First visit to new school friend's house, and it was filthy...

[KimOrAggie]

I've name changed to post this. DD will be starting school in Sept. Didn't get any of our choices and so she will be going to a school which has a pretty crap reputation. After visits and talking to lovely teachers, feeling reassured about teaching and the school itself, but still not comfortable with it.

I admit this is being snobby, but this is mainly because it's on an estate and the families there are not from the same sort of professional background as DD is used to with the friends she has chosen at nursery and her NCT friends (all of whom are going to different schools). Trying to keep open mind and not be judgemental. Met nice mum whose son is starting in the same class, invited us for lunch today. V kind, DD excited to be getting to know one face at least.

Still feeling distressed as HER HOUSE IS FILTHY. I'm not talking about it being cluttered or untidy (like our place) or having too much kids stuff in a small house (like ours) or a few crumbs or smears or dust (like ours). I'm talking, quite literally, the level of filth that I have never seen in real life before. I honestly did not think anyone lived like that outside a C4 documentary. It really was the before shots in 'How Clean is your house', no kidding. DD got upset about using the loo because it was clearly dirty and had 'brown water' in it. Every surface covered in stuff, and very, very deep grime, like no surface or bit of floor or kitchen appliance or basin or loo had ever been wiped down, much less scrubbed. I hated having lunch there and hated my kids being there. Kids played nicely, perfectly bright family with nice manners, but quite a psychotic level of filth.

I just had to get that off my chest. It's made me more nervous about DD starting school and I'm having difficulty separating one family's living habits from my snobbery about the school in general. Please slap wrists or reassure or suggest ways of handling this. I never want to go to that house again, but this mum seems keen on us all being good friends. Aaargh!

[usualsuspect]

Not all council tenants are unemployed thats the most stupid thing I've read on this thread yet... jeez

[foureleven]

Really Lougle..? I admit I dont know much about housing but why would someone who was employed with a decent income have their house paid for by the council?

[usualsuspect]

foureleven are you really that ignorant ..and people pay who work pay rent ffs

[teameric]

foureleven I live in a council flat, my DH works (he is an events organiser) and I work part time as a TA, are you saying we don't desrve our flat?

[foureleven]

Sorry usualsuspect I dont know anything about how council housing works, I thought you had your house paid for by the council if you didnt have income to pay rent..

If they work and pay rent then its not a council house then is it??? Im confused.

[foureleven]

God Ive obvously inadvertantly hijacked! I really know nothing about this. i thought if you had no income, or incredibly low income then the council paid for some or all of your housing. If Im wrong I am sorry. i will piss off to to Gov.uk to syudy the ins and outs of every benefits policy so as not to offend again.

[teameric]

Yes its a council house but you still have to pay rent to the council.

[teameric]

you only get your rent paid if you are on benefits

[foureleven]

Oh, ok having read pixieonaleaf's comment I think we are talking about different things when we say 'council house' when i say 'council house' I mean one that is being lived in with rent being paid by the council. Not a house that is owned by the coucil and lived in by working people who pay the council rent to live in it.

[Hassled]

KimorAggie - as others have pointed out, cleanliness isn't related to class at all, so while I can quite understand being freaked out by a house that filthy, it's a bit of a leap to assume the other children at the school will also live in squalor. You could just as easily have come across a house like that from a public school parent, or anyone really.

If you like the mother, then keep on seeing her - just not at her house.

[preghead]

I too was in your position with not getting any of our 3 choices OP and I know exactly what you are going through - it is not about being snobby it is about not fitting in (or the worry of it). If you are happy with the quality of the teaching then I am sure it will all be fine - we weren't. I think all the posters are right about separating the filth from the school but I understand your concerns, generally. IME you will ultimately have to do what you think is best for your child, this is your prime duty after all, and put up with being called a snob if that is how it pans out - this is what happenned to me and I don't regret my decisions for a moment. The other thing to remember is that there is a lot of knee-jerk inverse snobbery out there and you just have to ignore it - after all, there are planty of people out there who wouldn't even have considered applying to a state school for their children so we are hardly snobs compared to people like that!

[forehead]

Claretlover, The OP is entitled to send her dc to whatever school she pleases. It is just seems that she has ALREADY decided that the people on the council estate are beneath her and this is clouding her judgement.
If she doesn't like the school, then that's fine, however i think it is rather cruel of the OP to use the fact that this lady has a filthy house as a reason for not liking the school, particularly since this lady was kind enough to invite her into her home.

[colditz]

If you are on a very low or no income, the council does pay for some or all of your housing. However, if you are in a council or housing authority house, it does not automatically follow that the council are paying your rent for you. Conversely, you can be in privately rented accomodation of quite a high standard, and if you have little or no income, the council will meeyt some or all of your rent.

My rent is £350 a month, which is only £50 per month below market rent in this area for this type of house. I am not unemployed and I do pay it myself.

[seeker]

"i say 'council house' I mean one that is being lived in with rent being paid by the council."

You do realize that this is a definition used by you and you alone?

[mrz]

foureleven how does your home compare to this council house?

[mrz]

or this one

[Fiddledee]

Right are you on the waiting list of the other schools, have you phoned the school or prepared to phone them on the first day of term to see if they have a place? Often the first a school knows about a child not taking up a place is not turning up on the first day.

This is not about filth, this is about your child not going to a school that you feel comfortable with. Don't send your child there. Home school, leave in pre-school for a term, pay private until you get a school place of your prefered school.

[Lougle]

Okay, okay, I see that you genuinely didn't know foureleven

Swift hijack, then conversation can return to the OP's dilemma

Council housing is, as the name implies, any housing owned and kept by the Local Authority. Gnereally, there is a misconception that you have to be very poor or unemployed to be allocated a council house. This isn't true. Anyone can join the 'list', but some LAs operate a 'points' system, and if you are not in a vulnerable group your points are unlikely to reach the levels needed for a council house. Points are allocated to a tarrif, and the cumulative total determines your place on the list.

Other LAs use a 'bidding' system, whereby potential tenants are allocated a band from 1-4, where 1 is 'emergency' i.e. top and 4 is 'no priority', band 4 would be a family who are currently adequately housed and can afford their rent, for example. A property comes onto the bidding list, and people bid for it. Band 1 trumps 2, band 2 trumps 3, band 3 trumps 4. If there are more than one band 1 bidders, the house is allocated on length of time on the list. In theory, it is fairer, because only people who want to live in that location, etc., will bid. In theory, a band 4 person could get lucky, if no band 1,2 or 3 people bid. The reality is that housing stock is in such short supply that every house is bid for by hundreds of people.

Housing benefit is payable to anyone with an income below the 'applicable amount' for their particular family make-up and circumstances. Each applicant is awarded an amount that they are expected to live on. This will be made up of a series of elements. I.e. Lone Parent or Couple (same amount either way) + x children + Disregard of earnings + Disability premium ... and so on.

Then all of the applicant's income is totalled. They compare the income to the applicable amount, calculate 65% of the difference, and that figure is their 'excess'.

The LAs set a local housing allowance for each Broad Rental Market Area, which is the cap for rental of that particular size of house.

The Housing benefit you get is the LHA-the 'excess'.

Council houses are generally cheaper than private rentals, because councils don't make a profit on them. They charge capital value plus maintenance costs. So, generally, if you are on a low wage, you will get very much less HB than if you were in private rental, because you would have a much lower rent.

So, although the likelihood is that a fair proportion of families in council housing may be without a waged income, it is no less so than the private sector.

[foureleven]

seeker I do now haha! No seriously, I realise that the council owns a lot of properties including the kinds of houses kindly linked to by mrz.. thanks for that.

But surely when we're talking about opinions like OPs of how people in council houses treat their homes we are talking about people whos rent is paid for by the council.. I think its a bit pedantic to correrct my terminology. We all know thats what she meant and so when I resonded using the term 'council' house I meant people who have their rent paid by the council.. and that is what I class as a council tennant in these conversations... I dont know the ins and outs of the housing system though and I make no apologise for that. Ive never used it. But I have known many people who are unemployed and live in council houses. They have always been clean and tidy and I have assumed its because they have more time as they dont work..

[foureleven]

Thanks Lougle.. Every days a school day hey!

[forehead]

Scuse me while i join Riven. .