Why on earth shouldn't you teach reading if you jolly well feel like it?

[learnandsay]

Is it really all that bad?

[Badvoc]

What!?
Is that a real thread?

[mrz]

i think motherinferior is referring to a post on the when did your child start reading for pleasure thread

[motherinferior]

I meant L&S' assertion upthread. Look, sweetie, we get it: your child is clever and you are damn well going to teach her to read whatever anyone says. Whereas I stand by my point that not bothering won't make any damn difference in the quite medium let alone long term.

[harryhausen]

I totally agree with MotherInferior.

I live, eat and breathe books. It's my career and my passion. I don't think I ever picked up a book before school - let alone read at 12 months old

I played on my own. Made up stories in my head. My parents read to me.

Both my dcs are great readers, but I didn't teach them to read before school. Dd took to it quicker then ds, both at 8 yrs is only just beginning to ^like reading for pleasure. Surely this is the key? In fact, I got so worried about her not 'joyfully picking up Tolkien' (or whatever particular example I read on here) that I pressured her too much to enjoy it. It's only since I completely backed off that she found what she^ likes.

I do find myself raising an eyebrow when people say their 2 yr old is reading Roald Dahl completely independently. It's just another underhand level of parental competitiveness. This is why I never discuss reading ability with anyone except the teacher.

[ShipwreckedAndComatose]

at motherinferior!

[VinegarDrinker]

Your two assertions are not mutually exclusive, though motherinferior. Do you do everything you do now because of
potential future benefit? Presumably you do some things with your kids just because they love them? Is it really so far from the realms of possibility that while one child finds dinosaurs or animals or diggers or cars fascinating, another loves letters? Or letters and diggers? Is buying a 2 year old a book about diggers also pushy parenting?

I'm surprised my just-2 year old knowing his phonic alphabet hasn't been subjected to the eye rolling L&S has got. He is currently putting his fridge magnet letters onto a puzzle of a farm and saying them out loud: the c on the cow, the p on the pig and the b on the barn etc ENTIRELY of his own volition. Then he might tip them all on the floor and enjoy rolling in them and whooping. Because he's 2.

I have no illusions about this being predictive of future genius, but it makes him happy, keeps him out of my hair for a while, so what's not to encourage?

[VinegarDrinker]

I have never mentioned DS knowing his colours/shapes/numbers/letters or whatever it is that week to any of my RL parent friends. Why would I? I only know it's unusual to know your alphabet by 2 because he started a new nursery the day after his birthday and they were a bit surprised.

It just winds me up that being able at something is something that has to be downplayed or negated even from toddlerhood (and "blamed" away by laughing at the parents as being pushy). Is that not just the first step on the road to teaching kids (and especially boys) that being clever or picking things up easily is something "uncool" or to be embarrassed by and hidden?

[motherinferior]

Nobody said anything about overall ability. If your child is fascinated by letters, fine and lovely. I just stand by my original points.

I am also finding this all profoundly ironic given my fundamentalist conviction that narrative and words are the only things of importance in this world.

[motherinferior]

(I did mean fundamentalist not fundamental btw. I am unreasonable and bigoted about narrative.)

[mrz]

I agree with much you have said but I think we would be naive to believe that all children will learn to read when they are ready, no matter how language and book rich their lives have been.

[teacherwith2kids]

I would agree, mrz.

My post above was about 'delivering children to school in the best position to enjoy long term reading success'. With high-quality phonics teaching in school, those children can then fly.

[mrz]

and nursery needs to be about sharing books and developing the imagination NOT about flashcards and reading schemes.

[ShipwreckedAndComatose]

Absolutely!

[teacherwith2kids]

Absolutely, mrz. Because although we would love to think that all parents are able and willing to provide a language and book rich environment, nursery classes, pre-schools, day nurseries, childminders etc must do so too to ensure that as many children as possible have that critical foundation of 'book / story lovingness'.

[learnandsay]

I'm sure most parents can get to the library.

I'm not sure that we have a word for the preparation which comes before reading, but Sesame St have got it about right I think by calling it getting ready to read. My daughter had a journey between what they call getting ready and what I'd call useful reading. You could even say that by singing the alphabet song and playing with fridge magnets the children are getting ready to get ready.

[ShipwreckedAndComatose]

I'm sure most parents can get to the library.

Yes, but do they want to?? I'm thinking you would be quite shocked at what some family backgrounds are actually like.

[Badvoc]

Don't get me started on decking reading schemes....

I am honestly worried I am turning into one of "those" parents, you know?
Ds is reading a fairly simple 4.7 level book - no idea what that means btw - at school. They do accelerated reader.
At at home he is reading how to train your dragon by Cressida cowell!!
Do I say something at parents evening?
It seems a big difference to me....

[Badvoc]

Learnandsay...at my children's school I can assure you that 90% of the children have never set foot in the local library!
They run a reading comp between schools in the summer.
Out of over 500 children about 50 kids took part.

[RaisinBoys]

Is there nothing parents won't compete about?

Reading should be a pleasure. Pre-school reading should be about nurturing a love of books, a love of story, a love of narrative, a love of rhyme, a fascination with the world.

The mechanics of reading will come for most children when they are ready.

Some children may need some extra help - Skilled teachers make all the difference but no-one is saying that parents cannot do whatever they want to aid their child's journey to reading.

[teacherwith2kids]

Hmm, L&S - well, if the library is in the town 5 miles away, and you don't drive, have 3 children under the age of 5 and there is a bus in each direction at maximum twice a day (though it turns straight round so you either have 5 minutes or 4 hours in town between buses), how accessible is the library physically?

And if you have a chaotic lifestyle, or have literacy problems yourself, then registering at the library (requiring, as it does, documents as proof of address and the filling in of a form), how accessible is the library practically?

And if you don't value reading or education, how accessible is the library psychologically?

I appreciate that you are talking about your own social circle and wider acquintance, and I am talking about a particular subset of parents who I have encountered as a teacher, but I find your glib comments about 'most parents' really quite irritating.

Yes, most literate parents, who have jobs that allow time to visit the library during its opening hours (the latter of course are being reduced in many places) and transport that makes the library physically accessible to them, with money for that transport and some belief that 'reading is good' can get to the library.

That does not mean that there is a substantial minority - perhaps those whose children are most in need of access to books - who have actual or psychological barriers to library access that will make it a very rare event if it is possible at all.

[teacherwith2kids]

At my children's very MC primary, in a town with an excellent children's library within walking distance, well over 50% of children do the summer reading challenge.

At the school in which I taught, very far from being MC, 5 miles from a small branch library with limited opening hours, the equivalent figure was

[mrz]

I'm sure most parents can get to the library.

Then you don't rely on public transport or live in a small village.

Imagine you have 6 children and need to change buses twice to travel to the nearest library.

[seeker]

You can ret to the library- if you have the time the energy the money the inclination and the confidence.

[Badvoc]

Parents may have literacy issues themselves, or perhaps English isn't their first language?
A library on every street corner wing help solve those issues.

[learnandsay]

I've heard of parents travelling double that distance pulling their children on a sledge through the snow. I'm sorry, I wouldn't be impressed with a parent who told me that her child couldn't didn't read very much because the library was five miles away.