children joining in from the waiting list from schools such as Cannonbury, St Mary Magdalene, Gower. The community is great and I'm not sure about what the post meant mentioning 'pushy parents'. Perhaps it was reference to the parents who pay for tutoring outside of school, there are some like that, usually the ones who are targeting private secondaries.
Few months ago there was Ofsted visit and they were impressed with the children, how happy, well behaved and well adjusted they are at William Tyndale. Which for me is the most important thing.
From William Tyndale greatest number of children end up at St Mary Magdalene (approximately 20-25%). Also Dame Alice Owen, Highbury Fields. Also every year kids end up in Latimer, City school, St Paul's usually ones that had extra private tutoring.
I whole heartedly recommend William Tyndale primary.

usually the ones who are targeting private secondaries.

@Kalimero do you know what fraction of the children at Tyndale apply to private secondaries? And what fraction attend private secondaries?