6 yr old school behaviour - apparently I need counselling

[MollieO]

Have also posted this in the Behaviour section but hope that I might get some replies posting here.

Was told by ds's form teacher and SENCO today that ds's behavioural problems are because of my crap parenting skills. They said I need to see a counsellor to help me but didn't suggest how I actually go about it.

Ds is in yr 2 (6.4). He refuses to do school or homework. He boasts to his classmates about the fact that he hasn't done his homework. In class he copies other pupil's work. He is disruptive in choir practice. The music teacher wanted him to sing a solo at the Christmas concert but his behaviour means he won't be allowed to do so now. No mention of him being disruptive in class, just that he won't do his work.

All of these are apparently my fault because I am a single parent.

I suggested before half term that ds should be referred to an Ed Psych (which either I or my health insurers would pay for as he is at private school). Teachers said that work isn't the problem (even though he isn't doing any he hasn't fallen behind) but his attitude to work is.

They have suggested that if I sit him down and give him ten minutes to do his homework he will comply and do it. Makes me wonder what they think I have actually been doing to try and get him to do it.

I am curious to know what a counsellor could add and interested if anyone has been through this. Looking at the other parents in the year I reckon I am one of the strictest. I expect ds to try his best and I don't reward spelling test marks with new toys (which a lot of others appear to do).

Ds refused to do his homework over half term so missed various activities because of that. He doesn't have tv on until he has done his homework (so he doesn't see any tv at the moment). Not sure what else I can do.

[MollieO]

Lenin, no problem. It's a worry isn't it? Good luck with your ds! I really hope that in a few years we'll look back and wonder why we were worried.

[claig]

Why does he have private lessons with the SENCO? Is it for reading? Did he work hard for the other SENCO?

[MollieO]

His old SENCO caught me at school the other morning to say how much she misses teaching ds and how utterly lovely he is. He can be a real charmer but that hasn't worked on the current one at all. In fact it has probably worked against him.

[MollieO]

He has private lessons because of the assessment he had that showed he has visual sequential memory problems. From what I understand that can affect concentration, spelling and reading. He has extra help to develop his memory skills which includes spelling and reading help.

He was 7 weeks prem and the cons paed thinks this may be why he has memory problems (he was very ill when he was born).

[claig]

As other posters have said, maybe he does find it hard to do some of these tasks like spelling and reading, and prefers not to try, because as he says, if he tries and does it, then he will only be given more of it?

Some dyslexic children do sometimes start to be disruptive as a cover for the difficulties that they have with reading.

[mutable]

Why does he need to develop memory skills, when earlier you said he learns his lines for plays after 1 reading?
Something else is going on here.

He sounds super-bright, as in gifted. He is completely right when he says 'oh, if I do my work, they'll just give me more'; it sounds as though school is not actually stretching him.

I have no experience of this, but I hope you find some resolution.

[MollieO]

sarahfreck suggested it. Definitely not PDA where ds is concerned. It is school specific. I don't have the same issues with non-school stuff so I don't think it can be PDA. Of course an Ed Psych would confirm one way or the other.

Old SENCO had no problem with his behaviour and said he was making good progress when I saw her at the summer term parents' evening. She seemed to really like him. He can have that effect on some people. His nursery teacher cried when he left!

[tethersend]

Sorry to intrude but... you are paying people to tell you you are a bad parent?



Have I got that right?

If the school have such deep concerns about your parenting and its negative effects on your son's emotional and behavioural development, then why on earth haven't they informed Social Services, as they are duty bound to do?

It would appear that the school are worse than ineffectual- they are not even supporting you, merely blaming. I suspect that they have no idea how to handle your son.

Getting him seen by a professional of which there seem to be precious few at the school, is the place to start.

[MollieO]

I'm surprised he can learn lines easily when he does appear to struggle to concentrate in school. I guess it is about maintaining or sparking his interest. I asked him if he knew his lines at the weekend and he recited the entire piece (only about 20 lines but more than I could have done - he hasn't looked at his lines in between classes). He was tested in January so I wonder how he would do now if he had the same test again.

I really don't think he is especially bright and certainly not gifted (unless you include golf!!). There are plenty of others in his class who academically are streets ahead of him and there are ones who are behind him. I think average is about right and that is fine. I don't know what his potential is. The SENCO really thinks he is too young to be assessed by an Ed Psych but I do think it would be interesting to see if it throws up anything we are missing.

[MollieO]

tethersend, lol yes I am paying!! You sound like my mother!

[IndigoBell]

WTF does the SENCO think an Ed Psych does? Too young to be assessed....

She is talking absolute rubbish.

[MollieO]

They are quick to refer to an Ed Psych for behavourial issues that disrupt the class. From what I understand ds isn't disruptive in class and I guess being disruptive in choir is sufficiently concerning for a referral!

The reluctance does seem odd as it isn't as if they have to pay for it out of school funds.

[claig]

What do the school do when he refuses to do his work? I would have thought that his refusal could lead to disruption in the class, if other children start to copy him and also refuse to work. It sets a precedent that could spread.

[mutable]

too young?
ed psychs work with children far younger than your ds.

[tethersend]

The school need to make up their mind. Either he is so disruptive that they are concerned about your parenting in which case they need to call SS and refer him to an EP, or he is fine at school, in which case there is no reason to call your parenting into question.

This does not sound like a good school for your DS.

[MollieO]

He gets kept in at break time to complete it. I think that most of the rest of the class are keen on their playtime so don't want to miss it.

I think the reluctance to refer is because he is making progress at school and I suppose they think his attitude to work can be changed. I feel like videoing his meltdowns at home over school work and emailing it to his teacher. I do think they think I don't make any effort to get him to do his homework or over dramatise what happens when I try.

[SantasMooningArse]

Hi Mollie (tis Peachy)


'It's pretty much standard to do so. For example when I finally managed to get my son referred to a psychologist because he was hearing voices in his head - the psychologist sent out a letter saying that before she saw him I needed to attend a parenting course!!!!!!!'

mine too; only joke was that, as they well knew, I used to help teach the farking parenting course!

Anyway.


He's not too young for assessment Moll, in fact we know that early intervention is always the best. But SENCO's are rarely (to be frank) very great, and that may be more so in a private whe (some are, I;ve met one or two but tehn I meet a lot)re SEN isn;t widely variable or common- many disorders of learning or concentration are rare after all, and a child with one might not have got half as far as your ds.

A lot of his behaviours match ds1; he won;t do anything to please anyone else, doesn't do homework (many kids won't, to do with transtion between settings- schoolwork for school etc)but excels at his own interests and always ahs time and energy for them. he has Aspergers and quite alot of kids are not picked up with that until after 6, the ARC (autism research centre) has some screening tools if you think there's any chance at all but tehre's no way of knowing from anything on here- just spotted a few similarities.

Personally I would focus on building the link between you and your ds and hope the rest would fall into palce- being constantlypalced in a situation where you need to be banning everything is ahrd on you both and becomes a challenge to him not to break. I can see how that happens though- goodness knows I am there so often! Pasta jar works a little better but nah, not much at all. I tend to do the you-get-the-fallout approach (he can avoid homework / go in without glasses etc but whatever fallout emerges he hs to deal with and he won;t get any sympathy from me)

Good luck Mollie.

[MollieO]

tethersend are you sure you're not my mother? If she had a computer and knew how to access the internet I'd be certain that you are her!!

She thinks I should move schools and get an au pair with the money I'll save in fees (we don't have a spare bedroom so not sure where the au pair would sleep!).

[SantasMooningArse]

The lines thing is a flag to SEN as well- I have some myself and I once knew all the lines in a west end production after seeing the play once.

It's a great skill; has seen me through a fair few exams and tests (and arguments too, never knowingly short of a word perfect quote from an adversary )


SEn doesn;t have to eman any lack in IQ or whatever, justa different processing method and I would honestly say, as someone with a bit of knowledge, that he would benefit from a full Ed Psych appointment (or clinical psych with a specialism) becuase he seems to be being penalised on all corners and must feel rather disliked atm.

[tethersend]

If the school's strategy is to keep him in at breaktimes, it's hardly engendering a love of learning is it? It's completely counter-productive.

You need to ask them what other strategies they have tried. It will be the EP's first question.

(Your mum sounds great BTW )

[Quattrocento]

Mollie, can I ask if your DS is in a mixed school or a boys' school

I ask because I'm truly truly grateful that DS is in a boys' school with a highly enthusiastic Head full of zeal to teach boys in a way that is appropriate to boys.

See boys are generally a bit useless at this sort of age. Whereas DD would be challenging herself and trying to do the most super piece of homework EVER, DS will just do a lazy scrawl and hand it in (and then be disappointed if he didn't get housepoints for his "effort")

One of the key differences between DD's school and DS's school is that DS has hardly any homework. Boys don't respond to it particularly well (apparently). It's all about capturing their imaginations. It really has worked for DS.

And this isn't a hippy Steiner sort of place. It's academically selective and full of bright boys. It's just that young boys aren't terribly capable at that age.

By the way, we've never met but not for one minute do I believe that you need counselling

[MollieO]

Thanks Peachy - love the festive name!!

I think if one thing is now clear it is to get an Ed Psych referral. I told the SENCO today that I'd need her to do a letter to my GP. She said she was happy to do it today but I suggested waiting to give the two week homework trial she had suggested a go (I thought it would seem pretty dismissive of me not to give it a go even though I doubt it will work).

The community paed he saw last year thought ds may have Aspergers but the cons paed reviewed the assessment and concluded that he didn't. I always thought that Aspies lacked social skills so since ds is hugely sociable I suppose I dismissed that as a possibility.

I know on another thread ages ago you mentioned a voluntary place in Somerset where he could be assessed. At least I think it was you but I can't for the life of me remember what it was called.

I don't like banning everything either. It makes for a miserable time for both of us and really doesn't seem to have an effect. If I switched completely to the fall out approach ds would be attending school daily in his pyjamas.