boys-aged-three-must-work-more

[mrz]

www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/boys-aged-three-must-work-more-1852087.html

I read this and it made me so angry. Though I did think - hope - that Toby Young's response MUST be a joke. Isn't it?

edam, I have had a big crush on Michael Marmot for a long time. His work is so important, and so frequently misunderstood.

He's wonderful. Very impressive. I hope those in power listen to him. Slim chance if the Tories get in, though. Unfairness and poverty aren't really problems for them.

OH FFS! A couple of months ago I got thrown into a panic by the school referring DS to the SENCO and occupational therapy because he wasn't interested in writing and mark-making and had a fine motor skills issue - he is now writing Mummy, Daddy, Car and his name and drew a recognisable train a couple of days ago. He is 5 and everything I have heard read and googled suggests that this is a simpley physical thinkg of him not being ready as fast as some other kids and WITHIN NORMAL DEVELOPMENT.
Trying to accellerate kids development will do them a lot of harm. As will this witless gender obsession that takes no account of children's individuality.
VG point from Edam, too - the way that boys alleged 'falling behind' somehow leads to them getting the top jobs and earning more than women.

like where in Europe?

although state education generally starts later, so many kids go to kindergarten pre-schools it is simply nonsense to suggest they start school later.

why do people have a problem with small children learning to write? and read?

these things can be taught succesfully in a playful low-pressure environment. to both girls and boys (who both need to run around, and who both learn best through physical association)

there is always that deep underlying fear of education in some people due to having bad memories of learning these things at the point of the ruler, which closes their minds to the possibiliy that learning is something all kids can enjoy.

This just makes me so I can't even post anything constructive.

Lynette, I feel the same..... except to say that it appears the government has failed to absorb anything about the basics of education.

the idea that being given more encouragement in things you are bad at will discourage you is a novel one too.

quite often you hear 'if we pushed him more, he'd have been disheartened' which is simply improvable. you can't know what would have happened.

for instnce, my little bruv was bad at writing aged 5. then aged 6. then still bad at writing aged seven, mum got him extra help, more practice outside school. he got better (he was later statemented as profoundly dyspraxic) and attained the standard he writes with today (that of a ten year old, very messy but sufficiently fast to keep up) now, without intervention, he probably could have got there in the end, but after a few more years of being greatly slower than his peers.

the kindi i worked in generally got 3-4 year olds to write their own names, and simple words (after a year of full time school). They didn't speak english as a first language though - so why do we make out english kids can't do that well? why do we think encouraging them to learn this is 'child abuse'????

those little kiddies seemed happy enough to me.

I read that too. I didn't think the suggestions were too bad though.

However I suspect that Toby Young is a loon. How the fuck can a three year old be 'behind'? They are babies. Who cares if a boy is slower to read than a girl? I don't.

By OrmIrian Thu 31-Dec-09 11:36:53
I read that too. I didn't think the suggestions were too bad though.

I would imagine most early years practitioners are laughing at the suggestions which aren't rocket science and certainly not new. Grandmothers and eggs comes to mind.

EdgarAleNPie no one is making out that English children can't do it. Most can and do but some (quite often boys but not always) take longer and haven't quite mastered it by the age of 4+ when they are being judged! Usually by the age of 11+ they have not only caught up but passed many of the early starters.

English children can do it, of course, but mass panic on the part of government because some children can't write their first novel at the end of reception is rather ridiculous.

What is it with Sue 'balanced literacy' Palmer and Richard 'Steiner teacher' House? They seem joined at the hip; one is never wheeled out for a quote without the other commenting too.

Edgar - they start a year later in Scotland. We do not have children who are 4yrs and 1 month starting school. They go to nursery instead.

This is silly. it's like setting a target that all 6 month old babies ought to be able to tie their own shoelaces then worrying when half of them can't.

Or saying that men have not got big enough breasts. Something should be done, clearly.

maverick there's another thread currently running elsewhere on mumsnet about EYFS they appear there too

Ah i obviously have a genius on my hands . DS (3.7) has been able to write his own name for a while now and can write Mummy and some other letters on his own.

I'm sure there are other things he can't do though that his peers can, like putting socks on. they'll get there in the end. they're 3 ffs.

Bad news choufleur

to achieve all the early learning goals for writing
The child writes his or her first name, as well as some other words. These may be
key words that are important to him or her, such as ?mum?, ?dad?, ?cat? and perhaps the names of other familymembers.

The child?s writing consists of recognisable letters.
When assessing this scale point, the practitioner should observe the child
while engaged in a writing activity, to establish that the child is holding a pencil
effectively and that letters are generally correctly formed. ( to achieve this the child must also achieve PD 5 When taking part in selfinitiated or adult-directed
activities, the child selects tools and resources independently from within the provision to support or extend an idea or project.)

The child attempts writing for a range of purposes, for example writing a shopping
list, a doctor?s prescription, instructions for playing a game or a letter to Father
Christmas. They may also write stories. Features of different forms such as lists
or labels, are evident

The child?s efforts are phonetically plausible
when he or she writes simple regular words and
particularly when he or she attempts to write more complex words.

The child attempts to write simple sentences,
sometimes using capital letters and full stops.

at 3!!!! ???????????????

I still think writing his name and mummy is brilliant.

chofleur, no that's not at 3, it's at 5. At the end of the reception year.

choufleur I think writing his name for mummy is brilliant too

Review of Sue P's latest book '21st Century Boys: How Modern Life is driving them off the rails and how we can get them back on track'

www.spiked-online.com/index.php/site/reviewofbooks_article/7086/

The Government research into the so-called "nappy curriculum", which covers children in reception classes, found boys are falling behind girls in their educational development before they start primary school.

The widest gaps between the sexes were in writing but girls also perform better in using their imagination in art, design and story telling.

In comparison, boys are better at building and constructing and learning how simple, everyday technology works.

The statistics, published by the Department for Children, Schools and Families (DCSF), showed how many five-year-olds were reaching specific early learning "goals" in the Early Years Foundation Stage,

The results were based on a sample of 230,000 children aged five in England (around 42 per cent of the total) at the end of the "foundation stage" of their education last year.

It found three in 10 boys have trouble reciting the alphabet, while nearly one in five cannot count to 10, compared with only 23 per cent and 15 per cent respectively among girls.

While three in four girls (74 per cent ) could write a simple shopping list, or a letter to Santa, only half of boys (54 per cent) could do so at the same age.

The results, also showed almost eight in 10 girls could hold a pencil by the age of five, compared to about six in 10 boys.

The study was taken before the Early Years Foundation Stage (EYFS) became compulsory last September.

Having read the article in the OP, I am confused at where it mentions that 'boys have to work' as states in the title of the article.
It states that boys need encouragement to use mark-making resources and settings will be encouraged to place mark-making equipment in other areas such as the role-play area ( Alth
ough, we have been doing this already)
Children do not make a distinction between 'work' and 'play'. This is where the problem lies, with the adult's attitude. The EYFS is a play-based curriculum. Children are learning as they play.
Recently, a friend complained that her 5 year old in reception had been having a hard time at school. The teacher had said he needs to realise that he is not at school to play. he is at school to work.
I think the teacher is wrong, play is children's work. This is a perfect example of how inappropriate teaching methods are putting children off learning. And it happens at an early age. This particular teacher has a lot of experience of teaching, but is new to reception. I hope she realises soon the damage that she is potentially doing.

Sorry purepurple this thread has gone in a totally different direction to what I expected.
What I expected was lots of teachers and parents to say was

"Well that's what happens in nursery now!"

My point is that the government is going to spend a considerable sum paying "experts" and publishers to tell teachers to do something that is very much everyday practice...

mrz, they should spend the money on paying a decent wage to the people who have to implement all the changes in policy and practice.
A lot of emphasis is being put on the early years, before school. I am a nursery nurse, working for peanuts, but I am expected to be starting these children on a life-long learning journey. I am perfectly able and willing to do this (unlike some who work in early years) just pay me what I deserve.
Sorry, rant over