Heath House, Blackheath, SE London

[Londonwriter]

Just wondered if anyone had any up-to-date experience of Heath House?

We live in Westcombe Park and have recently been around Heath House, Pointers and Blackheath Prep for our DS (who has just turned one - we were expecting intense London school competition so wanted to get in early :#/).

We weren't impressed by Blackheath Prep as it has an entrance exam at three (!) but the kids in reception didn't seem to have learned any more than I did at a rural state primary. The facilities were good, but it seemed huge, cold and impersonal.

We loved Pointers. It felt quirky, warm and friendly, and we liked the headmaster (who is apparently a marmite figure), but I know it's not especially good at getting kids into academically selective senior schools.

Heath House has near-zero outside space and was really overcrowded, but they had kids reading by age four - despite being academically non-selective. Nearly 50% of their kids get into academically selective senior schools.

Our temptation is to register our little one for Heath House, but we're not sure if he will be unhappy due to the cramped conditions and academic pressure at age three. There didn't seem to be many obvious opportunities for running about and letting off steam, but we went in the morning and I think they do freeform activities in the afternoon.

Wondered if anyone has been around any of these schools and can comment? DH and I are really academic, but seriously rubbish at sport, etc. We were bullied a lot at school. Our DS is too young to have much of a personality, but is very smiley, determined, energetic and noticeably more extrovert than us.

If you’re both academic the kid will do fine wherever - and learning to read at four makes no difference at all.

Pointers feels like the obvious choice - well, actually given that you’re in London with its great state primaries none of them do, but if you’ve nothing better to do with your money...

Pansiesandredrosesandmarigolds. My husband was 'expelled' from Dulwich Village School (okay, told to go away) and that's supposed to be one of the best state schools in London.

I had similar problems at my rural village school and don't think I'd have survived if the headteacher hadn't taught my friend and I separately. I was unbelievably disruptive.

So where DS goes to school is important...

If it wasn't for that, I'd agree with you...

Hence why I'm not sure I want to pay for Pointers unless they're actually going to teach DS to read.

My child went to Heath House and I know a number of families who have children there.

The kids are taken out onto the Heath for outdoor play, similar to the All Saints children. What I liked about HH is its pastoral care. The children are very well looked after emotionally and physically. I’m not sure my child could read at 3 (in the kindergarten year) because they didn’t really start formal learning until Reception, which I was Halls with. They’re not academically selective but they’re quite clever at picking out the families whose children will do well - that’s the whole point of the parent interview. Kids tend to do very well academically - ours certainly did so we felt the fees were worth it.

I liked it, it’s a nice school.

My DD goes to John Ball in the village. We chose John Ball after visiting Pointers, Blackheath Prep, Heath House, All Saints, Colfes and Blackheath Girls. However, she has done private tutoring at Heath House for 5 years and every one of her tutors (who are all current Heath House teachers) have been exceptionally, exceptionally capable, friendly and kind. And certainly their Year 6 leavers destinations and scholarships are excellent. Having said that, we were also a bit worried about the lack of outdoor play space. Also, check the admissions information on their website as the other thing that concerned us about Heath House was the strange warning that if your child wanted to leave/change schools before end of Year 6 (exception being if you moved abroad), they would not give a reference for your child to the new school. By the way we liked the Pointers headmaster too, and despite us stating openly at the interview that we were atheists, we we offered a place, just fyi.

Heath House is so so small though? Tiny buildings and v small classes. No outside space. No team sports.

It's also owned by its headteacher and has a v odd uniform.

All reasons why I would never choose it.

BP - agree selection at 3 is bonkers and frequently inaccurate anyway. It's a larger school with great facilities but does have its drawbacks. 11+ results vary year on year. But it's still v competitive to get in.

Pointers - the headmaster owns the school so there is no independent governance. Uniform is hilarious. but 11+ results seem to be on the up despite some bad years a while back. limited outdoor space - a worry given that there are more kids here than at BP?

What do you want for secondary? Might help focus what you want now?

I often see the HH kids on the Heath in their school groups. One thing that occurred to us was the small year group, what if your child doesn't find their friend 'fit'. Colfes is another option, it's got plenty of space with the senior school attached. There is an assessment for entry but I understand it's a lot less formal than the Blackheath Prep one.
John Ball is also excellent and there are other great state schools near you.

Agree that the Heath House uniform boys' knickerbockers and girls' culottes are v. questionable :)

But I love the Pointers uniform! In fact almost chose it because of the uniform!

Culottes actually v practical for active girls - although almost universally detested by the older ones. Knickerbockers/cravats are the oddities?

Agree with HH - the year groups are just too small. And even when they do venture onto the Heath for 'PE' most seem to not be in sportsgear and it seems more a bit of larking around rather than any team games?

I do know a couple of families who have loved it though - one did a lot of sport outside school. All the kids did very well at 11.

I wonder if the assessment at Blackheath Prep is more about:

1. Seeing if you child has any behavioural difficulties;

2)seeing whether the child will fit in (and maybe whether the parents will fit in);

3)helping create demand by having this process, making parents really think about going to the school and what it involves so then if their child gets in they feel more special.

4. seeing what the child do in terms of fine motor skills, can they count, recognise or write their name, can they sit still and listen and concentrate, can they recognise letters and numbers.

I understand that Blackheath prep does not have a sibling policy so that is something to think about.

Pointers seems an odd school in terms of layout and the Head. Many find the head off putting. As an example a friend and her husband went to meet him and he only addressed her husband and so they declined to go further as didn't think he would be a role model and they wondered if the head was sexist.

Heath House - why would pay for a school without any outdoor space, especially in Blackheath?

There are fantastic state schools but each to their own ( as long as you have lots and lots and lots of money to pay for fees).

HH is privately owned too so really you have no external governance. Also - ask for a current teachers list. The ht couldnt give us one and made an odd comment about how she likes kids to get used to new teachers. The teachers we saw were all young and attractive. I suspect that they leave after they get a couple years under their belt and go for better pay. The class sizes are too small. Pointers also has that reputation- cheaper teachers coming from Australia. BP is a normal school with clever kids attending. Yes they have grounds and facilities but wouldn’t say teaching is better than a normal state school.
The state schools are good in the area.
Also think long term as Blackheath not in catchment area for grammar schools so your child will have to get in the top 180 kids to be able to get a look in. So really you are looking at independent colfes, Blackheath high schools etc or the local state secondary.

I wouldn't worry too much at this stage about your DS having similar issues to those you and your DH experienced. He may be very different and thrive in any decent school. I appreciate you want to have plans in place in case that isn't how things turn out, but nevertheless they might not be necessary. In my experience of my family and friends, nearly all children were reading before starting school anyway.

Can you register him for HH? When we enquiried not long ago their waiting list was full.

At this age why not just put him down on all the lists then see what he seems like and what the schools are like nearer the time?

I myself went to Heath House when it was in its infancy! I loved my time there, but not sure leaving 15 years ago counts as ‘up-to-date knowledge’

Despite pretty highly academically achieving kids, it managed to create an atmosphere that was incredibly friendly and non-competitive. I have such fond memories of PE on the heath, long holidays and art in the afternoons.

My child goes to Pointers and it’s a lovely school. The teachers are warm and caring, and I do find my child is being pushed academically (more than I would expect at their age!). Outside space for the early years isn’t great though, but gets better when they move up to the main building.

We looked at BP, liked it and DS had a place. We then saw Invicta Primary and it’s a fabulous school, although not private... I wouldn’t dismiss the state schools in the area out of hand.

My dd went to pointers for nursery and is now at all saints'. Both schools are fantastic. The year we left pointers they had some great y6 results for secondary schools and all saints' also has a good number of children going onto grammar and independent selective schools. The lack of outside space at hh did really bother me. Obviously we do too use the heath at all saints', but this is in addition to our school playgrounds not instead of.

Hi. Very interesting and informative thread. Many people have mentioned above that many good state schools in blackheath. Which ones would you in your experince say are good for a co-e year 1. Of course I understand some maybbe next to impossible to get into especially as we are not catholic. We are moving from overseas so can try and get a place on rent accordingly (if avbl). Thank u

i am a parent of a child currently in HH.

Yes - space is (and has always been an issue) BUT - the children have the heath to play on, and no, they don't lark around - they have team sports, and regularly participate in competitions.

Uniform - i happen to think the uniform is great, but then again if your picking a school based on uniform look, well thats a little odd.

Academic wise - HH's academic prowess is quite outstanding - which was important to us.

Ownership - yes the headmaster owns it, the school has a very family feel to it, you can speak to all the teachers, the headmaster welcomes you into her office whenever you want, for how long you want. The pastoral care is great and i love the small class sizes. Every child gets so much attention.

HH does have a waiting list as long as london, we got lucky as someone dropped out. There is a sibling policy too, which is great. Not sure what the poster talking about how attractive the teachers were has anything to do with it - but the teachers are all very friendly and nice - communication is great between parents and them and there is daily feedback.

We were offered places at Pointers (the headmaster i was not impressed by and was so far up himself with his achievements that we said no), Colfes (too far) and BHG (only girls and i have a son). BHP while being great for grounds, had a poor academic record as compared to HH.

In the end, you will have to meet with the head teacher for a sort of 'interview' - she gets to decide if you and your child are the right fit for the school so they are selective this way. And yes - my child could free read by the time she turned 4 (if this is important to you) Good luck OP.

HH has a headmistress and not a headmaster though? Great that he/she (?) is good at academics but there is much much more to primary education IMO.

The only kids we knew who went to HH did not get a place in the BP process. The waiting list at any of these schools is pretty long, and all the drawbacks of HH cited on here a year ago are reasons why parents prefer other local schools (independent and state).

Regarding sports facilities, where do the children practice team sports? Certainly not on the Heath. Have lots of friends with kids in local schools and none of them have ever played HH, so am not sure who the fixtures are against.

Am also not quite clear what you're basing your assertion that BP has a poor academic record on? It has its quirks but poor 11+ results is not one of them.

Honestly if you are considering living in Blackheath or greeenwich I would go state and save your money.

You can always spend money on enrichment activities or save up for secondary where choices are more difficult. As a case in point he Blackheath Conservatoire runs after school and holiday classes that are rammed with state students.

Schools that I hear are fantastic
Blackheath:
John ball - I know people who are just so so happy with John Ball and I think the school is fantastic (from when I have visited to attend events etc)

All Saints - will be a religious element so challenging to get in
Brooklands
Invicta - Blackheath standard I hear the head is fantastic and they have great grounds.
Our lady of grace - Blackheath standard - again religious.

Greenwich:

Halstow - excellent reputation but very difficult to get in but has not been inspected for a number of years

Millennium primary- greenwich peninsula rated outstanding

Christchurch primary East Greenwich

St Mary Magdalene - greenwich peninsula and you get automatic entry to the secondary which could end up being the best greenwich based state school given that John Roan has bad reputations issues

Meridian east greenwich but near enough to the centre I think it is excellent

There is another excellent primary school not far from Greenwich railway whose name escapes me but I always hear great feedback.

I think primary wise greenwich Blackheath lewisham have it good.

I would not go hear private unless you have money to burn or you have a specific reason to consider it.

Save for a private school later

and do you know, although we did use one of the independent schools, with hindsight I would agree. Some fabulous choices out there.

We moved out of HH with our child because we found that:

• Our child was unbalanced due to the pressure to do such a high volume of homework. We found were teaching teaching the homework, because the young teachers (referenced by others above) weren't.
• Our child struggled to learn to read due to the school wanting to hot house and push. We had to stage a reading intervention at home, and this put him back on track. He also was 'remedial' in handwriting and had no additional support. When we switched schools, this was identified in the first week and he was given additional support.
• That we were concerned that our child was unbalanced. A combination between the volume of homework, inadequate play facilities meant that he couldn't do basic things, like bounce a ball or hang on a monkey bar. We felt the focus was only on results and 'keeping up appearances' and not on the child growing up well-rounded.
• The Head Teacher who is also the owner of the family school (with various additional companies across Scotland and Switzerland) provided no assurances of adequate governance. There is no Board, and she essentially runs the school with her husband and children.
• The swimming classes take up half a day a week. Our child went backwards in them, and other children had panic attacks about attending because they were so awful. The school was not interested in this feedback.
• There is no music programme or specialist music teachers. The school concerts were torture because the kids were so out of tune. There is no exposure to learning to read music or play instruments.

Having seen other people remain there, there pressure to achieve in 11+ for selective independent school is immense. The kids were hot-housed in before school and after school study groups. We saw some of the 'signing' up to clubs just before 11+, so they could say they did other things outside school.

We moved our child and it's the best decision we ever made. He's become a much more confident, active and well-rounded child.

We are looking to move to the Blackheath area and I am looking at a mix of independent and state schools.

Does anyone know if children are widely tutored for the eleven plus exams outside of school or if the private schools in particular provide enough tuition for the children to excel in those tests? I notice that the leavers list for Pointers and Heath House are quite impressive but was wondering if this is down to the school or outside tutoring.

Also does anyone know if the John Ball kids go into excellent secondary schools, either independent or grammar? TIA